3.4/168 + softs What should be my list? Forum

christinanc93 · Post by **christinanc93** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:51 pm

Currently, my list of applications is:
Berkeley
Northwestern (ED)
Georgetown
Cornell
George Washington University
University of Maryland

I figure I don't really have any chance at HYS, so I don't think I'm going to bother applying to those. Do I have a somewhat reasonable shot at any of the other T-14? Is UVA a better choice than Berkeley for my reach school? Should I include Vanderbilt? Is U of Maryland enough of a safety or should I add another? I want to get accepted to at least one of the schools on my list, and I want to keep my applications under $1000. I also want to practice in DC.

Softs: I've done a lot of volunteer work, internship with the DA, political activism, leadership position at work, study abroad - Semester at Sea, looking to do public interest, LGBT

deepseapartners · Post by **deepseapartners** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:16 pm

What are your softs? W/E?

Not sure EDing to Northwestern is your best goal if you want to minimize debt and also maximize DC employment chances.

Edit addition: UVA is far better to get into the DC market than any of your other listed schools, including Berkeley.

Mullens · Post by **Mullens** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:26 pm

deepseapartners wrote:What are your softs? W/E?

Not sure EDing to Northwestern is your best goal if you want to minimize debt and also maximize DC employment chances.

Edit addition: UVA is far better to get into the DC market than any of your other listed schools, including Berkeley.

ED Northwestern is probably the best way to minimize debt and give any chance at DC (though still not easy from NU)

christinanc93 · Post by **christinanc93** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:53 pm

deepseapartners wrote:What are your softs? W/E?

Not sure EDing to Northwestern is your best goal if you want to minimize debt and also maximize DC employment chances.

Edit addition: UVA is far better to get into the DC market than any of your other listed schools, including Berkeley.

I've done a lot of volunteer work. I have internship with the DA, and have engaged in a significant amount of political activism I currently hold a leadership position at work that includes designing and piloting a brand new program. I did study abroad with Semester at Sea, am looking to do public interest, and I identify as LGBT.

CanadianWolf · Post by **CanadianWolf** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:22 am

Would your ED be better used at GWU ? I think GWU still gives scholarships to ED admits. Of course, NU is a better law school regarding placement, but your chances for an ED acceptance with scholarship are much better at GWU.

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:34 am

Post removed.

christinanc93 · Post by **christinanc93** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:49 am

mornincounselor wrote:Why is Berkeley on your list? California is far from DC, and B weighs GPA over LSAT. UVA or Penn would be better, imo.

I think the NU ED is a stretch and I agree that if you would be willing to go to GWU at full ride then ED'ing there is a better choice.

Because I have no idea what I'm doing. Does GWU give full ride for ED?

benwyatt · Post by **benwyatt** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 1:08 am

Post removed.

christinanc93 · Post by **christinanc93** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:58 am

Do you have ANY idea how much conflicting information I've gotten? And how expensive it is just to apply? Plus, I know my numbers are not the greatest, and I do not want to waste money trying to get into places where I have absolutely no chance. mylsn is unreliable because it has too small of a sample size, the matcher means nothing because there's no definition of what exactly the chances are for the "target" schools, or the "safety", or the "reach." LSN is SLIGHTLY better, but the graphs don't really make things clear either, because there are too many dots of all colors around my numbers, on the majority of schools. My prelaw adviser is pretty much useless, and I'm doing this entirely on my own with nothing to go on but what the schools say about themselves which is not reliable because it exists to entice people to go there, and random crap on the internet, so my apologies for looking for advice.

TheSpanishMain · Post by **TheSpanishMain** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:02 pm

For what it's worth, I don't think your softs are the kind that typically move the needle in any discernible way. I would expect to perform more or less as MyLSN indicates.

lymenheimer · Post by **lymenheimer** » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:05 pm

christinanc93 wrote:Do you have ANY idea how much conflicting information I've gotten? And how expensive it is just to apply? Plus, I know my numbers are not the greatest, and I do not want to waste money trying to get into places where I have absolutely no chance. mylsn is unreliable because it has too small of a sample size, the matcher means nothing because there's no definition of what exactly the chances are for the "target" schools, or the "safety", or the "reach." LSN is SLIGHTLY better, but the graphs don't really make things clear either, because there are too many dots of all colors around my numbers, on the majority of schools. My prelaw adviser is pretty much useless, and I'm doing this entirely on my own with nothing to go on but what the schools say about themselves which is not reliable because it exists to entice people to go there, and random crap on the internet, so my apologies for looking for advice.

on myLSN do the admissions search not the admissions graph. That will hook you up.

christinanc93 · Post by **christinanc93** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 1:55 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:For what it's worth, I don't think your softs are the kind that typically move the needle in any discernible way. I would expect to perform more or less as MyLSN indicates.

My softs may not move it, but MyLSN is still not a particularly reliable source. For instance, if I wanted to go to Duke, according to MyLSN, with a gpa between 3.3-3.4 and an LSAT between 167-169 and apply between October - November, I have a 50% chance of admission.... which is based off a grand total of 4 people, out of 4,819 applicants. Given that only 227 people attend, we know that in general, my chances of attending at all would be about 5%. When we account for people who get accepted but do not attend, we know the actual acceptance rate is about 20%. Given that both GPA and LSAT would be below the median, that would not affect my application in any favorable way, so it certainly does not make sense that my chances would be greater than 20%, and I might expect them to be close to 10-15%. Likewise, I highly doubt I truly would have a 0% chance at Chicago on the basis of 5 people. Might not be MUCH higher than 0, but this small of a sample just cannot fully explain the trends.

oil · Post by **oil** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:00 pm

christinanc93 wrote:
TheSpanishMain wrote:For what it's worth, I don't think your softs are the kind that typically move the needle in any discernible way. I would expect to perform more or less as MyLSN indicates.
My softs may not move it, but MyLSN is still not a particularly reliable source. For instance, if I wanted to go to Duke, according to MyLSN, with a gpa between 3.3-3.4 and an LSAT between 167-169 and apply between October - November, I have a 50% chance of admission.... which is based off a grand total of 4 people, out of 4,819 applicants. Given that only 227 people attend, we know that in general, my chances of attending at all would be about 5%. When we account for people who get accepted but do not attend, we know the actual acceptance rate is about 20%. Given that both GPA and LSAT would be below the median, that would not affect my application in any favorable way, so it certainly does not make sense that my chances would be greater than 20%, and I might expect them to be close to 10-15%. Likewise, I highly doubt I truly would have a 0% chance at Chicago on the basis of 5 people. Might not be MUCH higher than 0, but this small of a sample just cannot fully explain the trends.

You do truly have a 0% chance at Chicago.

lymenheimer · Post by **lymenheimer** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:09 pm

christinanc93 wrote: My softs may not move it, but MyLSN is still not a particularly reliable source. For instance, if I wanted to go to Duke, according to MyLSN, with a gpa between 3.3-3.4 and an LSAT between 167-169 and apply between October - November, I have a 50% chance of admission.... which is based off a grand total of 4 people, out of 4,819 applicants. Given that only 227 people attend, we know that in general, my chances of attending at all would be about 5%. When we account for people who get accepted but do not attend, we know the actual acceptance rate is about 20%. Given that both GPA and LSAT would be below the median, that would not affect my application in any favorable way, so it certainly does not make sense that my chances would be greater than 20%, and I might expect them to be close to 10-15%. Likewise, I highly doubt I truly would have a 0% chance at Chicago on the basis of 5 people. Might not be MUCH higher than 0, but this small of a sample just cannot fully explain the trends.

Apply to schools that you want to go to that mylsn shows you have >0% chance of getting in. Easier than doing the number crunching and complaining that people here aren't helpful when all we can do is plug into mylsn as well...

emkay625 · Post by **emkay625** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:11 pm

First, as far as application costs go, try to get fee waivers for the schools. You can just email the admissions people and ask. I got several fee waivers this way. Just send something like:

Dear admissions staff,

My name is Ashley Applicant and I am interested in applying to [School's Name]. I was wondering if the school provides merit-based fee waivers? My score in the October LSAT was a 168.

Thank you so much for your time,
Ashley Applicant
LSAC #xxxxxxxxxxxxx

My guess is, especially from the schools where your LSAT is above median, you will get a waiver from about half of them.

Next, I think your list of schools should look like this:
UVA
Duke
Michigan
Northwestern
Cornell
Georgetown
UT
Vanderbilt
GWU

With the 168, I am fairly certain at least 2 of the lower T-14 will bite. I include UT and Venderbilt because I think they will be helpful for scholarship negotiation purposes. And I don't think you need a safety outside of GW.

emkay625 · Post by **emkay625** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:16 pm

I just realized - do you have at least 2 years of f/t work experience?

If not, I would take Northwestern off the list.

DrSpaceman · Post by **DrSpaceman** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:16 pm

I had almost identical numbers to you, and significantly better softs, and I got in everywhere that mylsn gave me better than 35% odds, and not a single school that it didn't. Having spend an incredibly unreasonable amount of time on these forums over the last year and a half, I will advise you that you're likely to hear anecdote after anecdote along those lines. Take that for what it's worth.

jfernandes16 · Post by **jfernandes16** » Thu Oct 29, 2015 1:56 pm

DrSpaceman wrote:I had almost identical numbers to you, and significantly better softs, and I got in everywhere that mylsn gave me better than 35% odds, and not a single school that it didn't. Having spend an incredibly unreasonable amount of time on these forums over the last year and a half, I will advise you that you're likely to hear anecdote after anecdote along those lines. Take that for what it's worth.

Which schools were those, if I may ask?

I have similar numbers (3.5, 167) but I am Mexican American URM.

I have essentially blanketed the t-14 (aside from stanford, yale, chicago)