171, 3.45 trying to sneak into top 5 Forum

[ak45]

171, 3.45 GPA, non-URM
softs: two year Fulbright in Eastern Europe, internship with a UN agency, Masters in a foreign language, and strong proficiency in a different foreign language

I would love to sneak into the top 5 so I am considering early decision to either Chicago or Columbia. I know the GPA might not be good enough, but I'm hoping early decision will help. Currently leaning toward Chicago (I seem to have a better chance numbers-wise), but Columbia's externships seem awesome and I think I would prefer to go there. With ED, is there any hope? Or would it just be smarter to apply ED to Chicago? Or am I unlikely to get into either of them?

[PoopNpants]

You know if you ED your going to probably on the hook for a shit ton of debt right?

[ak45]

Well i couldnt figure out a way to write that im a generally useless child of privilege without feeling like a jackass so i just wrote nothing.

but..yeah. money is not a factor.

[UpandDown97]

.

[ak45]

Well i couldnt figure out a way to write that im a generally useless child of privilege without feeling like a jackass so i just wrote nothing.

but..yeah. money is not a factor.

Then ED away. But you might not have to. I know someone for whom money was not an issue; she EDed to the school she was set on but came to regret it because those few months otherwise would have given time to consider lesser options. Just a thought.

Much appreciated. Did she get in? And do you think ED made a big difference in her application?

[PoopNpants]

[quote="ak45"]Well i couldnt figure out a way to write that im a generally useless child of privilege without feeling like a jackass so i just wrote nothing.

but..yeah. money is not a factor.[/quote


There's no shame in being blessed bro. As long as you aren't douchy about it i.e. bragging about driving a lexus as a high-schooler or someshit, I don't think its a real faux pas to say that money isn't an issue for you. Your #s are pretty good either way, but what I'm wondering is if ED acceptance is binding, can you apply ED to more than one school?

I think you should ED. good luck

EDIT: I actually read a post someone (maybe TLS) that described the potential boost ED candidates recieved from respective schools in the T14. The only school I think that gave a sizable large boost was, ironically, Northwestern.

[UpandDown97]

,

[PoopNpants]

Shit, my bad but at least I was right about NU part. I was surprised considering they attach that nice scholly with their ED, so I'm assuming they got alot more ED applicants than the other schools.

OP, it seems like EDing to Chi would be a good call tho

[ak45]

Oh wow-I had no idea about this report. Haven't been on TLS in a while I guess. Thanks a ton for sharing!

[ak45]

Shit, my bad but at least I was right about NU part. I was surprised considering they attach that nice scholly with their ED, so I'm assuming they got alot more ED applicants than the other schools.

OP, it seems like EDing to Chi would be a good call tho

No worries! And yeah, I'm pretty surprised too...

[landshoes]

the idea of well-off people spending 6 figures to go to law school always depresses me

[PoopNpants]

the idea of well-off people spending 6 figures to go to law school always depresses me

Nah, at least these people are striving for success and aiming high. I live in a town with numerous wealthy kids I grew up with, most of them work shit jobs and/or dropped out of college. literally just make it rain in the bar on the weekends and drive sick cars and live in sick cribs, even though they work basically minimum wage gigs.

[everton125]

171, 3.45 GPA, non-URM
softs: two year Fulbright in Eastern Europe, internship with a UN agency, Masters in a foreign language, and strong proficiency in a different foreign language

I would love to sneak into the top 5 so I am considering early decision to either Chicago or Columbia. I know the GPA might not be good enough, but I'm hoping early decision will help. Currently leaning toward Chicago (I seem to have a better chance numbers-wise), but Columbia's externships seem awesome and I think I would prefer to go there. With ED, is there any hope? Or would it just be smarter to apply ED to Chicago? Or am I unlikely to get into either of them?

Looking at MYLSN, you don't have a great chance at either right now and EDing will probably not make up for that fact. Also, I think your numbers are arguably better for Columbia than Chicago, particularly if you can get even just one more point on the LSAT. Chicago hates lower GPAs (median GPA 3.90), so much so that someone with a 173 LSAT and 3.65 GPA has only around a 10-20% of being admitted if they apply regular decision (as compared to an over 75% chance of being admitted into Columbia). Columbia, on the other hand, is much more willing to dip below 3.7 GPAs (see, as evidence of that fact, their median GPA of 3.69). If you get your LSAT up to a 173, you will be a very competitive applicant at Columbia.

TL/DR: You should retake for one to two more points on the LSAT so as to give you a realistic chance at getting into Columbia. You are likely out at Chicago unless you get a 175+ on the LSAT, given your lowerish GPA (though I suppose you never know what might happen if you ED, given Chicago's massive ED boost).

[Broncos15]

171, 3.45 GPA, non-URM
softs: two year Fulbright in Eastern Europe, internship with a UN agency, Masters in a foreign language, and strong proficiency in a different foreign language

I would love to sneak into the top 5 so I am considering early decision to either Chicago or Columbia. I know the GPA might not be good enough, but I'm hoping early decision will help. Currently leaning toward Chicago (I seem to have a better chance numbers-wise), but Columbia's externships seem awesome and I think I would prefer to go there. With ED, is there any hope? Or would it just be smarter to apply ED to Chicago? Or am I unlikely to get into either of them?

Looking at MYLSN, you don't have a great chance at either right now and EDing will probably not make up for that fact. Also, I think your numbers are arguably better for Columbia than Chicago, particularly if you can get even just one more point on the LSAT. Chicago hates lower GPAs (median GPA 3.90), so much so that someone with a 173 LSAT and 3.65 GPA has only around a 10-20% of being admitted if they apply regular decision (as compared to an over 75% chance of being admitted into Columbia). Columbia, on the other hand, is much more willing to dip below 3.7 GPAs (see, as evidence of that fact, their median GPA of 3.69). If you get your LSAT up to a 173, you will be a very competitive applicant at Columbia.

TL/DR: You should retake for one to two more points on the LSAT so as to give you a realistic chance at getting into Columbia. You are likely out at Chicago unless you get a 175+ on the LSAT, given your lowerish GPA (though I suppose you never know what might happen if you ED, given Chicago's massive ED boost).

+1 ....OP actually has a better chance at Colombia rather than Chicago.......Chicago is likely out unless you ED or get a 175+

Chicago is a big stickler on GPA's whereas Colombia is more forgiving on the GPA with a strong LSAT

Why not retake? OP has a chance at Colombia Regular Decision.....I would never apply ED to a school where you have a fighting chance of getting into

[chuckbass]

You'd probably also get a nice bump into Penn. If money isn't a factor, I don't see much of a prestige difference between Penn and the others.

[everton125]

You'd probably also get a nice bump into Penn. If money isn't a factor, I don't see much of a prestige difference between Penn and the others.

Not that your wrong about the ED bump, but at least applying regular decision, OP is almost as unlikely to get into Penn as UChicago. Penn has a similar propensity to admit individuals with high GPAs (Penn GPA Median = 3.89), and Penn also illogically yield protects against anyone with a plus 170 LSAT. On the other hand, OP already has a very good chance (+50%) at getting into NYU regular decision as NYU, like Columbia, is very GPA forgiving.

[03152016]

no such thing as top 5

i don't see the point in EDing to chi since op prefers cls
also, not that $ is an issue for op, but fwiw some 3.4x/17x have gotten $/$$ cls ed
given op's background, may want to apply for iilj, and anecdotally may help admission chances
tcr is to wait it out, visit the schools, talk to students/alumni, not commit this early in the game, esp since ed boost is so small in ls, especially at ccn level
or, if op really wants cls, tcr tcr is to see how the cycle plays out, retake the 171 if she misses cls, use the extra year to reconsider ls

[Tiago Splitter]

You'd probably also get a nice bump into Penn. If money isn't a factor, I don't see much of a prestige difference between Penn and the others.

Not that your wrong about the ED bump, but at least applying regular decision, OP is almost as unlikely to get into Penn as UChicago. Penn has a similar propensity to admit individuals with high GPAs (Penn GPA Median = 3.89), and Penn also illogically yield protects against anyone with a plus 170 LSAT. On the other hand, OP already has a very good chance (+50%) at getting into NYU regular decision as NYU, like Columbia, is very GPA forgiving.

You're focusing on overall performance rather than just ED results. Both Penn and Chicago will take splitters who ED. At Chicago it's been pretty much a splitter's only shot in recent years, and at Penn it's the best way to avoid those yield protects you are referring to.



OP I would not recommend EDing Chicago just because it's top 5. If that's the only reason you'd ED there, just apply RD everywhere and see what sticks.

[Broncos15]

You'd probably also get a nice bump into Penn. If money isn't a factor, I don't see much of a prestige difference between Penn and the others.

Not that your wrong about the ED bump, but at least applying regular decision, OP is almost as unlikely to get into Penn as UChicago. Penn has a similar propensity to admit individuals with high GPAs (Penn GPA Median = 3.89), and Penn also illogically yield protects against anyone with a plus 170 LSAT. On the other hand, OP already has a very good chance (+50%) at getting into NYU regular decision as NYU, like Columbia, is very GPA forgiving.

I don't see OP's problem with Penn being the low GPA but rather the high yield protection.......Penn is much more forgiving than Chicago on GPA even though their median is virtually the same.....bottom 25% for Penn is 3.52 while a bottom 25% GPA for Chicago is 3.8

The YP at Penn will make it difficult to get in

[appind]

the idea of well-off people spending 6 figures to go to law school always depresses me

yea how a privileged kid can neutralize all inequalities by making a bit of humorous comment about her well off background is imo a bit depressing too.

[landshoes]

the idea of well-off people spending 6 figures to go to law school always depresses me

yea how a privileged kid can neutralize all inequalities by making a bit of humorous comment about her well off background is imo a bit depressing too.

this makes no sense

my point (which tbh I don't think I should explain to you because you don't seem to have great reading comp) is that there are about a million ways to spend 300k that are more fun, interesting, fulfilling and/or useful than going to law school. at least for most people. some people snowflake it up and do some really awesome shit with that JD but a weird number go do big law and it's like watching someone burn down a nice house.

speaking of a nice house, that's something else you can buy for 300k. a nice house.

[appind]

this makes no sense

my point (which tbh I don't think I should explain to you because you don't seem to have great reading comp) is that there are about a million ways to spend 300k that are more fun, interesting, fulfilling and/or useful than going to law school. at least for most people. some people snowflake it up and do some really awesome shit with that JD but a weird number go do big law and it's like watching someone burn down a nice house.

speaking of a nice house, that's something else you can buy for 300k. a nice house.

you must be an idiot. you do not even understand the post, so much for your reading comp. perhaps you read sarcasm in it that never existed.

[landshoes]

this makes no sense

my point (which tbh I don't think I should explain to you because you don't seem to have great reading comp) is that there are about a million ways to spend 300k that are more fun, interesting, fulfilling and/or useful than going to law school. at least for most people. some people snowflake it up and do some really awesome shit with that JD but a weird number go do big law and it's like watching someone burn down a nice house.

speaking of a nice house, that's something else you can buy for 300k. a nice house.

you must be an idiot. you do not even understand the post, so much for your reading comp.

cool, have a great night

[landshoes]

ha ha yeah I did not know you were being sarcastic

I think it's because you said "her inequalities" and I thought you were going for a sort of "rich ppl have problems too" type of thing

anyway, people here love rich people for the most part

[ak45]

Thanks a ton for all the responses. I didn't know about iilj, seems like a very interesting opportunity. To clarify, I have zero interest in big law, and am currently torn between government and international law. Also, i grew up in both chicago and new york (though primarily chicago) and have ties in both places.

Now I thought this was the most prestige-obsessed profession around. Does being in the top 5 (or 6) really not make that much of a difference in terms of employment prospects, particularly in non-big law scenarios?