168/3.91/Military/non-URM Forum

[kevin0201]

LSAT: Cancel / 165 / Bombed June 2014 LSAT
GPA: 3.91 from an Ivy League school

Currently serving in the Army as an enlisted. Nothing too intense but expected to complete a competitive leadership course in August.
I'll have served for two years by the time I attend law school (which will count for work experience).

So the issue is, I panic when I see logic games. Weird, I know, but I can't help it. I got one more re-take left since my first test was in June 2012; so my understanding is, I'll be able to take again in October? However, preparing for the test while working full-time has been rough, and I don't know if raising my score is very likely. I do not wish to take another year off to study for the LSAT. I'm already behind of others by 2 years, due to my service.

Another issue I have is my parents. If I had a choice, I do not want to depend on them for law school, for various reasons. Schools that offer full tuition scholarship sound nice, but I know that my numbers aren't good enough to ED Northwestern, but good enough for EDing GWU.

Lower T-14 schools are an option, but loans will be a pain because I'm not an American citizen, and I will need a co-signer and a bunch of other things that aren't very fun to deal with.

Thanks for reading, and please comment freely about what I should do. ED a school that'll give me a good money but with worse job prospects? Or, go to a higher ranked school with a better chance for BigLaw, but pay a lot more fore it? And perhaps advice with LG?

Edit: June LSAT score for Asia just came out. 168 now.

[Ti Malice]

You have a Yale-worthy GPA. Whether you take on $300K of debt at a T14 (ED to UVA) or give up on the T14 for a scholarship at a regional school, I think it would be tragic either way when all that's standing between you and YHS is LG.

What exactly have you done in studying for LG? How many times have you taken the LSAT? Maybe you could benefit from a few sessions with a private tutor on LG -- or something. I just have to think it's too early for you to throw in the towel.

[Big Dog]

Thank you for your service.

Now get onto LG prep. Check out Manhattan's books, or Velocity. Don't waste that GPA when the LG are the easiest on which to improve. Improve 3+, and prosper.

Good luck.

[bjsesq]

Nothing too intense but expected to complete a competitive leadership course in August.

Ranger school or PLDC/BNCOC? This may actually make a difference.

(Assuming not ranger because you are posting here)

[kevin0201]

Nothing too intense but expected to complete a competitive leadership course in August.

Ranger school or PLDC/BNCOC? This may actually make a difference.

(Assuming not ranger because you are posting here)

WLC (Warrior Leader Course). Says WLC used to be PLDC? I start in August.

[bjsesq]

Nothing too intense but expected to complete a competitive leadership course in August.

Ranger school or PLDC/BNCOC? This may actually make a difference.

(Assuming not ranger because you are posting here)

WLC (Warrior Leader Course). Says WLC used to be PLDC? I start in August.

Ok. Ranger school would help in apps, PLDC not so much

[heythatslife]

Nothing too intense but expected to complete a competitive leadership course in August.

Ranger school or PLDC/BNCOC? This may actually make a difference.

(Assuming not ranger because you are posting here)

WLC (Warrior Leader Course). Says WLC used to be PLDC? I start in August.

Ok. Ranger school would help in apps, PLDC not so much

Hmmm do most adcoms actually appreciate how much of a big deal Ranger School is compared to other random courses?

[bjsesq]

Hmmm do most adcoms actually appreciate how much of a big deal Ranger School is compared to other random courses?

The title of Army Ranger helps, even if you aren't a batt boy. Mostly because people don't know the difference.

[TheSpanishMain]

Will you be Post 911 eligible? If so, consider EDing UVA for a full ride if you serve a full three years

[kevin0201]

Edit: 168!!! June score just came out (I'm stationed in Korea).

Now what?

[kevin0201]

Will you be Post 911 eligible? If so, consider EDing UVA for a full ride if you serve a full three years

Unfortunately, no...

[Mullens]

Don't ED GWU. I'll be interested to see where this year's LSAT medians fall because it will greatly impact your cycle but you should blanket the T14.

[kevin0201]

Don't ED GWU. I'll be interested to see where this year's LSAT medians fall because it will greatly impact your cycle but you should blanket the T14.

Do I have any chances with EDing NU? There's no one similar to my numbers on myLSN...

[twenty]

Typically you'd have very little chance of getting ED NU, but vets tend to outperform their numbers. Bummer you don't have the GI Bill though.

I'd ED to NU regardless and hope for the best.

[Ti Malice]

Don't ED GWU. I'll be interested to see where this year's LSAT medians fall because it will greatly impact your cycle but you should blanket the T14.

Do I have any chances with EDing NU? There's no one similar to my numbers on myLSN...

Yes, you definitely have a chance at NU via ED. Here are some folks with 168s and lower GPAs that were accepted with a full ride this cycle:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/MeowMix77
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/jaredcal
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Wildcats17

[kevin0201]

Don't ED GWU. I'll be interested to see where this year's LSAT medians fall because it will greatly impact your cycle but you should blanket the T14.

Do I have any chances with EDing NU? There's no one similar to my numbers on myLSN...

Yes, you definitely have a chance at NU via ED. Here are some folks with 168s and lower GPAs that were accepted with a full ride this cycle:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/MeowMix77
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/jaredcal
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Wildcats17

Yeah. I made the GPA range wider and found that 1 person out of 3 was accepted ED at NU.
Is the number small because I'm a reverse splitter?

[kevin0201]

I'm entertaining the idea of EDing NU and blanketing T14 and some more.

Yay or nay?

[twenty]

Blanket the T20. I'd be absolutely shocked if you didn't end up with at least one full ride.

[kevin0201]

Blanket the T20. I'd be absolutely shocked if you didn't end up with at least one full ride.

Thanks!

[daleearnhardt123]

The people in this thread have been wildly pessimistic. Knowing a good # of vets at my T10, I can confidently say that you should expect a LOT of money from many of the bottom T14. Your #s are good as is, and as a vet you're absolutely certain to out-perform them. I think you're better than even money at every school from the T6 on down, and an outside chance at H and S.

[kevin0201]

The people in this thread have been wildly pessimistic. Knowing a good # of vets at my T10, I can confidently say that you should expect a LOT of money from many of the bottom T14. Your #s are good as is, and as a vet you're absolutely certain to out-perform them. I think you're better than even money at every school from the T6 on down, and an outside chance at H and S.

That sounds too good to be true haha. Being a vet is a good soft, but my impression was that it would give me the boost of a half a point on LSAT.

[daleearnhardt123]

The people in this thread have been wildly pessimistic. Knowing a good # of vets at my T10, I can confidently say that you should expect a LOT of money from many of the bottom T14. Your #s are good as is, and as a vet you're absolutely certain to out-perform them. I think you're better than even money at every school from the T6 on down, and an outside chance at H and S.

That sounds too good to be true haha. Being a vet is a good soft, but my impression was that it would give me the boost of a half a point on LSAT.

Here's a vet with pretty much identical #s (shade worse than yours really): http://lawschoolnumbers.com/zbollenb

Unfortunately this person only applied to 3 schools and didn't post scholly amts. Nonetheless, I think this should demonstrate that EDing GW would be an awful choice.

[kevin0201]

The people in this thread have been wildly pessimistic. Knowing a good # of vets at my T10, I can confidently say that you should expect a LOT of money from many of the bottom T14. Your #s are good as is, and as a vet you're absolutely certain to out-perform them. I think you're better than even money at every school from the T6 on down, and an outside chance at H and S.

That sounds too good to be true haha. Being a vet is a good soft, but my impression was that it would give me the boost of a half a point on LSAT.

Here's a vet with pretty much identical #s (shade worse than yours really): http://lawschoolnumbers.com/zbollenb

Unfortunately this person only applied to 3 schools and didn't post scholly amts. Nonetheless, I think this should demonstrate that EDing GW would be an awful choice.

Yeah not EDing GWU no more. I was so sure I bombed the June LSAT.

Thanks for so much useful information! Are you a vet yourself?

[winstonsalem]

Here are some other profiles of vets,

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/r-t87

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/thedave29

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/twobitrye

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/goreman

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/bahama

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/matthewsean85

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/SchusterFlook

By the way, I know of vets with LSATs around 167-168 who made it into H and Y as non-URMs. You should apply to literally all of the top 14, including Y, as your military credentials will be worth much more than half a point on the LSAT.

[daleearnhardt123]

Here are some other profiles of vets,

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/r-t87

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/thedave29

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/twobitrye

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/goreman

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/bahama

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/matthewsean85

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/SchusterFlook

By the way, I know of vets with LSATs around 167-168 who made it into H and Y as non-URMs. You should apply to literally all of the top 14, including Y, as your military credentials will be worth much more than half a point on the LSAT.

Responding again just to echo this. Law schools love vets. Good work ethics and you all outperform your #s at OCI regularly, which is great for the school's employment stats. Not a vet myself, just happen to know a good #.