164 LSAT/ 3.61 GPA, Non-URM, chances at Cornell? Forum

[jcharnetsky]

Hello,
Basically, I really want to get into Cornell Law, but also do not want to be in $250,000 worth of debt when I graduate law school. I just took the June LSAT and got a 164. I had been averaging anywhere from a 163 to a 169 on my last 5 practice LSATs before the test. I have a 3.61 GPA from a highly ranked public university in New York.

Right now I am debating between re-taking the LSAT, or just going with the score I have. I'd love to go to Cornell, but also wouldn't want to go if I didn't get any scholarships whatsoever. I would prefer to stay in NY for law school, but don't want to go to school in the city, so besides Cornell I am seriously looking at Syracuse, Buffalo, and Albany. With the scores that I have now, I'm under the assumption that I would be able to get a decent amount of money from any of those schools (besides Cornell obviously). From the research I have done, it looks like Cornell Law would be a long-shot for me as of now, but not totally out of the question. I have some nice softs (internship at DA's office, working on getting two Psychology papers published in scholarly journals, and have been working 20+ hours a week throughout college while taking a minimum of 16 credits per semester).

With the decrease in law school applications, do you guys think I could have a decent shot at getting into Cornell and possibly getting some money with the scores that I have now, or should I try to study again for the September LSAT and hopefully do better this time around?

I would appreciate any suggestions you guys may have!

[mornincounselor]

Post removed.

[Lavitz]

Retake. You're very likely not even getting in with the score you have now. And even if you do get in, you definitely wouldn't get anything more than a token 7-10K/year at most, so you'd still be $250K in debt. Not worth it when you were PT'ing up to 169. The other schools would make sense only with a lot of money and if you actually wanted to practice small law in upstate NY. Not sure why you're completely writing off all NYC schools though.

[teachmehowtoraji]

Retake if you want a scholly. I got into Cornell off the waitlist with similar numbers (164/3.77) but got diddlysquat in terms of scholarship. I know people (anecdotally) who are rising 2Ls that got in with numbers closer to 167/3.6 that still only got token schollys (5k-10k).

[SteelPenguin]

It's not impossible that you'll get accepted, but it's VERY unlikely, and it will be ~sticker if you get in. Retake in September and December if necessary, and apply early next cycle (get it out of the way after September LSAT). A 167 would make you competitive, and a 168 would even further increase your chances of admission.

[Young Marino]

How okay are you with the idea of going to one of the lower tier schools you were looking at? Both Albany and Buffalo are solid regionals with decent scores on LST (around 60 percent). You'll probably get a nice scholly from both but you may be limited to practicing in those areas only. Although you probably won't get a biglaw salary coming out of school, you will probably get a small firm job paying $50k-$65k a year STARTING. I emphasize STARTING because your salary will, like in most cases, increase with experience and you likely won't have a ridiculous amount of debt with half the hours and stress that comes with working in biglaw. I'd go with that option but if you want to chase prestige you have no choice but to retake.

[BigZuck]

How okay are you with the idea of going to one of the lower tier schools you were looking at? Both Albany and Buffalo are solid regionals with decent scores on LST (around 60 percent). You'll probably get a nice scholly from both but you may be limited to practicing in those areas only. Although you probably won't get a biglaw salary coming out of school, you will probably get a small firm job paying $50k-$65k a year STARTING. I emphasize STARTING because your salary will, like in most cases, increase with experience and you likely won't have a ridiculous amount of debt with half the hours and stress that comes with working in biglaw. I'd go with that option but if you want to chase prestige you have no choice but to retake.

I feel like this kind of crap should be BOW-ban worthy

Dan, where are you pulling this from?

I looked at Buffalo-

Most recent class with salary data is 2012.
43% reported salaries (red flag- why did 57% not report? When people are pulling in the dough they generally have no problem reporting).
Of that 43%, the 50th percentile is 50K.
That means we know that 21.5% of the class (43/2) is making 50K+.

But you're saying that if you attend Buffalo you will probably (aka more likely than not) make 50K.

Looks like roughly 80% of the class is not making 50K. And yet the OP has a 50%+ chance?

No

Just stop

[BullShitWithBravado]

I know people at both SU and UB and they're either graduating jobless or have taken jobs outside the legal field. Even if you were able to get a legal job in Syracuse or Buffalo, you really need to consider whether you would want to stuck practicing there for the rest of your legal career.

If you want to be competitive for Cornell, you should retake. With a 164, you're almost there.