Chances for T14 - 3.7/165, excellent "softs" Forum

[Maximus68]

Chances for:

Columbia
NYU
Penn
Berkeley
Michigan
Cornell

-3.7 GPA / 165 highest LSAT
-Double major, wrote senior honors thesis, sharply rising GPA trend
-Excellent letters of rec, essay
-Excellent work experience (can't post too many details here, but trust me that it's at least in the top 5-10% of all applicants in terms of employer prestige, depth of responsibilities, "cool" factor).
-Planning on applying very early in cycle
-Non-URM

Not sure if this matters in admissions, but I won't really need financial aid--it'll be nice, but not a dealbreaker.

Thanks in advance!!

[NotASpecialSnowflake]

Retake. Unless you are out of retakes, you need to take the LSAT again. Your GPA is too high to waste with a 165.

That also won't get you into a t-14. I did apply late, but I had higher numbers than you in GPA and LSAT (which is what matters), and I didn't get accepted.

[Mullens]

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/



Retake.

[AlwaysPlayTheFox]

Very slim chance at T14

[ph14]

Your softs are not "excellent" for the purposes of law school admissions.

[Cicero76]

You have a decent shot at GULC and Cornell, but those softs aren't anywhere near good enough to overcome your bad LSAT at a T6 school.

[whereskyle]

study for the lsat more.

[jbagelboy]

A few more pts and you'll sweep. Its a lot easier now than it used to be, but the numbers are still crucial

[Power_of_Facing]

Retake -- if your employment soft really is as strong as you suggest (it probably is not, but maybe...), a few extra points to get closer to medians will mean more to you than the average student at places like Berk and, to a lesser extent, Penn.

[bombaysippin]

Person has 1 post and wrote "cool" factor....come on guise...

[Clyde Frog]

Your softs aren't out of this world. Work on your hards.




$$$$

[Maximus68]

Updating this, because I was pretty discouraged going into this process due to my numbers.

Admitted: Berkeley
WL: Columbia, Michigan, NW, Cornell
Denied: Harvard

Anything is possible in a down year. Every school has a different attitude towards hard numbers versus other factors. Don't 'deny' yourself before you even submit an application.

[swampman]

Updating this, because I was pretty discouraged going into this process due to my numbers.

Admitted: Berkeley
WL: Columbia, Michigan, NW, Cornell
Denied: Harvard

Anything is possible in a down year. Every school has a different attitude towards hard numbers versus other factors. Don't 'deny' yourself before you even submit an application.

Anything is possible, even paying $250k for Berkeley.

Decline the offer, retake, and reapply for $$.

[BigZuck]

Retake

[antiworldly]

Anything is possible in a down year. Every school has a different attitude towards hard numbers versus other factors. Don't 'deny' yourself before you even submit an application.

I think this is important advice for applicants with softs that will set them apart; apply widely, see who likes what you've got to offer. All it takes is someone going "hey, that applicant looks interesting" and you can outperform your numbers slightly. It's certainly worked well for me this cycle, gotten into a few programs I'm slightly below numerically because my softs put me over the edge. It costs a bit to blanket the T14 and see what sticks, but it'll pay off in the end.

[romothesavior]

Updating this, because I was pretty discouraged going into this process due to my numbers.

Admitted: Berkeley
WL: Columbia, Michigan, NW, Cornell
Denied: Harvard

Anything is possible in a down year. Every school has a different attitude towards hard numbers versus other factors. Don't 'deny' yourself before you even submit an application.

5 more points and you're looking at T14 with considerable money.

You're acting like yours is a success story that proved TLS wrong. It's not. Berkley at sticker is literally insane.

[Smoking Gunner]

Updating this, because I was pretty discouraged going into this process due to my numbers.

Admitted: Berkeley
WL: Columbia, Michigan, NW, Cornell
Denied: Harvard

Anything is possible in a down year. Every school has a different attitude towards hard numbers versus other factors. Don't 'deny' yourself before you even submit an application.

5 more points and you're looking at T14 with considerable money.

You're acting like yours is a success story that proved TLS wrong. It's not. Berkley at sticker is literally insane.

OP mentioned that financial aid isn't a concern for him, which I take to mean that he has rich parents, and while he'd like to make it cheaper for them if possible, he's still going to graduate debt free. If money isn't a concern, I think Berkeley is a pretty great outcome given his numbers.

Also, just based on context I'm assuming OP really means scholarships, not need-based financial aid.

[romothesavior]

That's like saying I don't mind overpaying for a house by $100k because I'm paying in cash rather than taking out a loan.

Sure, it's better to pay sticker with cash than relying on loans, but it's still a ton of money. Unless OP has truly maxed out his LSAT potential (and perhaps he has, I don't know), he is likely leaving a lot of money on the table.

[Smoking Gunner]

That's like saying I don't mind overpaying for a house by $100k because I'm paying in cash rather than taking out a loan.

Sure, it's better to pay sticker with cash than relying on loans, but it's still a ton of money. Unless OP has truly maxed out his LSAT potential (and perhaps he has, I don't know), he is likely leaving a lot of money on the table.

No, it's like saying you don't mind overpaying for a house because someone else is buying that house for you.

[Hikikomorist]

That's like saying I don't mind overpaying for a house by $100k because I'm paying in cash rather than taking out a loan.

Sure, it's better to pay sticker with cash than relying on loans, but it's still a ton of money. Unless OP has truly maxed out his LSAT potential (and perhaps he has, I don't know), he is likely leaving a lot of money on the table.

No, it's like saying you don't mind overpaying for a house because someone else is buying that house for you.

Some people view their parents' money as future funds to which they will someday have access. In that case, wouldn't it be very much like overpaying with your own money?

[Smoking Gunner]

That's like saying I don't mind overpaying for a house by $100k because I'm paying in cash rather than taking out a loan.

Sure, it's better to pay sticker with cash than relying on loans, but it's still a ton of money. Unless OP has truly maxed out his LSAT potential (and perhaps he has, I don't know), he is likely leaving a lot of money on the table.

No, it's like saying you don't mind overpaying for a house because someone else is buying that house for you.

Some people view their parents' money as future funds to which they will someday have access. In that case, wouldn't it be very much like overpaying with your own money?

I feel like if you're graduating from Berkeley you'll probably end up with a job where you can support yourself and don't need to be living off your parents money.

[rubberplant2020]

You have a decent chance at the lower T-14's (9-14) but do know you will not receive any money. I Do believe that you do stand a better chance because you noted that you have work experience. Most applicants do not. As for retaking, the evidence from LSAC's repeater data shows that most people who score at 165+ will most likely increase their score on a retake. So do understand most of us on TLS understand you not wanting to retake but do know that if you choose to it will most likely not be in vain.

http://www.lsac.org/docs/default-source ... erdata.pdf

[Hikikomorist]

That's like saying I don't mind overpaying for a house by $100k because I'm paying in cash rather than taking out a loan.

Sure, it's better to pay sticker with cash than relying on loans, but it's still a ton of money. Unless OP has truly maxed out his LSAT potential (and perhaps he has, I don't know), he is likely leaving a lot of money on the table.

No, it's like saying you don't mind overpaying for a house because someone else is buying that house for you.

Some people view their parents' money as future funds to which they will someday have access. In that case, wouldn't it be very much like overpaying with your own money?

I feel like if you're graduating from Berkeley you'll probably end up with a job where you can support yourself and don't need to be living off your parents money.

Sure, but I don't see how that matters in the context of rts' point. Unless you're saying that OP's financial success will result in his parents not leaving him their assets in the future.

[bjsesq]

I'm curious about OP's SUPER AMAZING work experience.

[RareExports]

Depends how "omg super cool" your work experience is, and also depends if LSAT takers (165+) goes down again next cycle. I could see Georgetown or Cornell, maybe Northwestern as a reach.