Considering Law School, do I even stand a chance? Forum

[RandomGuy01]

So over the past couple of weeks I have been milling around the idea of pursuing a career in Law, but I don't know if my resume is anywhere near competitive enough to secure admittance and sufficient financial aid to Law School. My primary concern is that I will be substantially outclassed by those whose intent it was to enter Law School before they even began undergrad.

So I would like to ask the gracious, and much better informed , people of this board what they think my odds are of securing admittance and substantial financial aid (≥80% Tuition) to any school ranked in the top 100.

Under Graduate:
---- From University Ranked 30th in Science in U.S
-- Double Majored + Minor:
- Molecular, Cellular and Developmental Biology
- Integrative Physiology
- Minor (Cert.) Neuroscience
-- GPA:
- Cumulative = 3.22
- Science/Math = 3.75 (Likely not something Law Schools will consider)
- Majors (Both) = 3.7
Note: My cumulative is so low because I got very sick my sophomore year and essentially wrote off all my non science classes. Junior and Senior years are almost exclusively A's.

Extracurricular:
- National Society Collegiate Scholars
- Victims Advocacy Volunteer Work
- A lot of volunteer work in High School, NHS etc. (Nothing I would consider outstanding or especially relevant)

LSAT:
I can definitely get, at absolute minimum, a 171 on the LSAT.

Work Exp:
Same part time job for about 2 years to help fund undergrad. (Working dog grooming shop)

Background:
Nothing especially exciting or unique.
I should also probably mention that I would be attending Law School with the intent to go into Public Interest Law, ideally Criminal Law.


So give me the cold hard truth, what are my chances?

Thanks for taking the time .

[CO2016YEAH]

Curious what makes you think you'll get a minimum of 171 on the LSAT. PTing can be indicative, but don't bank on a number until you've got it in hand.

Assuming you do get at a 171 or better, I predict you will be looking at close to a full ride at schools in the top 50. Your science background makes you more desirable, as law students with your major are in short supply. The upward trend on your GPA helps, too. Definitely write a GPA addendum.

Have you checked lawschoolpredictor.com, lawschoolnumbers.com, and the other one with the graph that someone from these boards compiled? (Sorry. Can't remember the last one off the top of my head.)

In any event, you should do well with offers.

What state are you in and approximately where in the country do you hope to attend/practice?

Edit: lawschoolpredictor has you at strong consider/admit from 21 on down. I suspect there will be full scholly offers in the mail from top 50 and probably big money towards the upper half of that.

[NapoleonXV]

Curious what makes you think you'll get a minimum of 171 on the LSAT. PTing can be indicative, but don't bank on a number until you've got it in hand.

Assuming you do get at a 171 or better, I predict you will be looking at close to a full ride at schools in the top 50. Your science background makes you more desirable, as law students with your major are in short supply. The upward trend on your GPA helps, too. Definitely write a GPA addendum.

Have you checked lawschoolpredictor.com, lawschoolnumbers.com, and the other one with the graph that someone from these boards compiled? (Sorry. Can't remember the last one off the top of my head.)

In any event, you should do well with offers.

What state are you in and approximately where in the country do you hope to attend/practice?

Edit: lawschoolpredictor has you at strong consider/admit from 21 on down. I suspect there will be full scholly offers in the mail from top 50 and probably big money towards the upper half of that.

mylsn.info

[heythatslife]

1. "Hard truth" is not to be had until you have an actual LSAT score.
2. Cumulative overall GPA is the only thing that counts. However, if illness was a factor then an addendum could help.
3. Lawschoolpredictor is not very helpful for potential splitters such as yourself. Mylsn.info is more legit, as Napoleon XV recommends.

[Clyde Frog]

Are you considering med school?

[SFrost]

I can definitely get, at absolute minimum, a 171 on the LSAT.

Very curious why you think this. 99% of people probably think the same thing (and don't make it).

171 is pretty average around these parts, but it's a superb score and usually takes a ton of prep.

[jbagelboy]

Come back with an LSAT score.

[TheSpanishMain]

Oh, come on. You really think you wouldn't be able to crack the Top 100? (That's a meaningless distinction, of course. It's not like 99th ranked law school is substantially better than the one ranked 101st.) Assuming you got a 171, which is a huge assumption, you'd have multiple options with the T14. There are schools within the Top 100 that basically take anyone with a pulse.

I am curious, though, why you're so sure you'll score in the 99th percentile on the LSAT. Go do that before you obsess about this too much.

[spleenworship]

Go to DO, PharmD, or DPM school. (Especially DO, since you get paid and treated exactly the same as an MD except for a few dickish purist MDs and the occasional patient).

Do not go to law school.

YWIA.

[RandomGuy01]

Curious what makes you think you'll get a minimum of 171 on the LSAT. PTing can be indicative, but don't bank on a number until you've got it in hand.

Assuming you do get at a 171 or better, I predict you will be looking at close to a full ride at schools in the top 50. Your science background makes you more desirable, as law students with your major are in short supply. The upward trend on your GPA helps, too. Definitely write a GPA addendum.

Have you checked lawschoolpredictor.com, lawschoolnumbers.com, and the other one with the graph that someone from these boards compiled? (Sorry. Can't remember the last one off the top of my head.)

In any event, you should do well with offers.

What state are you in and approximately where in the country do you hope to attend/practice?

Edit: lawschoolpredictor has you at strong consider/admit from 21 on down. I suspect there will be full scholly offers in the mail from top 50 and probably big money towards the upper half of that.

I have taken 5 practice tests and have scored above a 171 on all but my first attempt (166, 172, 173, 175, 173). The first one I took (the 166) I was in no way prepared for how little time you are given. They really push you hard time wise! I spent way too much time checking my answers and it led to rushing the later parts of the section or running out of time to complete them. After realizing how demanding the time constraints were in the first one I stopped checking my answers so thoroughly and this saved me enough time to finish each section at a constant pace.

While I know these practice test scores, at least for me, are not high enough to guarantee a 171 or higher on the real thing (damn nerves). These are only what I have done to see where I am at. I haven't begun actually studying the exam and attempting to improve my score or more importantly my consistency.

While I'm not at a point where I have a set of specific schools that I want to target, I would like to stay out of the south east for both school and practice. I am also somewhat interested in the University of Colorado.

Thanks for the great info! A full ride being within the realm of possibility with a 171 makes me much more interested and motivated to investigate a possible future at law school.

Are you considering med school?

I originally wanted to go into medicine or biotech research, but realized halfway through college that, while I am both interested in and have a knack for the natural sciences, my true drive is to protect people. While both medicine and biotech research do provide the opportunity for this to some extent, Law seems to provide it in a much more direct and rewarding way. Short Answer: Not anymore.

Go to DO, PharmD, or DPM school. (Especially DO, since you get paid and treated exactly the same as an MD except for a few dickish purist MDs and the occasional patient).

Do not go to law school.

YWIA.

Why would you advise against law school?

Oh, come on. You really think you wouldn't be able to crack the Top 100? (That's a meaningless distinction, of course. It's not like 99th ranked law school is substantially better than the one ranked 101st.) Assuming you got a 171, which is a huge assumption, you'd have multiple options with the T14. There are schools within the Top 100 that basically take anyone with a pulse.

I am curious, though, why you're so sure you'll score in the 99th percentile on the LSAT. Go do that before you obsess about this too much.

As I said in my original post, I am concerned with getting in AND receiving ≥80% Tuition in aid, not just getting in .

Come back with an LSAT score.

1. "Hard truth" is not to be had until you have an actual LSAT score.
2. Cumulative overall GPA is the only thing that counts. However, if illness was a factor then an addendum could help.
3. Lawschoolpredictor is not very helpful for potential splitters such as yourself. Mylsn.info is more legit, as Napoleon XV recommends.

I can definitely get, at absolute minimum, a 171 on the LSAT.

Very curious why you think this. 99% of people probably think the same thing (and don't make it).

171 is pretty average around these parts, but it's a superb score and usually takes a ton of prep.

A lot of people are addressing the probability of me being able to achieve a 171 and how an inaccurate assessment of my possible score affects any estimation of my chances. I realize this is an important consideration when addressing my original post and I should have been more specific:

What are my chances assuming I get at least a 171?
(I am redeeming my one hypothetical post voucher!)

While we are on the subject though, what kind of drop did everyone experience from PTs to the real thing?
and
What kind of consistency did you have on PTs and over how many?

I would also like to thank you guys for all the replies, this is a very active and helpful community!

[spleenworship]

1. Law school sucks.

2. Even at good schools a quarter of students don't get a job as a lawyer.

3. Even those who do get a job as a lawyer don't get the kind of job they want.

4. Even with a scholarship, you are likely in ruinous debt. While this is also true of medicine, their uniformly high salaries and 98% employment rate makes up for that.

5. About a third of law students realize they absolutely hate the law and the practice of law.


Do what you want, but that's why if I had to do it over again, I'd go DPM. And I LOVE the practice of law.


ETA: 3 point drop from PTs to actual score. 25 PTs, last 10 were all within 2 points of each other. 5 before that all within 3 points of each other.

[RandomGuy01]

1. Law school sucks.

2. Even at good schools a quarter of students don't get a job as a lawyer.

3. Even those who do get a job as a lawyer don't get the kind of job they want.

4. Even with a scholarship, you are likely in ruinous debt. While this is also true of medicine, their uniformly high salaries and 98% employment rate makes up for that.

5. About a third of law students realize they absolutely hate the law and the practice of law.


Do what you want, but that's why if I had to do it over again, I'd go DPM. And I LOVE the practice of law.


ETA: 3 point drop from PTs to actual score. 25 PTs, last 10 were all within 2 points of each other. 5 before that all within 3 points of each other.

Would you say it was primarily 1, 2, 3, or 4 that made you regret it?

[spleenworship]

Would you say it was primarily 1, 2, 3, or 4 that made you regret it?

1 - 4 combined. Then again I'm currently without a job after graduation in a week or two... so I'm telling you right now I'm pretty biased. I bet if I had a job on offer I might feel better. But you should also know I'm at a school with a 70% FTLE rate, top 20% of my class, on a journal, and a networking hustler and I still don't have a job. So it can happen to fricking anyone.

[SFrost]

Mediocre GPA + mediocre lsat = mediocre law school

A 171 is a superb score and would make you a shoe in for schools 15-30 (don't waste time on tier 2 if you can pull that kind of score).

Top 14 will hate you for your GPA

[North]

Top 14 will hate you for your GPA

A 3.2, with a 170+, is only really out of the running at HYS.

[TheWeeIceMon]

Go to DO, PharmD, or DPM school. (Especially DO, since you get paid and treated exactly the same as an MD except for a few dickish purist MDs and the occasional patient).

Do not go to law school.

YWIA.

OP should be a PA. 2 years and 100k+. PharmD is supersaturated to almost law levels. DPM has a residency crunch issue. DO is mostly solid, but it is a long, grueling road and you absolutely need to make sure that you love medicine to have a chance of not hating your life.

[spleenworship]

Yeah, but PA is harder to get into than DO school these days.

There are those new direct entry NP programs that take 3 years.

[TheWeeIceMon]

Yeah, but PA is harder to get into than DO school these days.

There are those new direct entry NP programs that take 3 years.

Yeah, PA is certainly not easy to get into. Although, I do believe that they are moving toward not requiring as many paid clinical hours, which is helpful.

Didn't know about the direct NP programs. Probably a good alternative to having to break into the brutal nursing market just to get into a program.

OP could also go for dentistry. Solid career if you can manage not to graduate school with 400k of debt.

[spleenworship]

For former paramedics like myself the lack of clinical requirements makes it harder, not easier. Lol. Fact is I'd be a PA already if clinical was emphasized over GPA.

[d cooper]

The Daily Beast - How Being a Doctor Became the Most Miserable Profession

[TheWeeIceMon]

The Daily Beast - How Being a Doctor Became the Most Miserable Profession

Yep, there is a ton of dissatisfaction in medicine right now. Surveys by Medscape show that less than 50% of physicians would choose to go into medicine again.

[cronos2546]

LSAT:
I can definitely get, at absolute minimum, a 171 on the LSAT.

Because...science. Just as an aside, you get definitely get, at an absolute minimum, a 120.

[Workingtitle]

If you're testing yourself honestly on those practice tests, and you study hard the 3-6 months before taking the actual LSAT, you definitely should be able to get a 171, and probably something better.

Law schools can be accepting of lower GPAs if they are coming from a hard science field. You should be able to get accepted to a lot of T-14, and should be able to get really good money from some schools 25-50.

Get a 171+, Apply broadly, write a GPA addendum and good personal statement, and my opinion is you should be pretty good to go.

[caryatis]

I'd say take the LSAT and apply---but don't commit to going to law school until you see the kind of acceptances/scholarships you can get. If you end up with worse results than you're hoping for, you want to be able to decide against law school without feeling like a failure--so, just check out your options.

BTW, my official LSAT score was exactly equal to my score on the last practice test. If you're using realistic time limits when you practice and don't have test anxiety, I see no reason why there should be a big difference between the two.