166/3.8 Forum

[greeksalad]

Hello,

I am new to these boards and found them while studying for the LSAT. Impressed by the sheer amount of advice and knowledge -- as well as pictures of lolcats, snark, etc. -- I thought I would take the plunge and give this board my first post, appropriately in this forum where blunt, candid advice seems to be a dime a dozen.

My Stats -
LSAT: 166 (on par with PTs, sections in my optimal order, and in a great testing center...I probably could not do better without selling my soul = no retake despite obvious benefits)
GPA: 3.8 (with senior year still coming up so there's a chance it can rise to ~3.85+)
Undergrad: non-HYP Ivy League
Major: History & Government, with some level of Latin honors for current honors thesis
Minor: Law and Society
Extra-curriculars: Strong
Work/Summer Internships: Strong (member of Congress, public interest law firm, non-profit research group, leading weekly magazine)
LOR: In the bag
URM: No
State of Residency: Florida

Schools I am currently considering, in order of difficulty:*

Hail Mary passes: Georgetown, Duke, UVA - ED**
From the Free Throw Line: GWU, W&M, Cornell, UPenn, Vanderbilt, Emory, WUSTL
Safeties: UF, FSU

I plan on taking 1-2 years off before attending law school, so I would be applying in either Fall 2012 or Fall 2013. I'm just getting a feel for what schools I will be competitive.

Thanks for your help.

*based on the TLS rankings of schools and the stats there
** Top choice

[TheZoid]

I could definitely be wrong about this, but why do you think Georgetown is a hail mary pass, while Cornell, Penn and Vandy are "from the free throw line." I'm not so sure you have a great chance at those schools, though you definitely have some chance. Not trying to be a jerk, but your LSAT is a few points off of where it probably needs to be to have a really strong shot at those schools. Great GPA, and that will probably get you in somewhere you'd like to go, but I'm sure a lot of people on this board will tell you to retake and get 2 or 3 extra points. As minimal as it sounds, it's a big item.

[greeksalad]

Good question -- I was just basing off those arbitrary categories from a quick glance at the TLS rankings page. Cornell and UPenn have their 25 percentile score at 166, whereas Georgetown is at 168.

Looking around, I do see that the rule of thumb is here better to "retake than settle." But honestly I hated every minute of studying and every minute of taking the test for real and there is little indication that I could do significantly better...perhaps even worse.

[philosoraptor]

GULC, Duke, UVa, Cornell, Penn, Vandy, and even WUSTL (which loves the LSATs, apparently) are all reaches. GW, Vandy and GULC are probably waitlists. I had similar numbers and was WLed at those plus Michigan.

Since you seem somewhat interested in the South, why not throw an app at Texas? Emory will toss you a chunk of change, but personally I'm glad I didn't take their offer.

You mentioned this, but definitely try to take at least a year off before law school.

[TheZoid]

GULC, Duke, UVa, Cornell, Penn, Vandy, and even WUSTL (which loves the LSATs, apparently) are all reaches. GW, Vandy and GULC are probably waitlists. I had similar numbers and was WLed at those plus Michigan.

Since you seem somewhat interested in the South, why not throw an app at Texas? Emory will toss you a chunk of change, but personally I'm glad I didn't take their offer.

You mentioned this, but definitely try to take at least a year off before law school.

Yea, I'd have to agree with you. Yes, you have a very nice GPA, but being at the 25% end of the median is not great if you are not a URM or don't have amazing softs. I think just about everyone hates studying for the LSATs, but it's worth it. If you didn't use the Powerscore bibles, you might want to check them out. I got a 158 on my first try (didn't study as hard as I should have), and a 168 with some dedication second time around. Reach schools become targets/safeties. It was a pretty miserable few months, but honestly, it's over now and I'm happy with the score, and it was worth it without a doubt. To be very blunt with you, I think you should suck it up, study hard and aim for low to mid 170's. Even if you miss that, a 168 or 9 would help you more than you might realize. Best of luck to you.

[greeksalad]

Any additional thoughts? Appreciate the input so far.

[Tiago Splitter]

Generally, the medians will give you a better idea of your chances than 25th and 75th percentiles.

I'd say UVA ED is worth a shot this cycle. 50-50 shot from a very limited sample in recent years.

http://search.lawschoolnumbers.com/user ... Cycle=1011

I included some higher LSATs in that search to motivate the re-take you need

[greeksalad]

Ba-bump?

[greeksalad]

...

[philosoraptor]

Um, what else are you looking for? We've told you what you need to know. All that matters is your numbers, so just go to LSP and play around there.

[j12]

Not trying to be a dick, but I think you have unrealistic expectations for your applications.
For the level of schools you're applying to I don't really see any softs that make you stand out. Your softs won't hurt you, but not enough to give you a boost. Unless you actually are a MOC and didn't just work for one.

I think you have a good shot at GW, Emory, W&M, and WUSTL. I had a friend apply to W&M and WUSTL w/ 165, 3.8 and he got $18K/year at W&M and $15K/year at WUSTL.
I think you'll be reject or WL at the rest.

I was a 167 my first take, with a similar GPA so I was in a pretty similar situation. You're at the point where every additional point can make a big difference on where you go. Get a 168 and you'll have serious $ from your current targets. 170 and you're T14. You have a couple years (since you said you are waiting) to bump you're score by basically 1 question per section. You can do that.

I used to think that everyone that scored in the 170s had to be super smart, but trust me that's not the case. It's a learn-able test, and you can drastically improve your options with a few more points. If you refuse, you'll still be in a better position than most people, just have realistic expectations.

[greeksalad]

Excellent honesty, thank you!

[ndirish2010]

OP should be fine at WUSTL, 3.8 GPA will carry. It's 3.6/166 that's a problem. As my reaches, I would apply to every school where 3.8 puts you above the median GPA. If you apply to Cornell super early you have a shot.