3.5/180 Forum

[Patriot1208]

What about Harvard UG, 176 LSAT, 3.56 (upward trend starting at 3.1x and ending at 3.8x by senior year), and 5 yrs good work experience? I would guess little to no chance at HYS, right?

very very slim, but ccn is likely.

[Na_Swatch]

What about Harvard UG, 176 LSAT, 3.56 (upward trend starting at 3.1x and ending at 3.8x by senior year), and 5 yrs good work experience? I would guess little to no chance at HYS, right?

very very slim, but ccn is likely.

Yeah chances are quite slim, but since your at the 75th percentile + H UG your right at the necessary border. Also the 5 yrs work experience mitigates the GPA somewhat... your closest comparison last cycle would be this person:

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/KuroiTsuki

However, his numbers both beat yours... so while you should definitely apply, I'd ballpark your chances at around 10~20% also (completely my own opinion, but one that I think is relatively accurate)

[willyj]

I don't think it would make a difference. You'll end up at CCN either way.

For God's Sake, what is CCN? I'm guessing HYP is Harvard Yale Princeton right?

[Patriot1208]

I don't think it would make a difference. You'll end up at CCN either way.

For God's Sake, what is CCN? I'm guessing HYP is Harvard Yale Princeton right?

HYP is harvard yale princeton, but there is no princeton law school. On this site you will see a lot of these acronyms as a way to describe the tiers.

HYS = Harvard, Yale, Stanford = the top 3 law schools
CCN = Columbia, Chicago, NYU = the next 3
PBMV = Penn, Berkeley, Michigan, Virginia = the next tier of law schools

Then after that its generally just refering to number rankings or the school itself.

[pinkzeppelin]

Obligatory: retake the LSAT.

[schrute2011]

Sorry to keep harping on this but is there any use to trying to pad up the GPA a little with outside courses like online/community college courses? I looked around a little and it didn't see if there was any overwhelming consensus that this would be hurtful but I'm not sure it this would be useful or not when applying to top law schools.

[hax123]

Sorry to keep harping on this but is there any use to trying to pad up the GPA a little with outside courses like online/community college courses? I looked around a little and it didn't see if there was any overwhelming consensus that this would be hurtful but I'm not sure it this would be useful or not when applying to top law schools.

Any college grade you earn before you complete your first bachelor's degree will be included in your LSDAS GPA calculation, so taking community classes before you graduate will help you.

[公诉人]

so OP exactly how many 180 asians from the south are there at Princeton -- that are rising seniors? Because I know of one. . .

Texas?

TYIA

[hypothalamus]

I'd like to believe OP has at least *some* chance at HLS...

I don't think it really makes sense to wait for the next admissions cycle. You can work hard this coming semester and send in that transcript before the end of the cycle, as an update on your grades. You probably won't take more than 2-3 courses second semester of senior year and you'll have a thesis to worry about.

I'm saying this because I've been going through the same deliberations: I'm a rising Princeton senior with about a 3.7 (no LSAT yet). Believe me when I say this, I've calculated every possible grade change that can happen throughout the next year.... it isn't much. For my current GPA and the number of classes I've taken, even only straight A's in the next few classes will barely raise my GPA. And we know that getting only *straight* A's at Princeton is not that easy. A few A-'s won't raise your GPA by much. My advice would be to calculate the potential rise in your GPA (staying realistic about the chance of getting the grades you include in the calculation) and then think very carefully whether such a change would be significant. That said, I think you should apply this cycle AND bust your ass this semester, so schools can see significantly improved grades for this semester. And don't forget your LSAT is incredible!

The mean figures for Princeton acceptees at HLS for 2008 are:

GPA: 3.79
LSAT: 172

(The mean GPA for Princeton applicants, however, was 3.54. Not too far from yours.)
As you can see, your GPA is still lower compared to the mean, but your LSAT is truly outstanding.

How much difference do people think there would be between a 3.5 and a 3.6 GPA, anyway? Don't they fall within the same "bracket?"

I hope this was helpful! It sucks that Harvard GPA is viewed more favorably, considering Princeton has grade deflation : ). Ah well.

(OP, PM me and we can bemoan the law school admissions process and grade deflation together. : ) )

[hypothalamus]

Oh, and aren't outside courses weighed less heavily when the LSAC re-calculates applicants' GPAs? If so, OP would benefit little from an A in a DeVry Unviersity online course... And if yes, I have this one A+ in an outside program haha. But I doubt it counts.

[Dr. Strangelove]

With the 180 and the reasonably high GPA, I wouldn't rule out anything except Yale.

[romothesavior]

With the 180 and the reasonably high GPA, I wouldn't rule out anything except Yale.

You are consistently the most over-optimistic predictor on here. You always say people have a shot at schools they don't have a shot at.

H may be worth an app, but he is in all likelihood not getting in. It is very rare for any of HYS to dip to 3.5 for a non-URM.

[bravos89]

.

[bravos89]

.

[acadec]

.

Good point.