I am 29! Will be 30 for Fall of 2015 Forum

[patogordo]

the real question is how does someone get to be 29 years old and remain so mind-bogglingly oblivious?

URM: No

oh, i see.

[Flips88]

Don't know if I remember someone cementing themselves as a complete shit poster in under 10 posts.

Bravo.

[NYstate]

Don't know if I remember someone cementing themselves as a complete shit poster in under 10 posts.

Bravo.

Seriously. He could just have said thank you.

Two things:
1. Older students already have a bias against them for possibly having trouble working with younger, more experienced people. My firm wouldn't touch OP. Not that he cares because he will do his own thing.

2. OPs past academic performance doesn't bode well for success in law school. He should be prepared for younger, better students to possibly eat his lunch. business experience doesn't help you write a final exam graded on a mandatory curve. His academic record is why many T14 schools won't touch him. Not to be inflammatory but OP should not plan on cruising through law school over all those young kids and the people with business experience and strong academic records.

[patogordo]

1. Older students already have a bias against them for possibly having trouble working with younger, more experienced people. My firm wouldn't touch OP. Not that he cares because he will do his own thing.

also, 29 is not old

[Flips88]

Don't know if I remember someone cementing themselves as a complete shit poster in under 10 posts.

Bravo.

Seriously. He could just have said thank you.

Two things:
1. Older students already have a bias against them for possibly having trouble working with younger, more experienced people. My firm wouldn't touch OP. Not that he cares because he will do his own thing.

2. OPs past academic performance doesn't bode well for success in law school. He should be prepared for younger, better students to possibly eat his lunch. business experience doesn't help you write a final exam graded on a mandatory curve. His academic record is why many T14 schools won't touch him. Not to be inflammatory but OP should not plan on cruising through law school over all those young kids and the people with business experience and strong academic records.

Just want to reiterate #1. You're going to do OCI interviews with and work under some younger associates who will be several years younger than you. Based on everything you've shown, you won't handle that well at all. You're aggressively being a douche to people here that are already in law school, most who already have law jobs, or are already practicing lawyers.

[kartelite]

Plan A) Form start-up high-tech froyo bar, interactive iPhone app, whatever).
Law degree helpful? Who knows - knowing how to read/write contracts and how to structure transactions is somewhat useful in a lot of businesses.

OMG I just read this again. This dude's plan A is to start a fucking fro yo bar after he spends $200,000 on law school. JFC

I like how you edited my post to make it sound the way you wanted. I'm pretty sure it said "consulting firm" lol. I'm sure you're going to make a great lawyer.

Why all the hate for people who want to do something else in life? My mom went to law school, now she runs a bed and breakfast. My dad also went and he teaches - neither of them have any regrets about going to law school.

[Flips88]

Plan A) Form start-up high-tech froyo bar, interactive iPhone app, whatever).
Law degree helpful? Who knows - knowing how to read/write contracts and how to structure transactions is somewhat useful in a lot of businesses.

OMG I just read this again. This dude's plan A is to start a fucking fro yo bar after he spends $200,000 on law school. JFC

I like how you edited my post to make it sound the way you wanted. I'm pretty sure it said "consulting firm" lol. I'm sure you're going to make a great lawyer.

Why all the hate for people who want to do something else in life? My mom went to law school, now she runs a bed and breakfast. My dad also went and he teaches - neither of them have any regrets about going to law school.

But the landscape of the legal market has changed monumentally in the last few decades...

[timbs4339]

Plan A) Form start-up high-tech froyo bar, interactive iPhone app, whatever).
Law degree helpful? Who knows - knowing how to read/write contracts and how to structure transactions is somewhat useful in a lot of businesses.

OMG I just read this again. This dude's plan A is to start a fucking fro yo bar after he spends $200,000 on law school. JFC

I like how you edited my post to make it sound the way you wanted. I'm pretty sure it said "consulting firm" lol. I'm sure you're going to make a great lawyer.

Why all the hate for people who want to do something else in life? My mom went to law school, now she runs a bed and breakfast. My dad also went and he teaches - neither of them have any regrets about going to law school.

Nobody is hating on people who want to achieve something else in life. Go ahead and start a bed and breakfast. But law school is going to be about as much of a help in that as journalism or art school is. You wouldn't take on 200K of debt to go to journalism school or art school in order to help you start a froyo bar or bed and breakfast, so don't do it for law school. Trust me, there's really no difference even though network television doesn't have shows about journalism or art majors.

And we're members of this profession and taxpayers who underwrite your student loans, so yes, we have an interest in why people go to law school.

[kartelite]

But the landscape of the legal market has changed monumentally in the last few decades...

I appreciate that. My satisfaction in going to law school isn't contingent upon finding legal employment or any employment at all.

[NYstate]

my mom did law school and had to borrow a total of one- hundredth what it costs now. She owed $16,000 and started out around 50,000. She shared a huge two bedroom apartment on the UWS for $400 a month. She had no concern about repaying that debt if she didn't like law.
You can't compare law now with law then.

Is anyone else starting to think this guy is just a troll. We constantly get new and different facts. At least there is some decent info in this thread if someone else needs it.

[A. Nony Mouse]

There are actually 2 different "username begins with k" posters here, posting similar but not entirely identical things, which is kind of confusing.

[Flips88]

But the landscape of the legal market has changed monumentally in the last few decades...

I appreciate that. My satisfaction in going to law school isn't contingent upon finding legal employment or any employment at all.

Yeah so you shouldn't go to law school.

[Mal Reynolds]

Plan A) Form start-up high-tech froyo bar, interactive iPhone app, whatever).
Law degree helpful? Who knows - knowing how to read/write contracts and how to structure transactions is somewhat useful in a lot of businesses.

OMG I just read this again. This dude's plan A is to start a fucking fro yo bar after he spends $200,000 on law school. JFC

I like how you edited my post to make it sound the way you wanted. I'm pretty sure it said "consulting firm" lol. I'm sure you're going to make a great lawyer.

Why all the hate for people who want to do something else in life? My mom went to law school, now she runs a bed and breakfast. My dad also went and he teaches - neither of them have any regrets about going to law school.

I edited out the consulting firm because it was the most unrealistic and ridiculous of all the options.

[Otunga]

OP is fucking hilarious. His posts were reasonable at first, and I didn't think he was being pretentious despite the MENSA mention, but then it got all out of whack.

[patogordo]

OP is fucking hilarious. His posts were reasonable at first, and I didn't think he was being pretentious despite the MENSA mention, but then it got all out of whack.

Well don't you look stupid because he showed this thread to three (3) people who reviewed it and saw nothing wrong.

[k1a2t2i7e]

OP is fucking hilarious. His posts were reasonable at first, and I didn't think he was being pretentious despite the MENSA mention, but then it got all out of whack.

I was essentially attacked immediately after I posted on here... wth you all think my reaction is going to be? "thanks for the insult"?

I am not 100% sure, but i think the other "username begins with k" poster has brought about some indirect fire my way? I don't know.

I came here wanting some advice, I did get some...but I also got immediately **** on by a bunch of folks. So, yeah. I wasn't sure what to expect on here, but I learned quickly that a lot of people are just on here to crap all over other people. No different than the forums for cars(ls1tech) I used to read in high school. I sincerely thank those who contributed to my gathering of information. Everyone else just sucks.

[Flips88]

OP is fucking hilarious. His posts were reasonable at first, and I didn't think he was being pretentious despite the MENSA mention, but then it got all out of whack.

I was essentially attacked immediately after I posted on here... wth you all think my reaction is going to be? "thanks for the insult"?

I am not 100% sure, but i think the other "username begins with k" poster has brought about some indirect fire my way? I don't know.

I came here wanting some advice, I did get some...but I also got immediately **** on by a bunch of folks. So, yeah. I wasn't sure what to expect on here, but I learned quickly that a lot of people are just on here to crap all over other people. No different than the forums for cars(ls1tech) I used to read in high school. I sincerely thank those who contributed to my gathering of information. Everyone else just sucks.

This is the internet and you're a grown adult. You can say "shit"

[k1a2t2i7e]

Forums I have been on in the past would censor any common curse words.

[BigZuck]

Forums I have been on in the past would censor any common curse words.

*blog*

[03152016]

Not sure if troll or just sociopath

If he's an alt, this is my prediction:

Joined TLS, in 2012. but you are at 1800+ post. This is a warning. What exactly can someone offer who spends this level of time on a blog?

You joined this forum in September of 2009. It has been 1,600 days since you joined this forum, give or take a few. You have over 12,000 posts on here. That approximates 8 posts per day for 4.5 years. Assuming it takes you an average of 5 minutes per post (some take seconds, presumably you do some research for others) You have devoted 40 minutes per day for 1600 days to providing commentary or advice on here. Since you are a graduate of the class of 2013. Would it be safe to assume you did not post on here a whole lot during your first year (maybe second) of law school? If I can make that assumption I can push many of the averages UP for your post law school posting rate/averages. You have spent approximately 60,000 minutes on this blog alone, which translates to 1,000 hours, or 41 days...

[cron1834]

Not sure if troll or just sociopath

If he's an alt, this is my prediction:

Joined TLS, in 2012. but you are at 1800+ post. This is a warning. What exactly can someone offer who spends this level of time on a blog?

You joined this forum in September of 2009. It has been 1,600 days since you joined this forum, give or take a few. You have over 12,000 posts on here. That approximates 8 posts per day for 4.5 years. Assuming it takes you an average of 5 minutes per post (some take seconds, presumably you do some research for others) You have devoted 40 minutes per day for 1600 days to providing commentary or advice on here. Since you are a graduate of the class of 2013. Would it be safe to assume you did not post on here a whole lot during your first year (maybe second) of law school? If I can make that assumption I can push many of the averages UP for your post law school posting rate/averages. You have spent approximately 60,000 minutes on this blog alone, which translates to 1,000 hours, or 41 days...

[Tinker]

Okay, I have read the stickies. I normally would not post on a message board but I have not many cases similar to my own.

Undergrad GPA: 2.962 (graduated in 2007)
Graduate GPA: 3.667 (incomplete masters from 2008)
URM: No
LSAT: 178

For starters, I am 29 years old. I have spent the previous 6 years in the "real" world. I have an undergraduate degree in Finance. I have worked in a couple of venture capital "pressure cookers" and have been fortunate enough to land a decent job. I am the Chief Financial Officer at a small(but growing) business in the Oil&Gas industry. I was brought on board to "facilitate growth" and in the two years since my arrival our sales have increase about 100% year over year. I do a whole lot for the company, but I am ready to expand my horizon. In 5 years the company I am working for may or may not still be around. We do over 3Million a year in business, but you never know what the future holds.

My letters of recommendation: one will be the sitting Chief Financial Officer for a Billion dollar company. I had the opportunity to work with the man, and I suppose something impressed him. Although I no longer work for him, I have kept in touch over the years. His former positions include high level executive management at Rubbermaid, among others. He is in his late 60's. I have an open invitation to stay with him at his home. He has pledged to write me a recommendation. For the second letter I am going back to academia and will utilize my former advisor. He is a PHD with quite a few publications. He is not famous, but he is no slouch. I keep in touch with him, I believe he would be able to write me a decent letter.

Should I even use an old academic contact for my letter?

I hope to write a compelling and edgy personal statement. I am under no false illusions. I need to write the best PS the admission officers read for the class enrolling.


My question is how bad will my UGPA hurt me? I have been out of school for a long time. I will be in the <2% population by Age at any school I attend. I have created board meetings for the largest company in its industry. (I won't name, its obscure, but it is still a billion dollar company). I have basically aced the LSAT. I am going to have over 30K of my own money saved up by the time I pull the plug on my current job. I also do not come from a family with wealth. My father spent his career as a police officer, my mother a secretary. She is deceased. I literally grew up in a manufactured home(trailer house). I hope to parlay some of my socioeconomic status into my PS.

I am also a member of MENSA.

I hope I have given you enough information to make some kind of determination. Please do not judge my writing skills per this post, I have just worked a classy 12 hour Monday.

I actually think we're at an advantage of being older because generally that's viewed really well if you can prove that the age has done you some good which obviously yours has since you've experienced a lot in the real world. I have too. I'll probably be 31 before I start school and I was worried about it at first but I think during school it will work for me rather than against me. I've heard a lot of really positive things from friends who started law school even later than us!

[danquayle]

I think some of you are conflating k1a2t2i7e and Kartelite. They're both a little obnoxious yeah, but some of that is coming from defending one another's comments.

Kartelite seems to be more in the "I want to experience law school" camp and isn't really actively defending the choice of attendance as a wise financial one.

k1a2t2i7e, on the other hand, seems to actually think it would be a good financial route. Keeping in mind he is the OP and presumably wanted info, I take that to originate from his lack of information.

k1a2t2i7e, do you really want to give up 6 years of a solid career just to restart it? You'll be on an equal footing with all the 25 year old J-JD grads. Law firms really don't put much value in non-law experience (unless potentially you're a scientist applying for a patent law position). Other than that, its at best a nice soft.

The reason most people on this thread are encouraging the MBA is because:

1) It's actually easier to get into with your stats. You are overvaluing the importance of the GMAT. Unlike with law school admissions, the GMAT is really more a threshold test. The average GMAT is not significantly higher at the #1 b-school than the #7 b-school and a 750 is not dramatically better than a 700. I bet you could get at least 700.

2) It allows you to utilize your strongest assets. You've had what seems like a brilliant career already.You feel limited because you lack the requisite "brand name" to elevate to the next step. This is exactly what an MBA does. Law school wipes your best assets away.

Your 178 would put you in a pretty good position if you were right out of undergrad. The point is you're not. You have other things going for you. I am sympathetic to your feeling of career plateau. However a law degree doesn't elevate careers, it restarts them.

[danquayle]

Okay, I have read the stickies. I normally would not post on a message board but I have not many cases similar to my own.

Undergrad GPA: 2.962 (graduated in 2007)
Graduate GPA: 3.667 (incomplete masters from 2008)
URM: No
LSAT: 178

For starters, I am 29 years old. I have spent the previous 6 years in the "real" world. I have an undergraduate degree in Finance. I have worked in a couple of venture capital "pressure cookers" and have been fortunate enough to land a decent job. I am the Chief Financial Officer at a small(but growing) business in the Oil&Gas industry. I was brought on board to "facilitate growth" and in the two years since my arrival our sales have increase about 100% year over year. I do a whole lot for the company, but I am ready to expand my horizon. In 5 years the company I am working for may or may not still be around. We do over 3Million a year in business, but you never know what the future holds.

My letters of recommendation: one will be the sitting Chief Financial Officer for a Billion dollar company. I had the opportunity to work with the man, and I suppose something impressed him. Although I no longer work for him, I have kept in touch over the years. His former positions include high level executive management at Rubbermaid, among others. He is in his late 60's. I have an open invitation to stay with him at his home. He has pledged to write me a recommendation. For the second letter I am going back to academia and will utilize my former advisor. He is a PHD with quite a few publications. He is not famous, but he is no slouch. I keep in touch with him, I believe he would be able to write me a decent letter.

Should I even use an old academic contact for my letter?

I hope to write a compelling and edgy personal statement. I am under no false illusions. I need to write the best PS the admission officers read for the class enrolling.


My question is how bad will my UGPA hurt me? I have been out of school for a long time. I will be in the <2% population by Age at any school I attend. I have created board meetings for the largest company in its industry. (I won't name, its obscure, but it is still a billion dollar company). I have basically aced the LSAT. I am going to have over 30K of my own money saved up by the time I pull the plug on my current job. I also do not come from a family with wealth. My father spent his career as a police officer, my mother a secretary. She is deceased. I literally grew up in a manufactured home(trailer house). I hope to parlay some of my socioeconomic status into my PS.

I am also a member of MENSA.

I hope I have given you enough information to make some kind of determination. Please do not judge my writing skills per this post, I have just worked a classy 12 hour Monday.

I actually think we're at an advantage of being older because generally that's viewed really well if you can prove that the age has done you some good which obviously yours has since you've experienced a lot in the real world. I have too. I'll probably be 31 before I start school and I was worried about it at first but I think during school it will work for me rather than against me. I've heard a lot of really positive things from friends who started law school even later than us!

From what I've gathered, law firms do age discriminate but not when you're in your 30s. I think the trap for older applicants that have given up solid careers is that it can become very discouraging if you struggle in the job market.

Anecdotally, most of the 25-35 cohort at my law school performed very well in law school. I attribute that purely to maturity. Oftentimes you're already married at that age, and the spouse is a major source of stability and support. That is if she can handle your stressful law school bullshit without divorcing you.

[jmjm]

What is so off putting? I tried to stick to the facts, and share my opinions where necessary. I am not on here to make friends. I need advice about something I don't know very much about. In several months of reading everything I can get my hands on and pouring through blogs on the subject I am no closer to being able to make a confident decision on the subject.

I have serious doubts about my ability to destroy the GMAT. Which I would almost certainly have to do.

There is a WIDE RANGE of responses about law school out there. The Princeton Review for example makes the case that all employment fields are struggling, and Law is still a decent choice. I have read through forums similar to this one where everyone is anti law school. I have read just the opposite on others. I don't think anyone is lying but rather their own personal experiences have shaped their opinions.

I'm not looking for flamers or trolls... I am looking for genuine advice backed up with substance. I have gotten some on here and I thank you folks. My resume isn't perfect. If I had the perfect job I wouldn't be looking elsewhere. I am in a financially wonderful spot but the long term prospects are terrible where I am.

If I am lucky enough to sneak into a T14, I will do everything I can to make it work for me, for my situation. Hopefully it turns out well. Even if it does not I will have an excellent education from an excellent institution.

My earlier discussion of law students being inexperienced isn't meant to be offensive, it is just a regurgitation of all the statistics I have seen. Many 1L's are under 24... depending where you look or who you ask that % can climb over 50%...

Your posts are not off putting OP, and some responses to your posts are inappropriate. Such responses show posters' inexperience and lack of perspective in the real world.

Your test score is a solid plus considering you were able to juggle it with a lead role at a for-profit company. The business world doesn't require and in fact discourages the type of things that lsat tests, so it's impressive that you were able to do well there.

I took GMAT a few years ago and it's a cakewalk compared to lsat. The math tested in GMAT is rudimentary and I don't see how a top lsat scorer can't do extremely well in GMAT.