OU vs. Baylor vs. A&M vs. RETAKE ** INPUT VERY MUCH APPRECIATED Forum

[brodhi]

I'm pretty sure the advice that I will receive upon posting this, but instead of wrestling with hypothetical advice, I thought I'd seek ya'lls expertise.

I've been wrestling with the 'right choice' since I applied to law schools late in the cycle (I know, worst call ever). Following a debilitating knee injury which derailed my career as a singer/dancer, I took the Dec. LSAT and scored a 153 (well below my practice scores). I then took the Feb. LSAT with a month of Logic Games preparation and scored 161--With my less than stellar UGPA (2.84), the score left much to be desired.

Of the schools to which I applied, I've been offered admission at:

OU with 75% tuition.
Texas A&M 85% tuition.
Baylor- no scholarship (unless I go for spring admission).

WL at:

University of Houston, Pepperdine, Northeastern, Case Western Reserve, CU Boulder.

*At this point I believe I'd like to participate in IP and/or International Law.

*I'm not sure the area in which I'd like to practice; I can, however, definitively say that it's not Oklahoma.(*I'd like to either practice in Texas, NYC, or California.)

*Because I applied so late in the cycle, and considering my less than stellar LSAT and low UGPA, I did not apply to any of the T14 or Tier 1 schools.

*I do believe I can score markedly better on the LSAT (I've yet to study RC or LR at all), but will not be able to take the June administration as I'd like to put considerably more time and effort into my studies this time around (were I to retake).



-----------------------------------------The other issues with which I've been wrestling are:------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-I'm an old man (29 this past March); I feel that I need to be making forward strides by starting this new career path before the big 3-0-.

-As a career performer until now, I have no long-term job with which to subsidize another cycle (**and no health insurance** which is a priority of mine).

-My parents and family (knowing relatively little about the field) don't really understand the dilemna and are pressuring me to attend the highest ranked school to which I received admission AND scholarship (OU Law). Their logic being if one is truly driven, one can find success regardless of educational institution. (I think it's an antequated position that's lingered from my father's experience in medical school. "I didn't go to the best medical school and look where I ended up" argument.)

Most of you are far smarter than I; An objective opinion would be so helpful!

I really appreciate any time you take in reading/answering this post.

[Draconem]

This isn't the right forum for your topic.

Check out "Choosing A Law School."

[ChinaCat]

Definitely retake. There is no reason not to work for the highest LSAT you can get. 29 is not old, and one more year is nothing compared to your entire career. The health insurance thing is serious, but maybe you could ask your parents to loan you money for that for a year?

[TLSDookie]

Disclaimer: 0L

But I've been ghosting around these forums to pre-empt some TLS advice that you 100% will receive based on your situation:

Don't listen to your parents/family, they are giving you advice based on an antiquated idea of "professional school"; rankings below T-20 are largely arbitrary, below T-50 are entirely arbitrary. The only reason to go to law school at U Oklahoma is to practice law in Oklahoma, it will not get you a job anywhere else. Same, but even more dramatically regional effect applies to A&M. Unless you have a very, very strong tie to the region and reason to practice law there, don't go to either school.

You are right to distrust your father's advice, especially since it doesn't even pertain to the law--the medical profession is an entirely different beast, where there will always be regional hospitals in need of trained physicians, upon which you can build your career. Law is different in that there are too many lawyers and too few positions. It's not a matter of "working hard to find success" its that there simply are no legal job openings to be had for a significant portion of graduates from these schools. In all likelihood, a good outcome from these schools represents doing whatever kind of law you can to scrape by an existence at 45K/year.

Not studying for the two of the three sections of the LSAT is a mistake especially at your advanced age. The LSAT is a learnable test, and a 161 is a remarkable score for such little studying. Commit the summer to studying as much as possible and re-take it in the fall. If you can improve by ~7 points (just a handful more questions right across 4 sections), you will can get nearly full rides at better schools that are either in your desired region to live or with some degree of national pull, even with your GPA.

[grades??]

1000000000% retake. Your gpa hurts and will probably keep you out of the t14. However, a nice high lsat score like 168-172 will probably at least get you some bites from some top 20ish schools with legit scholarship. A place I could see you getting a nice scholarship from is WUSTL if you crush the lsat. Which you obviously can by testing around 160 with essentially no preparation. I personally went from a 142 diagnostic to a 175+ score with some hard work and studying. Honestly you should study all summer, really buckle down. Apply the first day you can in September to the top 30 schools. See what happens. With a 168+, you will get a much better opportunity.

Just as an aside, you might want to reconsider your goals. Do you have a master's/phd in a hard science? If not, no real IP opportunities for you. Second, international law is something usually reserved for people with the best grades at the best schools-HYS. International law is a misnomer also, like what kind of international law? Arbitration, human rights, etc? You need to really think about what you want to do in law and how to get there. With your gpa, you will be probably shut out of the schools that might be able to get you an "international law" job. Also without a science background, IP will be next to impossible.

Not saying this to discourage you but to really think what you want to do. Also a lot of people go to law school in their 30s. More than you think.

[genericwit]

International law and IP in big law aren't possible with the schools you've been admitted. With your low GPA, you need a high LSAT. Law school aren't built equally. Even if you want to practice regionally, the only law school in Texas that isn't garbage is UT. And UT is very generous in letting you get in with a below median LSAT/GPA if you're in-state.

Another point to keep in mind is that you may want to retake some undergrad classes. Most folks here are BAs. I'm a BS, and my coursework makes me eligible for the patent bar. Considering that on campus interviewers have the option to select for people with patent bar eligibility, I'd say it's something that matters to them potentially, especially in IP. Since I want to do IP, I opted to go for a T20 with an IP certificate program and for a major that gives me patent bar eligibility (and one that gave me aid, because schools like UCLA, Gtown, and UT gave me peanuts, and despite my big law ambitions, I'm not about that debt life if I don't achieve my goals).

And I'm not a fresh out of undergrad person either. I've been out of school three years now, so I know what it's like to feel that burden of, "well, am I too old?" in your twenties. And I know the burden of, "how much stress is this worth? What is my breaking point?" when you're working professionally, full-time (overtime for me) while studying for the LSAT. For me, I couldn't afford to not work and study, and I couldn't afford MENTALLY to go on no sleep and spend 20 hours a week studying. So I continued working, studied a decent amount, and got a score in high 160s, which was adequate for me, with my 3.89 from undergrad.

Just because you've made bad decisions in the past (with your LSAT score and GPA) doesn't mean that you have to keep making them. Study hard, consider more coursework to up your GPA, and get a higher LSAT. If this is your 'dream,' then there's no reason to put in the bare minimum to get into a decent school.

Edit: And I'm from the DFW area, too, so I know a lot of grads from these garbage Texas schools. Most of them don't have jobs and are trying desperately to continue education elsewhere or are working at small firms for less money than I make now with just my BS.

[BillClinton Jr]

Retake.

[Mikey]

This is the wrong forum but you should retake.

[brodhi]

Thank you all for your comments. I really appreciate all of your opinions and suggestions. At this point I've all but made up my mind to retake. Just didn't want to leap to any impulsive decision so I decided to give it a day or two to process.

Such a cool community though that responds to questions like this. Much obliged!