Lewis and Clark 2012-2013 applicants Forum

[sancho]

From the ABA info sheet and Lewis & Clark's website. I can't link right now. I'm posting from my phone.

Great information. Thanks!

[bobbypin]

How can anyone justify attending this school without a significant scholarship?
The tuition has gone up from approx $26,000 in 2005 to $38,000 now, their mean scholarship amounts have not changed much (they fluctuate from $8,000 to $10,000) in that same amount of time, their LRAP is darn near impossible to receive (only 40 students have been able to take advantage since its inception in 2000), and their employment rate is 51.5% (with 32% of those graduating in 2011 being without full time jobs).

YIKES!

What am I missing?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I still want to go here because I want to be a lawyer in Portland. But I cannot justify these stats. Can anyone talk me off the ledge here?
What do you tell yourself?

[BlazersTime]

How can anyone justify attending this school without a significant scholarship?
The tuition has gone up from approx $26,000 in 2005 to $38,000 now, their mean scholarship amounts have not changed much (they fluctuate from $8,000 to $10,000) in that same amount of time, their LRAP is darn near impossible to receive (only 40 students have been able to take advantage since its inception in 2000), and their employment rate is 51.5% (with 32% of those graduating in 2011 being without full time jobs).

YIKES!

What am I missing?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I still want to go here because I want to be a lawyer in Portland. But I cannot justify these stats. Can anyone talk me off the ledge here?
What do you tell yourself?

Honestly I wouldn't pay sticker to go to any law school outside of the Harvards of the world. I wish I could help you out but (and I hate saying this because everyone says it) maybe retaking the LSAT would be a good idea. I got a 156 my first time around and didn't get any money at L & C so I worked for a year, re-took the test and got a 162. I don't know your situation but its something to think about.

[phlmar]

status changed to decision made yesterday, and now i can log into the website. so excited!!!

[leilz]

How can anyone justify attending this school without a significant scholarship?
The tuition has gone up from approx $26,000 in 2005 to $38,000 now, their mean scholarship amounts have not changed much (they fluctuate from $8,000 to $10,000) in that same amount of time, their LRAP is darn near impossible to receive (only 40 students have been able to take advantage since its inception in 2000), and their employment rate is 51.5% (with 32% of those graduating in 2011 being without full time jobs).

YIKES!

What am I missing?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I still want to go here because I want to be a lawyer in Portland. But I cannot justify these stats. Can anyone talk me off the ledge here?
What do you tell yourself?

The low number of people using L&Cs LRAP seems like it could be a good thing... it just means those are the only people who have made little enough money to take advantage of the program.

Also, I want to work at a non-profit. So I'll qualify for the public service loan repayment what-not where whatever is left of my loans after 10 years of public service employment will be forgiven. But I guess that's only a reasonable fallback if you know that's what you want to do. Luckily for me, that's why I want to go to law school in the first place, so it's convenient that there's that option to make it more realistic.

[steepair]

Anyone going to the meeting with Professor Melissa Powers in San Francisco??

i highly recommend this! i had professor powers for torts last semester and she is one of the nicest professors at L&C!

[simplycatalina]

Anyone going to the meeting with Professor Melissa Powers in San Francisco??

i highly recommend this! i had professor powers for torts last semester and she is one of the nicest professors at L&C!

yeah i went today! she is super nice and was really helpful!

[052220151]

The low number of people using L&Cs LRAP seems like it could be a good thing... it just means those are the only people who have made little enough money to take advantage of the program.

Also, I want to work at a non-profit. So I'll qualify for the public service loan repayment what-not where whatever is left of my loans after 10 years of public service employment will be forgiven. But I guess that's only a reasonable fallback if you know that's what you want to do. Luckily for me, that's why I want to go to law school in the first place, so it's convenient that there's that option to make it more realistic.

Don't be so quick to think that. Having a low salary isn't sufficient to get you LRAP. Your job has to qualify. This data suggests that many jobs do not. LST lists L&C's underemployment at 35%, it seems to blow a hole through your theory. My guess is that L&C's LRAP isn't that good, and shouldn't be relied upon.

Also, any loans that are forgiven still have to have the taxes paid on them. If you go somewhere at sticker, make minimum payments for ten years, and then get them discharged, you could be on the hook for a huge bill to the IRS. Its a better option, but still not ideal.

[sidhesadie]

The other thing, if you're married, is that for L&C's LRAP (and I'm sure some others as well), you're treated as having the higher of either your own income, or half the joint income.
The limit is $45,000.

So if you make $40,000 and your spouse makes $60,000, you are treated as having $50,000 (half the joint) in total, and will not qualify. LIkewise, if you make $50,000 and your spouse makes only $20,000, you're still treated as having $50,000, not the $35,000 that's half the joint income, and will not qualify.

[052220151]

Per their website, they have only given out 300k since its inception. That's like three people's tuition at sticker.

[BlazersTime]

The other thing, if you're married, is that for L&C's LRAP (and I'm sure some others as well), you're treated as having the higher of either your own income, or half the joint income.
The limit is $45,000.

So if you make $40,000 and your spouse makes $60,000, you are treated as having $50,000 (half the joint) in total, and will not qualify. LIkewise, if you make $50,000 and your spouse makes only $20,000, you're still treated as having $50,000, not the $35,000 that's half the joint income, and will not qualify.

Good info. Thanks

[phlmar]

i just booked my flight & hotel, coming from NJ for the 14/15 preview. will be my first time in portland, i'm so excited.

[bandenjamin]

How can anyone justify attending this school without a significant scholarship?
The tuition has gone up from approx $26,000 in 2005 to $38,000 now, their mean scholarship amounts have not changed much (they fluctuate from $8,000 to $10,000) in that same amount of time, their LRAP is darn near impossible to receive (only 40 students have been able to take advantage since its inception in 2000), and their employment rate is 51.5% (with 32% of those graduating in 2011 being without full time jobs).

YIKES!

What am I missing?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I still want to go here because I want to be a lawyer in Portland. But I cannot justify these stats. Can anyone talk me off the ledge here?
What do you tell yourself?

Go to Oregon instead? It's a lot cheaper and Eugene wouldn't be a bad place to spend 3 years.

[Rory19]

I don't know if UO is the best solution if private practice is your goal. I spoke to one of the few firms in Portland that hire summer clerks (the number of Portland 2L summer jobs was discussed earlier in this thread) and they stated they never hire UO students because in their experience Lewis and Clark clerks' competencies are comparable to T14 (they specifically mentioned a Georgetown 2L) but UO 2Ls' knowledge and skills are markedly less developed than their peers at Lewis and Clark.

Granted, this is all hearsay and I have been a legal assistant for two UO law grads both in Portland and in Eugene and they have no preference.

[MeowMix11]

Has anyone been accepted via snail mail only? A decision was rendered 2/25 via status checker but I have not received an email nor am I able to log into their admitted students page. They did send me info on 2/26 about the Oregon State Bar Scholarship. Anyway, I'm not thinking it's looking too good. Thoughts? I really want L&C!

[leilz]

Has anyone been accepted via snail mail only? A decision was rendered 2/25 via status checker but I have not received an email nor am I able to log into their admitted students page. They did send me info on 2/26 about the Oregon State Bar Scholarship. Anyway, I'm not thinking it's looking too good. Thoughts? I really want L&C!

It seems to be the general trend that they only send out emails on Fridays.

I couldn't log into the admitted student page until around... 2pm est and I didnt get an email until 5:30 ish.

So don't worry yet.

[052220151]

I don't know if UO is the best solution if private practice is your goal. I spoke to one of the few firms in Portland that hire summer clerks (the number of Portland 2L summer jobs was discussed earlier in this thread) and they stated they never hire UO students because in their experience Lewis and Clark clerks' competencies are comparable to T14 (they specifically mentioned a Georgetown 2L) but UO 2Ls' knowledge and skills are markedly less developed than their peers at Lewis and Clark.

Granted, this is all hearsay and I have been a legal assistant for two UO law grads both in Portland and in Eugene and they have no preference.

Both of them place terribly into big law. I think the only real difference in placing power between the two is that it is slightly easier to get a job in Portland coming out of L&C.

[Rory19]

I don't know if UO is the best solution if private practice is your goal. I spoke to one of the few firms in Portland that hire summer clerks (the number of Portland 2L summer jobs was discussed earlier in this thread) and they stated they never hire UO students because in their experience Lewis and Clark clerks' competencies are comparable to T14 (they specifically mentioned a Georgetown 2L) but UO 2Ls' knowledge and skills are markedly less developed than their peers at Lewis and Clark.

Granted, this is all hearsay and I have been a legal assistant for two UO law grads both in Portland and in Eugene and they have no preference.

Both of them place terribly into big law. I think the only real difference in placing power between the two is that it is slightly easier to get a job in Portland coming out of L&C.

Potentially. I also think the overall low placement rate for Oregon schools in general is how small the market is for big law in our state.

[MeowMix11]

Has anyone been accepted via snail mail only? A decision was rendered 2/25 via status checker but I have not received an email nor am I able to log into their admitted students page. They did send me info on 2/26 about the Oregon State Bar Scholarship. Anyway, I'm not thinking it's looking too good. Thoughts? I really want L&C!

It seems to be the general trend that they only send out emails on Fridays.

I couldn't log into the admitted student page until around... 2pm est and I didnt get an email until 5:30 ish.

So don't worry yet.

Got my email today, I'm in! Thank you

[052220151]

I don't know if UO is the best solution if private practice is your goal. I spoke to one of the few firms in Portland that hire summer clerks (the number of Portland 2L summer jobs was discussed earlier in this thread) and they stated they never hire UO students because in their experience Lewis and Clark clerks' competencies are comparable to T14 (they specifically mentioned a Georgetown 2L) but UO 2Ls' knowledge and skills are markedly less developed than their peers at Lewis and Clark.

Granted, this is all hearsay and I have been a legal assistant for two UO law grads both in Portland and in Eugene and they have no preference.

Both of them place terribly into big law. I think the only real difference in placing power between the two is that it is slightly easier to get a job in Portland coming out of L&C.

Potentially. I also think the overall low placement rate for Oregon schools in general is how small the market is for big law in our state.

It's rough considering there are really only three or four large big law offices in town (I'm not counting the dinky K&L Gates office and the ilk), that have maybe 15 SAs a year. L&C and UO probably nab 5 to 7/8 of those and the rest go to the T14 bound PDX natives, it's really a bad scene. Good news is, Portland appears to be one of the few cities where mid law isn't only a thing, but particularly robust.

[sidhesadie]

I don't think anyone has had 15 SA's actually in their portland offices for quite awhile. More like 5.

[rinkrat19]

I don't think anyone has had 15 SA's actually in their portland offices for quite awhile. More like 5.

I think they mean 15 total.

There's more like 30. But still a very small number.

[doppelganger]

i just booked my flight & hotel, coming from NJ for the 14/15 preview. will be my first time in portland, i'm so excited.

+1 on flight and dates. I've never been either. Been brushing up by watching Portlandia! I am very excited

[052220151]

I don't think anyone has had 15 SA's actually in their portland offices for quite awhile. More like 5.

I think they mean 15 total.

There's more like 30. But still a very small number.

I was saying amongst the three or four large 'big law' offices (stoel rives, perkins coie, davis wright tremaine) there are only ~15 SAs. When you include schwabe, lane powell, miller nash, etc., then it balloons up to around 30, maybe.

[rinkrat19]

I don't think anyone has had 15 SA's actually in their portland offices for quite awhile. More like 5.

I think they mean 15 total.

There's more like 30. But still a very small number.

I was saying amongst the three or four large 'big law' offices (stoel rives, perkins coie, davis wright tremaine) there are only ~15 SAs. When you include schwabe, lane powell, miller nash, etc., then it balloons up to around 30, maybe.

Ah. Yes, this is pretty accurate.