Harvard, C/O 2017, Applicants Thread (2013-2014) Forum

[lawschool22]

I can revert back to before this happened.

[FuriousDuck]

...

[lawschool22]

I just reverted. Everyone try to keep an eye on things and let me know if it needs reverted again and/or locked down

[alllaweverything]

I just reverted. Everyone try to keep an eye on things and let me know if it needs reverted again and/or locked down

oh, the relief! i'll keep an eye out.

[love4life29]

JS1 just now, I'm close to both medians. Complete 2/6.

[Quest4Knowledge]

Wow, yes, the various combos of above/below medians would be very helpful!

+1

[Quest4Knowledge]

JS1 just now, I'm close to both medians. Complete 2/6.

Congratulations!

Question for those who have had JS1's - when you schedule your interview, how far in advance do they have dates available for? 1 week? 2 weeks?

[jasper09]

JS1 just now, I'm close to both medians. Complete 2/6.

Congratulations!

Question for those who have had JS1's - when you schedule your interview, how far in advance do they have dates available for? 1 week? 2 weeks?

When I scheduled mine, the first available date was 2 weeks out; the next available was another week after that. I think it really just depends on what dates they're conducting interviews and how many people have gotten to the scheduling website before you...apparently I was in shock that I got an interview for a bit too long so I missed out on the good spots.

[gta]

You can't conclude that. I'm sure Leo would agree that since the cycle isn't over, this data set is incomplete at this point. There may well be another large group of people who will get JS2's that blow up the 39 day threshold, and they just haven't received them yet.

Let me wallow over here and keep expectations as low as possible

Although, I'm still on that JS1 wait. I wish I were with the rest of your post-JS1'ers waiting for the JS2.

[selden]

You can't conclude that. I'm sure Leo would agree that since the cycle isn't over, this data set is incomplete at this point. There may well be another large group of people who will get JS2's that blow up the 39 day threshold, and they just haven't received them yet.

I'd say this is correct - as we get later in the cycle, the average wait time from JS1 -> JS2 is likely going to increase. There's going to be lots of people who interviewed 1, 2, or even more months back that are now back in consideration after having been unofficially held for a bit till the strength of the overall applicant pool was clearer.

[hwannabe1234]

PLease...

can you call me js tonight??

[IrishJew]

I added a histogram to the spreadsheet (hope that's okay LS22) illustrating the time between complete and JS1 request. Would simply post the histogram here but have not figured out how to insert pictures. About 95% of the JS1 requests (in this data set) arrive within 39 days. About 80% arrive within 25 days.

That's nerve-wracking... That pretty much means this week for me. JS1 or bust

You can't conclude that. I'm sure Leo would agree that since the cycle isn't over, this data set is incomplete at this point. There may well be another large group of people who will get JS2's that blow up the 39 day threshold, and they just haven't received them yet.

There is also a Bayesian error here. Just because 95% get it within 39 days, that doesn't mean that 95% of those who don't hear within 39 days don't go in, and that's not even taking your numbers (which I don't know) into account. Given that you're already in the tiny subset of people with your numbers who have waited as long as you have, knowledge about the overall average is of limited value.

[mirroroferised7]

Still been "complete" since 11/6/13.

I'm dying here.

[IrishJew]

id guess that's partially related to the fact that you can explain away poor grades in a PS far easier than you could explain away a poor LSAT

Funny, I think Dean Rangappa of Yale said the exact opposite in an interview or one of her blog posts. Something like "you had four years to fix your GPA, whereas the LSAT is one event."

Though I see your point: if you're LSAT skillz are so good and your score is bad, just retake it, but if circumstances have changed since you got bad college grades you can't really do it over.

[IrishJew]

Yep, I also think it's likely there are fewer great LSATs out there than great GPAs. I would imagine a school like Harvard doesn't have a shortage of either, but that may play some small role.

I think this is definitely true. Another possibility is that they just weight the LSAT more. Every school seems to give GPA and LSAT different relative weights (I'm sure you know that many schools (usually lower ranked, I think) use an A x LSAT + B x GPA + C = I index to rank applicants). IIR Stanford has a rep for caring more about GPA than LSAT while NYU is the reverse (you can check this in myLSN predictors). Though I don't know much about Harvard on that front.

[Leo]

Okay friends, even more useless stats!

Here is just a general breakdown of the TLS applicant pool:

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 26%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 33%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 18%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 23%

As you can see, pretty even distribution.

For each group, here is the percentage that have received JS1s so far (eg, 34% of the applicants represented on TLS who are below both medians have received JS1s):

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 34%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 62%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 55%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 77%

The average wait time, in days from complete, for those JS1s by group is as follows:

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 30.2
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 17.1
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 15.1
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 11.0

As expected, those with better stats are receiving their JS1 requests much earlier.

Here is the percentage of those who had JS1s that have been accepted (eg, of the 22 applicants who are below both medians and had JS1s, 7 (32%) have been accepted):

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 32%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 52%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 50%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 73%

The average wait time, in days after JS1, for those acceptances by group is as follows:

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 30.0
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 23.8
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 25.2
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 24.1

Enjoy!

[IrishJew]

JS1 just now, I'm close to both medians. Complete 2/6.

Congratulations!

Question for those who have had JS1's - when you schedule your interview, how far in advance do they have dates available for? 1 week? 2 weeks?

I got an invite in late Nov and could choose from about 5-10 days IIR. I actually didn't schedule right away, though, and when I went in the next week there were more (later) dates available.

[quashbat]

How can I look at the spreadsheet?

----j/k found it

[selden]

How can I look at the spreadsheet?

Link is on the first page of this thread, but its https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... ring#gid=3

ETA mandatory note about not sorting/filtering etc. because it messes it up for everyone else

[lawschool22]

Here is the percentage of those who had JS1s that have been accepted (eg, of the 22 applicants who are below both medians and had JS1s, 7 (32%) have been accepted):

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 32%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 52%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 50%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 73%

This is the one I've been wondering but haven't had the time to calculate. It shows how the distribution of the 850/1200 JS1->JS2 folks is not evenly distributed.

[IrishJew]

Okay friends, even more useless stats!

Here is just a general breakdown of the TLS applicant pool:
...
Enjoy!

Wow, that's really helpful, especially the JS1 to JS2 conversions. Thanks so much for doing this!

I don't know if spreadsheets exist for prior years (JS1 and 2 info certainly isn't on LSN). Does anyone have a sense of whether over the course of the whole cycle there are a lot of people who take a long time to get in? In other words, do we have any sense of if you've been waiting two months with no action what your odds are of eventually getting in? Like, does Harvard routinely sit on borderline apps and then interview/admit tons of them later in the cycle, or is no action a pretty good indicator that you're headed for a ding/WL?

[IrishJew]

Here is the percentage of those who had JS1s that have been accepted (eg, of the 22 applicants who are below both medians and had JS1s, 7 (32%) have been accepted):

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 32%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 52%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 50%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 73%

This is the one I've been wondering but haven't had the time to calculate. It shows how the distribution of the 850/1200 JS1->JS2 folks is not evenly distributed.

Certainly looks that way. AEBE low numbers make you a long shot even if you get an interview (not getting into causation here). But I'm wondering how much of this is more indicative of haste than final decision? I mean, maybe they just admit the high numbers faster/earlier and they will take a disproportionately larger share of lower numbers in later rounds (because they already accepted the good numbered people they want). In other words, how different do you think these numbers will look in May?

[Pau.C.]

.

[Leo]

Posting on page 100π for good luck.

[Quest4Knowledge]

For each group, here is the percentage that have received JS1s so far (eg, 34% of the applicants represented on TLS who are below both medians have received JS1s):

• GPA<3.88 / LSAT<173 = 34%
  GPA<3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 62%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT<173 = 55%
  GPA>=3.88 / LSAT>=173 = 77%

This is awesome, thanks!

I'm assuming there aren't enough data points to do this sort of analysis by 25-50-75 percentile GPA + LSAT, right? (ie GPA<3.77/LSAT<170, GPA<3.77/170<LSAT<173, etc.)