USD c/o 2017 Forum

[yeslekkkk]

Thanks for the heads up!

How much earlier? (I don't have the offer in front of me)

I was under the impression that it was April 1st.

Ya it is April 1st...

"...To confirm your intent to accept this scholarship and confirm your enrollment, it will be necessary for you to furnish us with a non-refundable tuition deposit in the amount of $300 by April 1, 2014. An additional non-refundable deposit of $400 will be due by June 2, 2014. All deposits will be applied to your first semester tuition at registration."

The deadline for the deposit is April 30 or something like that, but to keep the scholarship, it's April 1.

[jstellini]

Anyone know when the next batch of decisions should come out. Went complete on 11/20 and still nothing!

[bkegslounge]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

[yeslekkkk]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

I got them to push it back a week. Not much, but it helps.

[bkegslounge]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

I got them to push it back a week. Not much, but it helps.

Everyone else is either April 15 or 30 seat deposit deadlines so that extra week would definitely help. Mind sharing what you wrote?

[yeslekkkk]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

I got them to push it back a week. Not much, but it helps.

Everyone else is either April 15 or 30 seat deposit deadlines so that extra week would definitely help. Mind sharing what you wrote?

I simply wrote that I was very interested in USD law and that I need more time to weigh all my options. I asked for an extra two weeks. That was it. Nothing too complicated.

Edit: Mind you, I only got a week, but hey. It's better than nothing. I'll know a lot more even in the span of that extra week.

[bkegslounge]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

I got them to push it back a week. Not much, but it helps.

Everyone else is either April 15 or 30 seat deposit deadlines so that extra week would definitely help. Mind sharing what you wrote?

I simply wrote that I was very interested in USD law and that I need more time to weigh all my options. I asked for an extra two weeks. That was it. Nothing too complicated.

Edit: Mind you, I only got a week, but hey. It's better than nothing. I'll know a lot more even in the span of that extra week.

Awesome thanks!

[paayter]

is anyone else concerned about san diego's enourmous drop from 68 to 79?

[yeslekkkk]

is anyone else concerned about san diego's enourmous drop from 68 to 79?

Yes, I am. While US News rankings shouldn't be taken seriously, I would like to know what accounts for the drop.

[paayter]

is anyone else concerned about san diego's enourmous drop from 68 to 79?

Yes, I am. While US News rankings shouldn't be taken seriously, I would like to know what accounts for the drop.

well apparently most california schools have dropped in rankings with that exception of stanford, ucla, and davis. i attended a loyola webinar today and the dean was asked a few questions, and of course the ranking issue came up. he basically stated that the employment data used this year was based off the 2012 stats. and that the 2013 employment stats would be used for next years in which he said there was a 6 percent growth. im guessing san diego's drop and every california school that dropped, their problem was employment percentages. hastings and loyola 2 of the largest law schools are scaling back on class size to remedy this. not sure exactly what san diego's excuse is...but san diego was one of my top choices in cali to now im wondering if i should attend pepperdine which gained spots, but i cant see how it fares any better on employment than any of the other la schools.

im really thinking i need to go out of state and leave california, im becoming disillusioned with how expensive things are in the state. especially schools like san diego thinking its ok to charge the same price as say ucla, usc, stanford, berkley. we will see though.

[underwear]

im really thinking i need to go out of state and leave california, im becoming disillusioned with how expensive things are in the state.

I'm on the same boat. Right now, I'm leaning towards leaving.

There are a few states that imho socially resemble California and yet are substantially cheaper in tuition and generally everything else. It's egregious that paying out of state tuition rates in some other state is cheaper than paying in-state rates as a Californian. Of course this means I most likely wont be returning to CA for work, but I think way cheaper tuition, better job placement, and depending on the state, no income tax, is a better outcome.

Of course, things may rebound in California in the next three years. That rebound sure as hell better be a big one though. Either case, if you're SOL in scholarships, you'll be sitting on a big debt.

[w7ldcard]

is anyone else concerned about san diego's enourmous drop from 68 to 79?

It definitely pushes me away given 68th was already pretty bad

[dd235]

I am not too concerned with the drop in the rankings.

I think that the abysmal employment numbers are to blame for the drop. The numbers are indefensible, but obviously a little unrepresentative. First, the rankings (as most of you probably already know) are using the statistics from the class of 2012. The only employment numbers I care about are those from the class of 2017 which are 5 years from the ones they are using in the rankings. Second, the class of 2012 had 327 graduates. This was at a time when law schools (all law schools) were matriculating more students than the legal job market could handle. The legal market has shown slight signs of recovery, and I think that class of 2013 employment numbers will be slightly better than that for the class of 2012 (even though c/o 2013 has 330 students -- an all time high for USD if I am not mistaken). I talked to a higher up at USD and they are planning on matriculating about 210-220 students for the c/o 2017 which I think is a great thing.

There are two schools of thought about reducing a class size. Some think that the percent of students employed in full-time JD required jobs will remain the same (i.e. c/o 2012 had 154/327 = 47% in JD required jobs, therefore c/o 2017 will have 103/220 = 47% in JD required jobs). I completely disagree with this school of thought. It makes sense for big law who have class-rank cutoffs, but this is only a small minority of the jobs that USD grads get. So, while I think big law employment at USD will remain at a stagnant 5-10% of the class, I think that JD required non-big law jobs will remain at the same number, if not even increase. Most USD grads get jobs from networking with San Diego lawyers and I don’t think that San Diego firms will be reducing their hiring too much by 2017. (Of course, there will be an influx of unemployed grads from previous years competing for these jobs, but there will also be a lot of baby boomers retiring too. Although I think the unemployed grads will outweigh the retirees, I don’t think it will be overwhelming). So even if there are, say 140 grads employed in JD required jobs for the c/o 2017 (which would be a decrease in the number of grads for c/o 2012 which many think to be the bottom of the recession) that would mean 140/220 = 64% employment score which is better than that of Davis right now who went up in the rankings. I know that this is optimistic, but it really doesn’t seem improbable at all to me.

Third (to continue the my thoughts in the first paragraph), I think that measuring employment at 9 months after graduation for schools in the second-tier and beyond is a bit unrepresentative of their potential. USD, unfortunately, does not have a stellar bar-passage rate and this greatly limits their employment numbers. For the c/o 2012, only 78% of students passed the July California bar. This means that assuming all grads took the California bar (which for obvious reasons is not true. Some don’t feel ready and postpone till February and others take bar exams for other states) only 255 grads were even eligible for JD required jobs 9 months after graduation (.78*327). When using this figure, that would mean that 60% (154/255) of grads from the c/o 2012 who were eligible for JD required full-time jobs got one. I know that 60% is still pretty shitty, but it is much better than 47%. It is also true that a 78% bar passage rate is inexcusable, but I know that many schools are taking huge steps towards providing bar prep courses and increasing their bar passage rate.

Anyways, I am sorry for such a long post, but it is for these reasons that I am not too concerned about the drop in the rankings. I know that I make a lot of “leaps” in my logic to come to the conclusions I do, and I would welcome any criticism and debate on the issue.

[xtinesung]

Anyone know when the next batch of decisions should come out. Went complete on 11/20 and still nothing!

Im still waiting too! Went complete on 1/6. Let us know if you hear anything Good luck!

BTW, does anyone know whether there's a "Application In Review" status, or anything between "Application Received - File Complete" and "Decision Rendered" (on status checker)?

[yeslekkkk]

USD denied my scholarship increase request. I'm sitting on a better offer to a higher ranked school but nope! Coupled with the lst score and us new ranking, it very unlikely I'll be depositing there. Too bad. I love San Diego.

[cwipes]

anyone here going to the admitted students/alumni event in LA on the 18th? hoping there will be a good turnout

[rodmanhust]

I am not too concerned with the drop in the rankings.

I think that the abysmal employment numbers are to blame for the drop. The numbers are indefensible, but obviously a little unrepresentative. First, the rankings (as most of you probably already know) are using the statistics from the class of 2012. The only employment numbers I care about are those from the class of 2017 which are 5 years from the ones they are using in the rankings. Second, the class of 2012 had 327 graduates. This was at a time when law schools (all law schools) were matriculating more students than the legal job market could handle. The legal market has shown slight signs of recovery, and I think that class of 2013 employment numbers will be slightly better than that for the class of 2012 (even though c/o 2013 has 330 students -- an all time high for USD if I am not mistaken). I talked to a higher up at USD and they are planning on matriculating about 210-220 students for the c/o 2017 which I think is a great thing.

There are two schools of thought about reducing a class size. Some think that the percent of students employed in full-time JD required jobs will remain the same (i.e. c/o 2012 had 154/327 = 47% in JD required jobs, therefore c/o 2017 will have 103/220 = 47% in JD required jobs). I completely disagree with this school of thought. It makes sense for big law who have class-rank cutoffs, but this is only a small minority of the jobs that USD grads get. So, while I think big law employment at USD will remain at a stagnant 5-10% of the class, I think that JD required non-big law jobs will remain at the same number, if not even increase. Most USD grads get jobs from networking with San Diego lawyers and I don’t think that San Diego firms will be reducing their hiring too much by 2017. (Of course, there will be an influx of unemployed grads from previous years competing for these jobs, but there will also be a lot of baby boomers retiring too. Although I think the unemployed grads will outweigh the retirees, I don’t think it will be overwhelming). So even if there are, say 140 grads employed in JD required jobs for the c/o 2017 (which would be a decrease in the number of grads for c/o 2012 which many think to be the bottom of the recession) that would mean 140/220 = 64% employment score which is better than that of Davis right now who went up in the rankings. I know that this is optimistic, but it really doesn’t seem improbable at all to me.

Third (to continue the my thoughts in the first paragraph), I think that measuring employment at 9 months after graduation for schools in the second-tier and beyond is a bit unrepresentative of their potential. USD, unfortunately, does not have a stellar bar-passage rate and this greatly limits their employment numbers. For the c/o 2012, only 78% of students passed the July California bar. This means that assuming all grads took the California bar (which for obvious reasons is not true. Some don’t feel ready and postpone till February and others take bar exams for other states) only 255 grads were even eligible for JD required jobs 9 months after graduation (.78*327). When using this figure, that would mean that 60% (154/255) of grads from the c/o 2012 who were eligible for JD required full-time jobs got one. I know that 60% is still pretty shitty, but it is much better than 47%. It is also true that a 78% bar passage rate is inexcusable, but I know that many schools are taking huge steps towards providing bar prep courses and increasing their bar passage rate.

Anyways, I am sorry for such a long post, but it is for these reasons that I am not too concerned about the drop in the rankings. I know that I make a lot of “leaps” in my logic to come to the conclusions I do, and I would welcome any criticism and debate on the issue.

Good analysis.
re your first point, though, wouldn't that be true for virtually every school in U.S.? if so, it doesn't explain the drop in ranking.

[bkegslounge]

anyone here going to the admitted students/alumni event in LA on the 18th? hoping there will be a good turnout

I am. Although I just got an email yesterday confirming my attendance to the event in Irvine on the 17th even though I RSVP'd for the LA event on the 18th. I emailed them but I'm afraid it'll get lost in the general admission's inbox. I'll probably call later if I haven't heard.

[dd235]

Good analysis.
re your first point, though, wouldn't that be true for virtually every school in U.S.? if so, it doesn't explain the drop in ranking.

Ya the first point definitely applies to all law schools. Thats why I don’t put too much weight on the rankings. I do think that they are an effective “snapshot,” but should definitely be used with caution.

Another thing that I forgot to mention is how regional USD is. Comparing it nationally to some school across the nation is pretty useless. I think it is much more effective to compare it to other California schools (like I think most of us do). Seeing big drops compared to other non-California regional schools doesn’t scare me nearly as much as seeing bigger drops relative to other California schools.

[dd235]

On a lighter note, I just got an invitation to joint the c/o 2017 Facebook group.

It was in my spam folder so check there if you didn’t get one yet.

[bkegslounge]

1st seat deposit for scholarships is April 1... Do you think they would be willing to push back that date if I ask? I still haven't heard back from a few schools and want to start negotiating scholarships with schools but April is rapidly approaching.

I got them to push it back a week. Not much, but it helps.

Everyone else is either April 15 or 30 seat deposit deadlines so that extra week would definitely help. Mind sharing what you wrote?

I simply wrote that I was very interested in USD law and that I need more time to weigh all my options. I asked for an extra two weeks. That was it. Nothing too complicated.

Edit: Mind you, I only got a week, but hey. It's better than nothing. I'll know a lot more even in the span of that extra week.

Emailed Jorge Garcia. He also gave me a 1 week extension.

[bkegslounge]

Anyone going to the LA Reception event at 6pm today? Not looking forward to that drive downtown in rush hour...

[dd235]

http://www.sandiego.edu/law/careers/stu ... a-2013.php

And the results are in!!!

They are looking much better than last year... Full-time JD required jobs are up over 6% and Big Law (100+ Firms) are up nearly 3%.
Only substantial drop was clerkships.... but hey I’ll take it.

I made this chart to compare some of the key metrics from the past 3 years
http://s18.postimg.org/z90bohv8p/Screen ... _52_PM.png

[Snowboarder1588]

http://www.sandiego.edu/law/careers/stu ... a-2013.php

And the results are in!!!

They are looking much better than last year... Full-time JD required jobs are up over 6% and Big Law (100+ Firms) are up nearly 3%.
Only substantial drop was clerkships.... but hey I’ll take it.

I made this chart to compare some of the key metrics from the past 3 years
http://s18.postimg.org/z90bohv8p/Screen ... _52_PM.png

Be careful when analyzing this, because they (law schools) deceive us very well. their Full Time JD required permanent jobs are actually only about 53% of the total class. the 66% figure is a percentage of the number of graduates who reported.

[almostthere1]

In with small scholarship hoping for more but happy to be accepted. Applied early January. Low stips but a bit bummed after hearing all of these 30k+schollys going out, congrats to those of you who brought those in! Right now WUSTL, University of Denver, USD, and UC Irvine are my top four.