SMU c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013 cycle) Forum

[Ktr007]

Just fyi I applied 2/4 complete 2/11 and recieved the acceptance phone call on friday 2/22.

[wannabelawstudent]

Just fyi I applied 2/4 complete 2/11 and recieved the acceptance phone call on friday 2/22.

Hmm...you must have really good numbers...

[keyanaut]

Haven't heard from SMU yet (completed on 1/15)

But UT just called




Question, how much value does the SMU alumni base hold in Dallas if I want to end up there for the end game? Compared to UT.

[curious66]

Haven't heard from SMU yet (completed on 1/15)

But UT just called




Question, how much value does the SMU alumni base hold in Dallas if I want to end up there for the end game? Compared to UT.

GO TO UT!!! It is the best bet for Texas -- Dallas or otherwise.

[wannabelawstudent]

Haven't heard from SMU yet (completed on 1/15)

But UT just called




Question, how much value does the SMU alumni base hold in Dallas if I want to end up there for the end game? Compared to UT.

GO TO UT!!! It is the best bet for Texas -- Dallas or otherwise.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=102784
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=189170

[keyanaut]

Haven't heard from SMU yet (completed on 1/15)

But UT just called




Question, how much value does the SMU alumni base hold in Dallas if I want to end up there for the end game? Compared to UT.

GO TO UT!!! It is the best bet for Texas -- Dallas or otherwise.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=102784
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=189170

Thanks man. I have no idea what to do because my specific situation calls definitely qualifies me to be one of the rare people who should consider and favorite SMU. Wouldn't it be something if UT was in Dallas =(

[wannabelawstudent]

Thanks man. I have no idea what to do because my specific situation calls definitely qualifies me to be one of the rare people who should consider and favorite SMU. Wouldn't it be something if UT was in Dallas =(

I'd wait to hear about $$$ before you worry yourself about making a decision.

[nirvanah]

if only....UT having a campus in DFW would be something..even if they ran the program on UTA or UTD campus...for sure, DFW needs a higher ranked school than SMU

[kalvano]

if only....UT having a campus in DFW would be something..even if they ran the program on UTA or UTD campus...for sure, DFW needs a higher ranked school than SMU

No, it doesn't. Ranking is largely irrelevant when it comes to a strong regional school. If SMU dropped to 102, most of the same firms would still come to recruit there. If they suddenly jumped to a T25, they wouldn't gain many new employers (of course a ranking jump wouldn't hurt, but Susman and Cravath wouldn't suddenly come to SMU to recruit.). SMU does fine in Dallas, and is a good school compared to others at its rank.

But if you have the choice between SMU and UT and you want to end up in Texas, or even Dallas specifically, take UT. That's not saying SMU is a bad school, but UT offers quite a bit more opportunity all over the state.

Even saying that, SMU is still very well-respected in Dallas. There is an overall good perception from other attorneys about SMU grads, particularly as compared to other schools around.

[keyanaut]

I know I want to end up in Dallas specifically.

Thanks for the advice everyone.

[maxmartin]

if only....UT having a campus in DFW would be something..even if they ran the program on UTA or UTD campus...for sure, DFW needs a higher ranked school than SMU

No, it doesn't. Ranking is largely irrelevant when it comes to a strong regional school. If SMU dropped to 102, most of the same firms would still come to recruit there. If they suddenly jumped to a T25, they wouldn't gain many new employers (of course a ranking jump wouldn't hurt, but Susman and Cravath wouldn't suddenly come to SMU to recruit.). SMU does fine in Dallas, and is a good school compared to others at its rank.

But if you have the choice between SMU and UT and you want to end up in Texas, or even Dallas specifically, take UT. That's not saying SMU is a bad school, but UT offers quite a bit more opportunity all over the state.

Even saying that, SMU is still very well-respected in Dallas. There is an overall good perception from other attorneys about SMU grads, particularly as compared to other schools around.

How is IP program of SMU? And how do IP people do in terms job searching? Thanks.

[mg7]

Thanks man. I have no idea what to do because my specific situation calls definitely qualifies me to be one of the rare people who should consider and favorite SMU. Wouldn't it be something if UT was in Dallas =(

+1. I have the SMU $$ vs UT @ sticker debate in my head every day. Once (if) I get the SMU scholarship offer the decision will be easier, but I am having a really hard time leaning toward one over the other right now.

[kalvano]

How is IP program of SMU? And how do IP people do in terms job searching? Thanks.

I don't know anyone who is IP eligible that doesn't have a job. There may be a few, but I don't know of any. And there are firms still looking for entry-level attorneys in IP.

[maxmartin]

How is IP program of SMU? And how do IP people do in terms job searching? Thanks.

I don't know anyone who is IP eligible that doesn't have a job. There may be a few, but I don't know of any. And there are firms still looking for entry-level attorneys in IP.

Thanks for the info.

[keyanaut]

Thanks man. I have no idea what to do because my specific situation calls definitely qualifies me to be one of the rare people who should consider and favorite SMU. Wouldn't it be something if UT was in Dallas =(

+1. I have the SMU $$ vs UT @ sticker debate in my head every day. Once (if) I get the SMU scholarship offer the decision will be easier, but I am having a really hard time leaning toward one over the other right now.

Sounds like we're in the exact same boat. Do you live in Dallas?

Also, is it me or does it seem like UT top 20% = SMU top 10%, meaning I'll have to work harder to appear excellent at SMU. Obviously theoretically the quality of class should be harder as well, but I'm not so sure it applies exactly.

[kalvano]

Also, is it me or does it seem like UT top 20% = SMU top 10%, meaning I'll have to work harder to appear excellent at SMU.

Bingo. Probably more like top 25%-33% at UT equals top 10% at SMU. I've seen specific job postings where they say something like "SMU - top 10%, UT - top 25%, T14 - top 50%." I know you guys have an intellectual understanding that higher-ranked schools are better, but I don't advocate UT over SMU for shits and giggles. It sucks when you see job postings like that.

Obviously theoretically the quality of class should be harder as well, but I'm not so sure it applies exactly.

Utterly false. Hell, UT gets the edge for not having a shitty LRW program.


Going to UT or Cornell or whatever won't make you a better lawyer at all. All it does is set you up with the best chance of success and possible opportunities. Fair or not, the higher-ranked the school, the more chances you will have at whatever rank within the class you are.

[StylinNProfilin]

Also, is it me or does it seem like UT top 20% = SMU top 10%, meaning I'll have to work harder to appear excellent at SMU.

Bingo. Probably more like top 25%-33% at UT equals top 10% at SMU. I've seen specific job postings where they say something like "SMU - top 10%, UT - top 25%, T14 - top 50%." I know you guys have an intellectual understanding that higher-ranked schools are better, but I don't advocate UT over SMU for shits and giggles. It sucks when you see job postings like that.

Obviously theoretically the quality of class should be harder as well, but I'm not so sure it applies exactly.

Utterly false. Hell, UT gets the edge for not having a shitty LRW program.


Going to UT or Cornell or whatever won't make you a better lawyer at all. All it does is set you up with the best chance of success and possible opportunities. Fair or not, the higher-ranked the school, the more chances you will have at whatever rank within the class you are.

Whats the difference between UT's and SMU's LRW program?

[kalvano]

UT's is ungraded, I believe. Also, I believe they have less of a 1L class load.

I could be wrong about that, though, but I'm pretty sure their LRW is ungraded.

[keyanaut]

Also, is it me or does it seem like UT top 20% = SMU top 10%, meaning I'll have to work harder to appear excellent at SMU.

Bingo. Probably more like top 25%-33% at UT equals top 10% at SMU. I've seen specific job postings where they say something like "SMU - top 10%, UT - top 25%, T14 - top 50%." I know you guys have an intellectual understanding that higher-ranked schools are better, but I don't advocate UT over SMU for shits and giggles. It sucks when you see job postings like that.

Obviously theoretically the quality of class should be harder as well, but I'm not so sure it applies exactly.

Utterly false. Hell, UT gets the edge for not having a shitty LRW program.


Going to UT or Cornell or whatever won't make you a better lawyer at all. All it does is set you up with the best chance of success and possible opportunities. Fair or not, the higher-ranked the school, the more chances you will have at whatever rank within the class you are.

I'm saying that I'm more likely to be top 20% at UT and top 20% at SMU than top 50% UT and top 10% SMU. Like the quality of students doesn't matter. When I said class, I meant my ability to excel in peer ranking. Not the class material.


also, I'll be getting a JD/MBA.

Does this change anything?

[kalvano]

I'm saying that I'm more likely to be top 20% at UT and top 20% at SMU than top 50% UT and top 10% SMU. Like the quality of students doesn't matter. When I said class, I meant my ability to excel in peer ranking. Not the class material.


also, I'll be getting a JD/MBA.

Does this change anything?

You're more likely to not have any idea where you will rank. It's flat-out impossible to tell, so plan on being last.

Also, JD/MBA doesn't matter much as far as I can tell.

[swilson215]

You're more likely to not have any idea where you will rank. It's flat-out impossible to tell, so plan on being last.

Also, JD/MBA doesn't matter much as far as I can tell.

This is all 100% correct. Also, UT's LRW is ungraded, which makes 1L a lot less stressful (according to the UT students I met over the summer).

[Magnifique1908]

You're more likely to not have any idea where you will rank. It's flat-out impossible to tell, so plan on being last.

Also, JD/MBA doesn't matter much as far as I can tell.

This is all 100% correct. Also, UT's LRW is ungraded, which makes 1L a lot less stressful (according to the UT students I met over the summer).

Our LRW is definitely not ungraded and it's a full year course....Only in my dreams would that be the case

[swilson215]

Our LRW is definitely not ungraded and it's a full year course....Only in my dreams would that be the case

Hmmm, I wonder why the kids in my court said that, then. Weird. Must be nice, lol.

[kalvano]

It used to be ungraded and not require writing a brief, according to Google. That was 2010-2011, so it's a recent change I guess.

[majnana]

What kind of job offers, salary, etc can someone who actually does place top 10% at SMU expect? And when you say top 10%, is that basically just based on 1L grades? I'm under the impression that a great deal of job offers come from 2L summer employment, which is based off just that one year of grades. So is it uber-important to place top 10% in the first year, then less important 2nd and 3rd years? (I'm also under the impression that if you don't have a job offer by the start of 3L you are practically doomed to a life of doc review. Is that more or less right?)