Harvard Waitlist 2010 Forum

[MeredithGrey]

don't really like speculating, but I think we can probably guess that whoever is taken to fill dutchstriker's spot will have an LSAT that's 175+

Given the fact that I probably have the lowest LSAT of all of you on the waiting list, that's obviously not good for me. I am honored to even be waitlisted and be among all of you!

[lta]

don't really like speculating, but I think we can probably guess that whoever is taken to fill dutchstriker's spot will have an LSAT that's 175+

Given the fact that I probably have the lowest LSAT of all of you on the waiting list, that's obviously not good for me. I am honored to even be waitlisted and be among all of you!

Uh. I think being a physician is a bit more impressive than getting a 175 on the LSAT.

[blue5385]

don't really like speculating, but I think we can probably guess that whoever is taken to fill dutchstriker's spot will have an LSAT that's 175+

Given the fact that I probably have the lowest LSAT of all of you on the waiting list, that's obviously not good for me. I am honored to even be waitlisted and be among all of you!

Uh. I think being a physician is a bit more impressive than getting a 175 on the LSAT.

+180. I don't want to get yelled at for this, but IMO the medical field in general is more impressive than the legal field, both because of the scope of knowledge doctors have to possess and because they are responsible for life and death issues. Working multiple-day shifts with zero sleep as an intern when people's lives depend on your actions (which family members of mine who are doctors have had to do) blows my mind because I don't think I could ever handle that level of pressure. So MeredithGrey, I am honored to be on the waitlist with you.

[Shelley Levene]

I would be honored to get in off the waitlist before all of the great applicants in this thread.

[swampthang]

It's interesting that everyone guesses what they think will happen with Harvard's admission process. Almost no one has been correct yet whenever I read another prediction for about 6 seconds I believe it wholeheartedly lol

Yep. I'm a veritable Peter North in this regard. I just wanted to be right so bad!

[CoaltoNewCastle]

don't really like speculating, but I think we can probably guess that whoever is taken to fill dutchstriker's spot will have an LSAT that's 175+

too bad for some of us lesser mortals

Dang, that guy was in the upper part of my numbers niche. I guess they didn't think I could fill his shoes.

[Shelley Levene]

You really think that's how they do it?

I don't think they'd hesitate at this point to bring in a 170 they really like rather than a slightly less-liked 180.

[blue5385]

To add to the baseless speculation ITT, I doubt they'll pull anyone with one subpar number off the WL (and even though 170 is objectively a good score, in the context of HLS it's subpar). This hurts me, with my low GPA, as much as the low LSAT people, but I really think it's true.

[Shelley Levene]

Wasn't there a a non-URM chick just last week who got in with a 166?

I think the lower number people actually now have a better chance than ever, because they made it to the waitlist - likely for reasons other than the numbers. The high number people - well, they're on the WL for probably the exact same non-numbers reasons.

[swampthang]

To add to the baseless speculation ITT, I doubt they'll pull anyone with one subpar number off the WL (and even though 170 is objectively a good score, in the context of HLS it's subpar). This hurts me, with my low GPA, as much as the low LSAT people, but I really think it's true.

I disagree. There are TLSers (even non-URMs) who have been getting in with as low as a 166. You're here. You made it to the WL. That means that they've gone over the strengths and weaknesses of your file and there's something about you that they like enough to keep you around. Do I think they look to replace what they lose? Somewhat. But do I think there are any of us who are guaranteed not to get into because of a low LSAT/GPA/whatever? Absolutely not, otherwise they would've just saved you the trouble and rejected you outright.

[blue5385]

@Shelley Levene: That's true. Her app sounded unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person. IMO, these are the people they really liked due to their softs but were hesitant to accept outright because of the numbers. I think the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy than the first set in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose, mostly to Yale.)

[swampthang]

That's true. Her app did sound unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person, and the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose mostly to Yale.)

But who's to say they lose high numbers to Y/S? 1. Yale has a lower 25% LSAT so that might suggest that Yale's WL pulls are numerically at the margin so H might be looking to replace with lower LSATs. Stanford's LSAT range is vastly inferior which suggests a pull from H to S probably wouldn't need a high LSAT either. 2. Y/S probably did exactly what you just said about H, that they pulled people with "some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers" so again, H would be looking to replace them. I really don't think we can say one way or another what H has lost and what they will be looking to replace. Maybe it's LSATs, maybe it's joint degrees, maybe it's gay farmers-- it's near-impossible to ascertain.

[kmap]

@Shelley Levene: That's true. Her app sounded unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person. IMO, these are the people they really liked due to their softs but were hesitant to accept outright because of the numbers. I think the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy than the first set in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose, mostly to Yale.)

I like to think that I have a certain "je ne sais quoi." I think it was a combination of my personal story, my commitment to public interest work (as demonstrated by a year's worth of heavy volunteer/community work), and a bunch of really strong recommendations. My college major is also somewhat of a novelty this day and age ... who knows, maybe they were impressed by my knowledge of dead languages?

[blue5385]

That's true. Her app did sound unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person, and the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose mostly to Yale.)

But who's to say they lose high numbers to Y/S? 1. Yale has a lower 25% LSAT so that might suggest that Yale's WL pulls are numerically at the margin so H might be looking to replace with lower LSATs. Stanford's LSAT range is vastly inferior which suggests a pull from H to S probably wouldn't need a high LSAT either. 2. Y/S probably did exactly what you just said about H, that they pulled people with "some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers" so again, H would be looking to replace them. I really don't think we can say one way or another what H has lost and what they will be looking to replace. Maybe it's LSATs, maybe it's joint degrees, maybe it's gay farmers-- it's near-impossible to ascertain.

true. hence the reason why all this debate is pointless.

I don't think people with unusual softs can really be replaced since they are unique. If HLS lost a low-LSAT person with a really cool, different soft to YLS or SLS, the chances that they'll find another person with similar qualifications on the WL aren't too high. In that case, I don't think they would immediately turn to another waitlisted person with an strong or unusual soft, since softs are not interchangeable IMO. Since it'll be hard for them to find a replacement for a person with unique softs from the waitlist, my thinking is that they are likely to turn to the waitlist for the type of candidate they generally choose: the person with a great LSAT and GPA.

Also, I don't think the LSAT percentiles for either SLS and YLS have much to do with the people those schools pull from the waitlist, since the percentiles are by and large established by the admits they outright accept.

edit: My post kinda read like strong softs and high numbers were mutually exclusive, which they are not...people with both have the best chance of all, obviously!

[blue5385]

@Shelley Levene: That's true. Her app sounded unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person. IMO, these are the people they really liked due to their softs but were hesitant to accept outright because of the numbers. I think the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy than the first set in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose, mostly to Yale.)

I like to think that I have a certain "je ne sais quoi." I think it was a combination of my personal story, my commitment to public interest work (as demonstrated by a year's worth of heavy volunteer/community work), and a bunch of really strong recommendations. My college major is also somewhat of a novelty this day and age ... who knows, maybe they were impressed by my knowledge of dead languages?

classics FTW!

[kmap]

@Shelley Levene: That's true. Her app sounded unusual based on the PS she didn't want to discuss.

My reasoning was based on the fact that after the initial WL pull last week, the people who will now get in (if any) will mostly be pulled off the WL to compensate for Y/S WL--->admits who jumped ship (and maybe a to fill a couple spots freed up by deferrals). Those people (esp. the Yale WL--->admits) will likely have excellent numbers, so HLS will need waitlisted candidates with excellent numbers to fill the spots with minimal GPA/LSAT median fluctuations. I'm sure this prediction is flawed in some way, but that's my take on the situation.

(edit: @swampthang, for the reasons above, I think the set of people they pulled initially is the one where people are more likely to have some unusual soft or qualification that recommends them above and beyond their numbers, including the 166 person. IMO, these are the people they really liked due to their softs but were hesitant to accept outright because of the numbers. I think the set of people they will pull from the WL from here on will be more numbers-heavy than the first set in order to replace the people with high numbers they will lose, mostly to Yale.)

I like to think that I have a certain "je ne sais quoi." I think it was a combination of my personal story, my commitment to public interest work (as demonstrated by a year's worth of heavy volunteer/community work), and a bunch of really strong recommendations. My college major is also somewhat of a novelty this day and age ... who knows, maybe they were impressed by my knowledge of dead languages?

classics FTW!

No matter what though, it's not like speculating will help because the factors that got us stragglers in are just that--unique. Even if you could replicate someone's exact combination of softs, it's no guarantee ... some of us just came along at the right time with the right hook and got our admission in a way that probably can't be duplicated. No sense in debating or analyzing, since there's no real way to break down the hows and whys of such things.

That said, I'm sure there will end up being a handful of additional admits as the summer rolls on. Good luck, everybody! If it happened for me, it could happen for you, too!

[clintonius]

I'm inclined to side with kmap here in that I think any further admits will be basically at JR's whim. At this point in the game, it's hard to see how Harvard losing a few high LSATs or GPAs will affect their percentiles at all.

Of course, that doesn't mean that JR's whims will not be predicated largely on shiny, near-perfect scores and grades.

[CoaltoNewCastle]

Hoping maybe I can fill the Staten Island niche. Of course that's just where my college is located. Should be good enough though, I live off campus now.

[CoaltoNewCastle]

I'm inclined to side with kmap here in that I think any further admits will be basically at JR's whim. At this point in the game, it's hard to see how Harvard losing a few high LSATs or GPAs will affect their percentiles at all.

Of course, that doesn't mean that JR's whims will not be predicated largely on shiny, near-perfect scores and grades.

That's the thing though, they could lose five people with LSATs of 177+ and not have their percentiles change even a bit, but then suddenly have the percentiles shift at the loss of a sixth. Unlike with GPA, which is broken down to smaller degrees, LSAT is a "straw that broke the camel's back" statistic.

[blue5385]

Seriously contemplating withdrawing from the WL. I'm starting to get really excited about CLS, & the reality is simultaneously starting to set in that I am never going to get into HLS. Probably won't do it though, because I don't want to wonder "what if" in the future.

[swampthang]

Seriously contemplating withdrawing from the WL. I'm starting to get really excited about CLS, & the reality is simultaneously starting to set in that I am never going to get into HLS. Probably won't do it though, because I don't want to wonder "what if" in the future.

Well at some point it makes sense to WD. As Dean Deal said in her blog, if you have certain hard deadlines then there's no sense waiting around past the point. If you have no such deadlines, it can't hurt to stay on unless you think it will seriously and adversely affect your psyche as you try to get hyped up for where you will most likely be this fall. I actually wrestled with a similar issue regarding the Stanford WL. It's still causing me a lot of itnernal anguish because I just don't really think I would accept an offer and feel bad about staying on the WL under somewhat 'false' pretenses. But that's a personal decision.

[blue5385]

Seriously contemplating withdrawing from the WL. I'm starting to get really excited about CLS, & the reality is simultaneously starting to set in that I am never going to get into HLS. Probably won't do it though, because I don't want to wonder "what if" in the future.

Well at some point it makes sense to WD. As Dean Deal said in her blog, if you have certain hard deadlines then there's no sense waiting around past the point. If you have no such deadlines, it can't hurt to stay on unless you think it will seriously and adversely affect your psyche as you try to get hyped up for where you will most likely be this fall. I actually wrestled with a similar issue regarding the Stanford WL. It's still causing me a lot of itnernal anguish because I just don't really think I would accept an offer and feel bad about staying on the WL under somewhat 'false' pretenses. But that's a personal decision.

Not sure in which sense you mean hard deadlines (maybe being required to withdraw any pending apps by the school where you put down your deposit by a certain point?). I'd probably be moving to law school around the same time for either HLS or CLS, so a Harvard acceptance wouldn't change the timing of my plans. I definitely agree that there's no harm in staying on the waitlist, and I probably will do so for that reason as well as for not wanting to have any regrets or what-ifs. I will 100% attend if accepted, so the decision to stay on the waitlist is not difficult for me from that angle.

Re the Stanford waitlist, if you really don't think you'd go, maybe withdraw just so it's one more school to cross off your list? However, even if you get accepted and don't go, you're not really going to be doing much harm to anyone. They'll find someone to take the spot in a second, so I don't think you have to feel bad even if you do stay on.

[of Benito Cereno]

Seriously contemplating withdrawing from the WL. I'm starting to get really excited about CLS, & the reality is simultaneously starting to set in that I am never going to get into HLS. Probably won't do it though, because I don't want to wonder "what if" in the future.

out of curiosity, if you were to eventually withdraw from CLS, would you get your housing deposit back?

[blue5385]

Seriously contemplating withdrawing from the WL. I'm starting to get really excited about CLS, & the reality is simultaneously starting to set in that I am never going to get into HLS. Probably won't do it though, because I don't want to wonder "what if" in the future.

out of curiosity, if you were to eventually withdraw from CLS, would you get your housing deposit back?

Not sure. I haven't gotten my housing offer yet so I don't have the terms of the deposit, but unfortunately I think not. UAH seems like it's being pretty inflexible about housing offers (only giving people 5 days to accept and come up with a thousand dollars).

edit: Got my offer & saw the terms of the housing deposit. It is non-refundable (so that would be over 2k down the drain for switching from CLS to HLS, not to mention the $500 initial deposit we paid when we accepted admission).

[Hattori Hanzo]

Deposit + first month rent that you pay to CLS are both non-refundable.