American University- WCL c/o 2017 Applicants Forum

cronous · Post by **cronous** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:22 am

vthokies88 wrote:
First, I encourage all prospective students to look at the ABA's employment statistics. In 2012, 196 students out of 463 had bar passage required jobs (42.33%). Of those, 180 were full-time long term. Another 120 jobs were JD-preferred (25.92%). Don't just look at USNWR...... GW as a whole (not just the law school) has become an expert at scamming rankings.

To be fair every school scams the rankings. This whole business of JD Advantage/Preferred is frankly a scam. Remember these jobs do not require an actual JD, rather it is simply the school's opinion that a law degree confers some "advantage" in getting these jobs. Some examples of “JD Advantage” jobs are an FBI agent, an accountant, an talent/sports agent, and a human resources manager. I seriously doubt that JD made significant improvement in your chances of becoming an accountant (probably that Bachelors in Accounting is what really did it for you). But of course law degrees are "versatile" and are needed in almost every profession.

BankruptMe · Post by **BankruptMe** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:31 am

I dont know maybe I am old school.

But I am going to go to law school to be an actual lawyer, clerk, work for the fed gov in a legal role and at the very bottom ADA/PD.

Most students have no clue why they are going to law school. I have visited AU and from what I here, there and GW, a lot of people are CLUELESS about law, the legal job market and they think their law degree is an entry point to politics. And when you ask them what is "working in politics," they have no clue what that even means. And at AU, there is a focus on "public international law." I remember in my tour group there was ivy league students saying they love that AU focuses on that. If I never would have visited, and saw it for myself, I would not have applied. For instance, at the job I worked at, I know a girl who said she didnt know what to do with her life next, she had a 3.9 GPA.....well, guess where she is at law school now....

I even asked about corporate law, and they said "oh, a lot of people dont really pursue that here...." and shot me a dirty look. lmao. So I think part of the lack of jobs is that the students do not know how to hustle, or they are in law school to find themselves.

ajl17 · Post by **ajl17** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:44 am

I just want to say this for the other people who are excited about AU and to bring some positivity into this thread: as someone who has been living in DC for awhile, I have met many many AU alumni who are using their law degree as lawyers, and they all loved being at AU. If you want to do public interest law, either working for federal government or at a non-profit, AU definitely produces those kinds of graduates. I do agree AU does have bit too much of an international focus, which I am not interested in at all, but it seems like its because they boast their SIS school. WCL is well known in DC for producing great Public Interest Lawyers, and employers trust and like AU students. I also have not met any of these "lazy" students that people keep talking about, but maybe because those are the kinds of people who do not show up at events or talk about their interests. At the same time, I know current students are upset about what the administration is doing, as they should be.

rodmanhust · Post by **rodmanhust** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:38 pm

Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?

BankruptMe · Post by **BankruptMe** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:54 pm

rodmanhust wrote:Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?

au is not really an IP school..someone correct me if im wrong

you need gw for that

Fretter31 · Post by **Fretter31** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:57 pm

BankruptMe wrote:I dont know maybe I am old school.

But I am going to go to law school to be an actual lawyer, clerk, work for the fed gov in a legal role and at the very bottom ADA/PD.

Most students have no clue why they are going to law school. I have visited AU and from what I here, there and GW, a lot of people are CLUELESS about law, the legal job market and they think their law degree is an entry point to politics. And when you ask them what is "working in politics," they have no clue what that even means. And at AU, there is a focus on "public international law." I remember in my tour group there was ivy league students saying they love that AU focuses on that. If I never would have visited, and saw it for myself, I would not have applied. For instance, at the job I worked at, I know a girl who said she didnt know what to do with her life next, she had a 3.9 GPA.....well, guess where she is at law school now....

I even asked about corporate law, and they said "oh, a lot of people dont really pursue that here...." and shot me a dirty look. lmao. So I think part of the lack of jobs is that the students do not know how to hustle, or they are in law school to find themselves.

I would agree with that statement if WCL was anywhere else in the country. DC, though to be fair, does have a different sent of rules when it comes to what you can do with a law degree. (WITH THE CAVEAT THAT YOU NETWORK AND HAVE CONNECTIONS). Again, I am not advocating taking on insane debt just to work on a campaign. But, a law degree CAN open doors on the Hill, at a think tank (especially if paired with an MPP), or at a government relations firm. And those jobs are nothing to poo poo either. The best paid lawyers in DC are not traditional BigLaw Partners. They are lobbyists. I know a number of folks with law degrees on the Hill who could easily earn a BigLaw salary if they shift to the private sector.

My point is this, do LIMIT the amount of debt you take on during law school. DO NOT think that a law degree is strictly legal in DC. Anywhere else, that is true. I will say, lastly, these kinds of jobs can often be HARDER than traditional legal jobs to secure. They often rely more on connections, networking, and, of course, the right political views. But they do exist, and a law degree can give you the edge to secure them.

vthokies88 · Post by **vthokies88** » Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:30 pm

BankruptMe wrote:
rodmanhust wrote:Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?
au is not really an IP school..someone correct me if im wrong

you need gw for that

Wrong - AU has a pretty good IP program and fantastic professors. People on TLS need to realize that there is more than one school with good programs in any given subject. GW is prob #1 or 2, but AU (and I think Mason) have great programs too. I'm not taking IP classes, but the IP profs also teach Property. Look up Jorge Contreras. He is a leading IP scholar. There are a number of IP firms that do OCI at AU, including Sterne Kessler and Finnegan. If you do IP at AU, look at taking the IP seminar-type thing at Loyola (I think that's the school). It's supposed to be fantastic. You DO NOT have to go to GW though - people say the same thing about government contracts...look at any big law firm that does gov't contracts, and you will see that's not true.

Fretter31 · Post by **Fretter31** » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:31 am

vthokies88 wrote:
BankruptMe wrote:
rodmanhust wrote:Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?
au is not really an IP school..someone correct me if im wrong

you need gw for that
Wrong - AU has a pretty good IP program and fantastic professors. People on TLS need to realize that there is more than one school with good programs in any given subject. GW is prob #1 or 2, but AU (and I think Mason) have great programs too. I'm not taking IP classes, but the IP profs also teach Property. Look up Jorge Contreras. He is a leading IP scholar. There are a number of IP firms that do OCI at AU, including Sterne Kessler and Finnegan. If you do IP at AU, look at taking the IP seminar-type thing at Loyola (I think that's the school). It's supposed to be fantastic. You DO NOT have to go to GW though - people say the same thing about government contracts...look at any big law firm that does gov't contracts, and you will see that's not true.

I can't speak for IP at GW, but if Government Contracts is your thing and you are 100% sure that it is your thing, you should absolute go to GW and nowhere else. And it's not even close. That's one of the big reasons I transferred after 1L. I found my calling in government contracting, and ran with it. It is probably the only school in the country with a journal dedicated to the topic, plus there is the Nash/Cibnic report, the GovCon Moot Court competition, and the LLM program. The professors as well (Gordon, Papson, Yukins) have all practiced, both in the private and public sector. But the biggest thing IMO is the fact that they offer over a dozen courses each year on the subject. WCL only has one. Procurement and acquisition is such a specialty field and I would think firms would notice such a disparity.

vthokies88 · Post by **vthokies88** » Sat Mar 15, 2014 10:26 pm

Fretter31 wrote:
vthokies88 wrote:
BankruptMe wrote:
rodmanhust wrote:Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?
au is not really an IP school..someone correct me if im wrong

you need gw for that
Wrong - AU has a pretty good IP program and fantastic professors. People on TLS need to realize that there is more than one school with good programs in any given subject. GW is prob #1 or 2, but AU (and I think Mason) have great programs too. I'm not taking IP classes, but the IP profs also teach Property. Look up Jorge Contreras. He is a leading IP scholar. There are a number of IP firms that do OCI at AU, including Sterne Kessler and Finnegan. If you do IP at AU, look at taking the IP seminar-type thing at Loyola (I think that's the school). It's supposed to be fantastic. You DO NOT have to go to GW though - people say the same thing about government contracts...look at any big law firm that does gov't contracts, and you will see that's not true.
I can't speak for IP at GW, but if Government Contracts is your thing and you are 100% sure that it is your thing, you should absolute go to GW and nowhere else. And it's not even close. That's one of the big reasons I transferred after 1L. I found my calling in government contracting, and ran with it. It is probably the only school in the country with a journal dedicated to the topic, plus there is the Nash/Cibnic report, the GovCon Moot Court competition, and the LLM program. The professors as well (Gordon, Papson, Yukins) have all practiced, both in the private and public sector. But the biggest thing IMO is the fact that they offer over a dozen courses each year on the subject. WCL only has one. Procurement and acquisition is such a specialty field and I would think firms would notice such a disparity.

Fretter - not to be a jerk (and I'm really not trying to be one) - did you get a summer associateship anywhere? I know someone who went from AU to GTown, and he has nothing. I know another person who went from AU to GW, and he has something at a small law firm in NY. I'm curious as to whether people who left got what they were looking for.

On another note, the anti-AU trance is unbelievable. I get the complaints about employment rates, and that's totally legitimate. But the notion that any single school in the US is the ONLY place to go for a certain degree is BS (no pun intended). While you're correct that GW has the #1 Government Contracts Program (I didn't argue against that), the AU Government Contracts course is taught by a former Armed Services Board of Contract Appeals judge and another lawyer who, in addition to other aspects of his illustrious career, is a member of the Procurement Roundtable. Guess what...they didn't go to GW...I hope you wouldn't tell an AU or Georgetown grad working in government contracts that you're better than him/her because you went to GW.... I encourage people interested in government contracts (or any field) to go look up professionals on law firm websites. Only 3 out of 20 lawyers in Venable's Government Contracts Practice went to GW. Two went to AU. Look at McKenna Long (a big law firm with one of the preeminent government contracts practices) - they have almost 100 government contracts lawyers...around 15 went to GW. And go beyond big law firms - the General Counsel of Lockheed Martin is an AU grad. The former Booz Allen General Counsel is an AU grad. We're talking big players in Government Contracts...

hsrc · Post by **hsrc** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:12 am

anyone apply using a feb 2014 lsat score and hear back yet?

haus · Post by **haus** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:27 am

hsrc wrote:anyone apply using a feb 2014 lsat score and hear back yet?

Still waiting.

hsrc · Post by **hsrc** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:34 am

haus wrote:
hsrc wrote:anyone apply using a feb 2014 lsat score and hear back yet?
Still waiting.

Apply anywhere else in the DC area with a feb score and hear back?

haus · Post by **haus** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:42 am

hsrc wrote: Apply anywhere else in the DC area with a feb score and hear back?

pm'd

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:16 am

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BankruptMe · Post by **BankruptMe** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:51 am

Still waiting also. Other than a date change...silence

hsrc · Post by **hsrc** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 10:36 am

PourMeTea wrote:
hsrc wrote:anyone apply using a feb 2014 lsat score and hear back yet?
ya on friday

Mind if I ask if it was A/W/R?

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:16 am

Post removed.

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:16 am

Post removed.

auwcl123 · Post by **auwcl123** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:20 am

Just got my PIPS rejection on Thursday evening, too. I sent in my application before their original January 15th deadline.

Still deciding if I'm going to put my seat deposit down. It doesn't help that they dropped 16 spots the week I found out I'm not getting the scholarship... Now I have to talk myself into paying sticker for a "worse" school.

I've seen it posted here before but can't seem to dig it up... what organization/site does the reputation rankings? Because AU is a regional school, I'm aware that certain aspects of the ratings drop are perhaps less relevant.

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:22 am

Post removed.

haus · Post by **haus** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:25 am

Good luck with the rest of your cycle Tea!

hsrc · Post by **hsrc** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:38 am

PourMeTea wrote:Oh. Accepted

Mail or email?

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:58 am

Post removed.

PourMeTea · Post by **PourMeTea** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:58 am

Post removed.

rodmanhust · Post by **rodmanhust** » Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:37 pm

vthokies88 wrote:
BankruptMe wrote:
rodmanhust wrote:Hi Fellow applicants
Admitted with interest in IP law;

IP law at WCL is ranked #7 in U.S.
Is it really that good? special programs?
or ranking is off?
au is not really an IP school..someone correct me if im wrong

you need gw for that
Wrong - AU has a pretty good IP program and fantastic professors. People on TLS need to realize that there is more than one school with good programs in any given subject. GW is prob #1 or 2, but AU (and I think Mason) have great programs too. I'm not taking IP classes, but the IP profs also teach Property. Look up Jorge Contreras. He is a leading IP scholar. There are a number of IP firms that do OCI at AU, including Sterne Kessler and Finnegan. If you do IP at AU, look at taking the IP seminar-type thing at Loyola (I think that's the school). It's supposed to be fantastic. You DO NOT have to go to GW though - people say the same thing about government contracts...look at any big law firm that does gov't contracts, and you will see that's not true.

Thanks for the helpful info.
actually I was accepted by Loyola as well; but would favor DC over Chicago.