SMU 2011 Forum

[KAM]

165/3.62. White as can be. Yes, applied 9/1 at smu.

Yeah you're in, for sure. What other schools are you applying to? Is SMU your first choice?

[Burgstaller04]

Any of the current students or anyone else have any info on what my numbers would need to be to be competitive for a Sumner's?

[b.gump81]

I just sent in my application! Excited but nervous. Not as secure as I would like to be with my score but I'm just hoping my GPA will do it for me. If worse comes to worst I will either go to Texas Tech or consider taking LSAT again in summer and apply next year, just hope I wont have too. Does anyone know the date that EA decisions are made?

you'll get money at tech, which has low tuition to begin with...id suggest you not listen to a smu 1l's advice about other texas schools and make decisions on your own...go to lubbock, take a tour, and then decide on your own whether you want to take a year off or not

good luck

[CMDantes]

I just sent in my application! Excited but nervous. Not as secure as I would like to be with my score but I'm just hoping my GPA will do it for me. If worse comes to worst I will either go to Texas Tech or consider taking LSAT again in summer and apply next year, just hope I wont have too. Does anyone know the date that EA decisions are made?

you'll get money at tech, which has low tuition to begin with...id suggest you not listen to a smu 1l's advice about other texas schools and make decisions on your own...go to lubbock, take a tour, and then decide on your own whether you want to take a year off or not

good luck

Just chiming in as a long time Texas resident who spent a year of undergrad in Lubbock.

Lubbock is fucking terrible. I've never hated a place in Texas more than I hated Lubbock. Texas Tech and the administration is okay, but not enough to endure the ultra conservative, boring, barren wasteland that is Lubbock. Why anyone would choose to go to Tech over SMU boggles my mind.

It seems like Tech grads would have limited employment opportunities too, considering Texas law firms have many other higher-ranked options. I'll let someone more experienced in the subject say something about that though.

[Capitol A]

[quote]What other schools are you applying to? Is SMU your first choice?
[quote="Capitol A"]

Right now I would say SMU is sort of tied for being my first choice, along with W&M, and Loyola Chicago. Ultimately it will end up being a financial decision. There are pros and cons for all 3, and I applied to 9 other schools as well. I wish I had a clear first choice, but I'm still having trouble making that decision.

[KAM]

I just sent in my application! Excited but nervous. Not as secure as I would like to be with my score but I'm just hoping my GPA will do it for me. If worse comes to worst I will either go to Texas Tech or consider taking LSAT again in summer and apply next year, just hope I wont have too. Does anyone know the date that EA decisions are made?

you'll get money at tech, which has low tuition to begin with...id suggest you not listen to a smu 1l's advice about other texas schools and make decisions on your own...go to lubbock, take a tour, and then decide on your own whether you want to take a year off or not

good luck

Just chiming in as a long time Texas resident who spent a year of undergrad in Lubbock.

Lubbock is fucking terrible. I've never hated a place in Texas more than I hated Lubbock. Texas Tech and the administration is okay, but not enough to endure the ultra conservative, boring, barren wasteland that is Lubbock. Why anyone would choose to go to Tech over SMU boggles my mind.

It seems like Tech grads would have limited employment opportunities too, considering Texas law firms have many other higher-ranked options. I'll let someone more experienced in the subject say something about that though.

Yeah, I'm not crazy about Lubbock and if money wasn't an issue I wouldn't even consider it. But, my parents paid for my undergrad degree so unfortunately I will have to pay for law school on my own and since I don't have $150,000 laying around I will have to take out loans. I plan on living in the Dallas/Ft worth area after graduating and correct me if I'm wrong but I talked to a lawyer who said even though SMU places well in the Dallas area, I would have better chances of getting a job in Dallas if I was in the top 10% of the class at Tech compared to just being average at SMU. Does anyone know how true this is? SMU is still my first choice by far but I just know it is going to be a tough decision if I am accepted at both schools but offered a lot of money at Tech.

[Marionberry]

Yeah, I'm not crazy about Lubbock and if money wasn't an issue I wouldn't even consider it. But, my parents paid for my undergrad degree so unfortunately I will have to pay for law school on my own and since I don't have $150,000 laying around I will have to take out loans. I plan on living in the Dallas/Ft worth area after graduating and correct me if I'm wrong but I talked to a lawyer who said even though SMU places well in the Dallas area, I would have better chances of getting a job in Dallas if I was in the top 10% of the class at Tech compared to just being average at SMU. Does anyone know how true this is? SMU is still my first choice by far but I just know it is going to be a tough decision if I am accepted at both schools but offered a lot of money at Tech.

Do you really feel like your score represents your potential on the LSAT? If you could reasonably expect a decent jump in your score you may really want to consider a retake. I know you don't want to take it again, and I don't blame you. However, if you could jump up to the mid 160s you could probably get decent money from SMU. Think of it like this: would the hassle and stress of prepping again and retaking be worth $50,000 or possibly more? As it is, your chances at SMU are okay, but not great and the likelihood of a waitlist-->admit isn't something you can count on.

As for what the attorney told you about job prospects in Dallas from SMU v. Texas Tech, that may or may not be true. However, don't count on top 10% at Tech being an easy feat. Lower tier schools are notoriously competitive, and I doubt Tech is any different. SMU is a far better choice unless you really love West Texas/the Panhandle, and the hassle of a retake may very well be your best choice.

[KAM]

Another thing I have to consider is the average starting salary of graduates at both schools. TLS says class of 2008's average private practice first-year salary is $115,909. While Tech's median private sector salary is $55,000. So even though I would be in MUCH more debt if I went to SMU, my income (factoring in my debt) will still be higher at SMU. Does anyone know if these numbers are still somewhat accurate? What is the difference between private practice and private sector? I know the economy is a lot different today than it was in 2008 but I guess I'm assuming if an SMU graduate's average starting salary has decreased than so has a Tech graduate's starting salary.

[kalvano]

I just sent in my application! Excited but nervous. Not as secure as I would like to be with my score but I'm just hoping my GPA will do it for me. If worse comes to worst I will either go to Texas Tech or consider taking LSAT again in summer and apply next year, just hope I wont have too. Does anyone know the date that EA decisions are made?

you'll get money at tech, which has low tuition to begin with...id suggest you not listen to a smu 1l's advice about other texas schools and make decisions on your own...go to lubbock, take a tour, and then decide on your own whether you want to take a year off or not

good luck

Nope, don't listen to an SMU 1L...listen to a 30 year old with business and real world experience whose entire family consists of lawyers.

Tech is an awful choice, even if it's free.

[kalvano]

I would have better chances of getting a job in Dallas if I was in the top 10% of the class at Tech compared to just being average at SMU. Does anyone know how true this is?

1) No, it's not true. Not even close.

2) Don't ever, ever, ever, ever go anywhere with the idea that you'll be in the top 10%.

[kalvano]

Another thing I have to consider is the average starting salary of graduates at both schools. TLS says class of 2008's average private practice first-year salary is $115,909. While Tech's median private sector salary is $55,000. So even though I would be in MUCH more debt if I went to SMU, my income (factoring in my debt) will still be higher at SMU. Does anyone know if these numbers are still somewhat accurate? What is the difference between private practice and private sector? I know the economy is a lot different today than it was in 2008 but I guess I'm assuming if an SMU graduate's average starting salary has decreased than so has a Tech graduate's starting salary.

I think they said the salary dropped to around $100K. SMU places well into several large Dallas firms, which is why they have such a higher number.

[Capitol A]

Kalvano-
i am so glad i've been reading your posts. You seem to love smu, and you have really reignited my desire to attend. Thanks.

[KAM]

Yeah, I'm not crazy about Lubbock and if money wasn't an issue I wouldn't even consider it. But, my parents paid for my undergrad degree so unfortunately I will have to pay for law school on my own and since I don't have $150,000 laying around I will have to take out loans. I plan on living in the Dallas/Ft worth area after graduating and correct me if I'm wrong but I talked to a lawyer who said even though SMU places well in the Dallas area, I would have better chances of getting a job in Dallas if I was in the top 10% of the class at Tech compared to just being average at SMU. Does anyone know how true this is? SMU is still my first choice by far but I just know it is going to be a tough decision if I am accepted at both schools but offered a lot of money at Tech.

Do you really feel like your score represents your potential on the LSAT? If you could reasonably expect a decent jump in your score you may really want to consider a retake. I know you don't want to take it again, and I don't blame you. However, if you could jump up to the mid 160s you could probably get decent money from SMU. Think of it like this: would the hassle and stress of prepping again and retaking be worth $50,000 or possibly more? As it is, your chances at SMU are okay, but not great and the likelihood of a waitlist-->admit isn't something you can count on.

As for what the attorney told you about job prospects in Dallas from SMU v. Texas Tech, that may or may not be true. However, don't count on top 10% at Tech being an easy feat. Lower tier schools are notoriously competitive, and I doubt Tech is any different. SMU is a far better choice unless you really love West Texas/the Panhandle, and the hassle of a retake may very well be your best choice.

Yeah a retake would be worth it but I would retake it in the summer and that would hold me back a year. I know I could score higher because my practice test avergae was greater than my score. I thought about retaking in December but if I'm going to take it again I want to give it everything I have and I know these next 6 weeks would not give me that chance because this is the busiest time of year for work (which will allow me to save up a lot of money) and my family travels during Thanksgiving. So I was wondering what's better...holding off a year (maybe/maybe not get scholarship money) and not start making money until 2015 or starting next year (paying full tuition) and begin making money in 2014? A majority of that extra years salary could go towards my loans. I just don't know what's my better option.

[KAM]

Kalvano-
i am so glad i've been reading your posts. You seem to love smu, and you have really reignited my desire to attend. Thanks.

Yeah, thanks for responding Kalvano! Any advice I can get is gretaly appreciated!!

[Capitol A]

I think they said the salary dropped to around $100K. SMU places well into several large Dallas firms, which is why they have such a higher number.

I know we have mainly been discussing SMU v. other TX schools, but when you look at these salary numbers, particularly compared to schools in other states, there are a few extremely important things to keep in mind:
-The economy in TX has not taken quite as much of a hit as a lot of other states (think CA)
-No state income tax in TX (this HUGE when compared to states like MA and NY-I think in NY you have to pay a tax to flush the toilet now)
-Cost of living can be somewhat lower in Dallas than other big cities- a LOT lower than Chicago, LA, S.F., NY, Boston, and DC.

[kalvano]

Kalvano-
i am so glad i've been reading your posts. You seem to love smu, and you have really reignited my desire to attend. Thanks.

Yeah, thanks for responding Kalvano! Any advice I can get is gretaly appreciated!!

Not really, I just don't want to do my Torts / Civ Pro reading.

[Capitol A]

Well, I appreciate a fellow procrastinator then.

[Thirteen]

Kalvano-
i am so glad i've been reading your posts. You seem to love smu, and you have really reignited my desire to attend. Thanks.

Yeah, thanks for responding Kalvano! Any advice I can get is gretaly appreciated!!

Not really, I just don't want to do my Torts / Civ Pro reading.

+1

I might come to Civ Pro late on Tuesday so I won't have to hear Martinez bash the Horns for 10 minutes.

[mbusch22]

Another thing I have to consider is the average starting salary of graduates at both schools. TLS says class of 2008's average private practice first-year salary is $115,909. While Tech's median private sector salary is $55,000. So even though I would be in MUCH more debt if I went to SMU, my income (factoring in my debt) will still be higher at SMU. Does anyone know if these numbers are still somewhat accurate? What is the difference between private practice and private sector? I know the economy is a lot different today than it was in 2008 but I guess I'm assuming if an SMU graduate's average starting salary has decreased than so has a Tech graduate's starting salary.

Don't put too much trust in law school salary and employment numbers. They're usually inflated and skewed. Start reading AboveTheLaw (any post by Elie), or read about the current legal market in general before you get too excited about any sort of starting salary you think you're gonna get after graduation.

But yes, tech=TTT. Bad idea.

[ebo]

Finishing up my app now for full-time early action. SMU is my first choice.

3.1
166
non-URM
2 yrs. WE

You all seem pretty knowledgeable, what would you say my chances are, and (if they're good) what kind of scholarship $$ would I be looking at? I looked at LSN but I realize that it's very self-selective- also, will this cycle of admissions be considerably harder than last year, or can we expect about the same results?

Good luck everyone

[bergg007]

What're my chances for SMU 2.89 UGPA real GPA is 3.2 with a 167 on the october LSAT. I just applied I have mid-weak softs. Sent in a decent diversity statement, but I'm a white dude, just had different experiences. Help me out! Lawschoolnumbers.com gives me hope but what do you think? SMU is my absolute first choice.

[Burgstaller04]

Finishing up my app now for full-time early action. SMU is my first choice.

3.1
166
non-URM
2 yrs. WE

You all seem pretty knowledgeable, what would you say my chances are, and (if they're good) what kind of scholarship $$ would I be looking at? I looked at LSN but I realize that it's very self-selective- also, will this cycle of admissions be considerably harder than last year, or can we expect about the same results?

Good luck everyone

What're my chances for SMU 2.89 UGPA real GPA is 3.2 with a 167 on the october LSAT. I just applied I have mid-weak softs. Sent in a decent diversity statement, but I'm a white dude, just had different experiences. Help me out! Lawschoolnumbers.com gives me hope but what do you think? SMU is my absolute first choice.

I think the LSAT's will make up for low GPA's for both of you. I would say you are both gonna get in but I wouldn't expect much money.

[kalvano]

Finishing up my app now for full-time early action. SMU is my first choice.

3.1
166
non-URM
2 yrs. WE

You all seem pretty knowledgeable, what would you say my chances are, and (if they're good) what kind of scholarship $$ would I be looking at? I looked at LSN but I realize that it's very self-selective- also, will this cycle of admissions be considerably harder than last year, or can we expect about the same results?

Good luck everyone

Yes, good. Probably $22K - $25K a year.

[kalvano]

What're my chances for SMU 2.89 UGPA real GPA is 3.2 with a 167 on the october LSAT. I just applied I have mid-weak softs. Sent in a decent diversity statement, but I'm a white dude, just had different experiences. Help me out! Lawschoolnumbers.com gives me hope but what do you think? SMU is my absolute first choice.

Your LSAT will help a lot, but I'm slightly wary of the GPA. I don't want to say you're in, but I think you are pretty close.

[ebo]

Finishing up my app now for full-time early action. SMU is my first choice.

3.1
166
non-URM
2 yrs. WE

You all seem pretty knowledgeable, what would you say my chances are, and (if they're good) what kind of scholarship $$ would I be looking at? I looked at LSN but I realize that it's very self-selective- also, will this cycle of admissions be considerably harder than last year, or can we expect about the same results?

Good luck everyone

Yes, good. Probably $22K - $25K a year.

.