Fordham c/o 2015/16 (2011-2012 Cycle) Forum

[StarLightSpectre]

Complete again 3/30. It's my third complete. Should I get a decision soon? I was a late app so I haven't been following the thread to closely.

[rich_4]

I had the same situation, almost full rides at W&L and Emory, and Fordham would not negotiate.

Not unless you have the stats to warrant a higher scholly.
Fordham only compares your stats to their average, not to competitive offers
(they told me quite frankly that schollys are used to buy higher stats. They don't have as much money for merit aid, so they don't get into bidding wars

Sounds like a no. Leaning toward Emory more every day, but it's hard to say no to NYC.

[JenDarby]

I got a lot more $$$ at Emory and W&L... can I use this as any type of leverage?

You should absolutely try. Fordham DOES negotiate, even though they may not just throw money at you like some schools.

[avd90]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

[dietcoke0]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

LMAO, really didn't want you. That should be worth at least 20k if they wanted you, that's nasty. Enjoy Ann Arbor or DC

[cogitoergosum]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

Haha, that's really ridiculous. How the heck does Fordham keep up its medians?

ETA: although they may have just figured you weren't coming there anyway...

[dietcoke0]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

Haha, that's really ridiculous. How the heck does Fordham keep up its medians?

ETA: although they may have just figured you weren't coming there anyway...

60th and ninth

[cogitoergosum]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

Haha, that's really ridiculous. How the heck does Fordham keep up its medians?

ETA: although they may have just figured you weren't coming there anyway...

60th and ninth

Yeah yeah yeah, biggest legal market, yadda yadda... that's certainly worth something, but when a t-14 is offering 3x as much merit aid as a t-30 - even a t-30 at "60th and ninth" - it's gotta make it very difficult for the t-30 to attract highly qualified applicants.

[avd90]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

Haha, that's really ridiculous. How the heck does Fordham keep up its medians?

ETA: although they may have just figured you weren't coming there anyway...

yeah, I think that may have had something to do with it. still sort of sucked though. My mom is a Fordham alum and they still didn't give a crap (that was really why I applied in the first place, because of my mom). Perhaps Fordham realized they couldn't/wouldn't compete with GULC for money (which though it gets a lot of shit on TLS, is still a T-14)

[JenDarby]

I'll be honest, I don't knock many (ANY schools) but I never considered GULC for a second. Congrats on BU and UMich though. I didn't apply to Mich, but I'd jump on those offers.

[msblaw89]

Withdrew! Hopefully someone gets my spot!

[TLSwag]

Withdrew! Hopefully someone gets my spot!

thank you for withdrawing, best luck with everything! (WL)

[john1990]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

[TLSwag]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

I presumed you weren't still in UG if you asked this question, till I saw the 1990.

Do u have a full time job right now? Do you plan on working through law school to make ends meet?
These are the things that part-time students get admissions boosts for, and most of the spots go to people with a few years of relevant WE. It's fine to indicate "both" if applicable but if u are making a case saying that in a LOCI, I hope you were careful with your language so it didn't seem uninformed & desperate. LOCI's should be pretty brief and to the point, yet compelling... you don't want to overdue anything dude.

[Gemini]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

True but Fordham actually discourages a switch. They look for people with legitimate reasons why they want to be part of the evening program (family, job, etc.). From what I understand, they don't like it to be used as a backdoor way in to the day program.

[john1990]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

True but Fordham actually discourages a switch. They look for people with legitimate reasons why they want to be part of the evening program (family, job, etc.). From what I understand, they don't like it to be used as a backdoor way in to the day program.

I should have mentioned that i heard about switching to both from an admissions counselor when i visited the school shortly after being wait listed. He asked me if i would be willing to be a part-time student, and when i said yes he seemed happy with my response. Of course this could just be that he personally likes my initiative and commitment.
I am concerned about OCI and equality among PT an FT students, although for now i am just on the WL

[dingbat]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

True but Fordham actually discourages a switch. They look for people with legitimate reasons why they want to be part of the evening program (family, job, etc.). From what I understand, they don't like it to be used as a backdoor way in to the day program.

I should have mentioned that i heard about switching to both from an admissions counselor when i visited the school shortly after being wait listed. He asked me if i would be willing to be a part-time student, and when i said yes he seemed happy with my response. Of course this could just be that he personally likes my initiative and commitment.
I am concerned about OCI and equality among PT an FT students, although for now i am just on the WL

I hope you mentioned said admissions counsellor by name in your LOCI

[Gemini]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

True but Fordham actually discourages a switch. They look for people with legitimate reasons why they want to be part of the evening program (family, job, etc.). From what I understand, they don't like it to be used as a backdoor way in to the day program.

I should have mentioned that i heard about switching to both from an admissions counselor when i visited the school shortly after being wait listed. He asked me if i would be willing to be a part-time student, and when i said yes he seemed happy with my response. Of course this could just be that he personally likes my initiative and commitment.
I am concerned about OCI and equality among PT an FT students, although for now i am just on the WL

Well whatever the answer is, good luck!!

[john1990]

Waitlisted with a 166/3.32

I wrote a LOCI and stated that i would be happy being a part-time student, i heard that this may make it more likely to gain admissions

Do part-time students go to the same OCI and have the same opportunities as Full-time students?
I know that after the first year Part-timers are allowed to switch to Full-time

True but Fordham actually discourages a switch. They look for people with legitimate reasons why they want to be part of the evening program (family, job, etc.). From what I understand, they don't like it to be used as a backdoor way in to the day program.

I should have mentioned that i heard about switching to both from an admissions counselor when i visited the school shortly after being wait listed. He asked me if i would be willing to be a part-time student, and when i said yes he seemed happy with my response. Of course this could just be that he personally likes my initiative and commitment.
I am concerned about OCI and equality among PT an FT students, although for now i am just on the WL

Well whatever the answer is, good luck!!

Thank you i appreciate it!

[leafs1315]

I got wait listed about a month and half ago. I signed up immediately on the website to say I wanted to remain on the wait list and I also sent in an LOCI about a week later. I'm planning on visiting the campus next week.

I was wondering if there was anything else that I could do to help my chances? Do people usually meet with the admissions office during campus visits?

I really want to go to Fordham since it has a good location and a good IP program (I have a background in engineering). My goal is to eventually work in NY at an IP firm.

Thanks

[ned]

Withdrew. Even with 13k/yr from Mich, 32.5k/yr from GULC and 105k total from BU, they wouldn't negotiate past 10k/yr. Disappointing, but that's life!

Haha, that's really ridiculous. How the heck does Fordham keep up its medians?

ETA: although they may have just figured you weren't coming there anyway...

60th and ninth

Manhattan is a good place to find jobs, but it doesn't explain Fordham's ability to draw good students with little merit aid. Just look at Cardozo, Brooklyn Law, and NYLS for schools that have good addresses, plenty of merit aid, and inferior reputation and student body.

Here's the deal:

1) MANY people get need-based aid. Merit aid is icing on the cake, but not the primary factor in choosing schools for the majority of students.

2) Fordham seems to have established over the decades a particular niche based on its Manhattan alumni network and job placement at biglaw. You see Fordham at all levels of the top 50 law firms, including recruiting, partners, associates, etc., well beyond what its USNR ranking would suggest.

3) If you just barely don't get in to NYU or Columbia, Fordham is the best option in the region in terms of ranking/prestige, job placement, and size. There are tons of people in this category. So they don't feel compelled to play lets make a deal.

[ned]

I got wait listed about a month and half ago. I signed up immediately on the website to say I wanted to remain on the wait list and I also sent in an LOCI about a week later. I'm planning on visiting the campus next week.

I was wondering if there was anything else that I could do to help my chances? Do people usually meet with the admissions office during campus visits?

I really want to go to Fordham since it has a good location and a good IP program (I have a background in engineering). My goal is to eventually work in NY at an IP firm.

Thanks

You've probably heard this too, but I've read that Cardozo is actually highly regarded in IP, possibly ranked higher than Fordham but I'm not sure.... My point being, you'll be okay with your engineering I/P credentials even if you don't wind up at Fordham, for what it's worth.... Good luck though!

[leafs1315]

Thanks for the response. I think in the IP/Patent Law rankings Cardozo is around 4th and Fordham is 12th. So you are correct that Cardozo has a highly regarded IP program.

However, I've been told that you should try to go to a school that has a good program in a speciality you want, in addition to an overall high'ish ranking. That is why I want to go to Fordham, since it is a top 30 school and top 15 IP school. But I did also apply to Cardozo, due to it being a good IP school.

[dingbat]

1) MANY people get need-based aid. Merit aid is icing on the cake, but not the primary factor in choosing schools for the majority of students.

2) Fordham seems to have established over the decades a particular niche based on its Manhattan alumni network and job placement at biglaw. You see Fordham at all levels of the top 50 law firms, including recruiting, partners, associates, etc., well beyond what its USNR ranking would suggest.

3) If you just barely don't get in to NYU or Columbia, Fordham is the best option in the region in terms of ranking/prestige, job placement, and size. There are tons of people in this category. So they don't feel compelled to play lets make a deal.

1) actually, schools have been moving more and more funds away from need-based, towards merit-based.
This has to do with the importance of rankings. Merit aid basically buys numbers. Fordham would prefer to only give need-based, but they need to remain competitive (as relayed to me by dean XXX)

2)Fordham's biglaw placement in most years is about 20th, regardless of the fact that US News ranks them around 30th (give or take a few points each year)

3) ding/ding/ding. New York is a huge region and one of the largest law markets in the world. If you think of it differently, the metropolitan area is twice the size of Chicago.
Besides, not everyone is a rankings whore / constantly checks out TLS, and Fordham has a darn good reputation in the city

[ned]

1) MANY people get need-based aid. Merit aid is icing on the cake, but not the primary factor in choosing schools for the majority of students.

2) Fordham seems to have established over the decades a particular niche based on its Manhattan alumni network and job placement at biglaw. You see Fordham at all levels of the top 50 law firms, including recruiting, partners, associates, etc., well beyond what its USNR ranking would suggest.

3) If you just barely don't get in to NYU or Columbia, Fordham is the best option in the region in terms of ranking/prestige, job placement, and size. There are tons of people in this category. So they don't feel compelled to play lets make a deal.

1) actually, schools have been moving more and more funds away from need-based, towards merit-based.
This has to do with the importance of rankings. Merit aid basically buys numbers. Fordham would prefer to only give need-based, but they need to remain competitive (as relayed to me by dean XXX)

2)Fordham's biglaw placement in most years is about 20th, regardless of the fact that US News ranks them around 30th (give or take a few points each year)

3) ding/ding/ding. New York is a huge region and one of the largest law markets in the world. If you think of it differently, the metropolitan area is twice the size of Chicago.
Besides, not everyone is a rankings whore / constantly checks out TLS, and Fordham has a darn good reputation in the city

While we agree on points 2 and 3, and you have inside info on point 1 that indicates a trend away from my point number 1, it gets a little fuzzy. I wonder what the ratio of need-based to merit-based funding is. And from what I've read, I think merit grant amounts are actually deducted from one's potential need-based grant, should one qualify for both, so in those cases, merit aid is not a deciding factor. The needy meritorious would have gotten a grant one way or another, up to a certain maximum award. The only people swayed by merit aid, at least financially, are those who don't qualify for need-based grants, and therefor don't really need to base their decisions on finances. It's more like an affirmation from the school that they are really really wanted as students. That's what the grant signifies, except for grants above $20k/year. Those would go above and beyond any need-based grants and impact one's quality of life while a student. But Fordham doesn't really deal in those figures.

I didn't get a merit grant, and I'm dirt poor, so I have a vested interest in my analysis