In at Harvard Forum

[tgir]

I hate to be that guy, but has anyone read the Harvard 2010 EIP thread. A little discouraging, to be honest. Just seemed like a lot more people being unable to secure offers than I had expected, and the complaints about the grading scheme are a little troubling. Any thoughts? Any Harvard students want to shed some light on how things are looking?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=127544

[Still very excited about the acceptance, don't get me wrong]

+1. I'd be curious to hear what the employment landscape looks like for Harvard grads as someone who is still sitting on the fence about going $200k in debt when there are cheaper options.

The OCI threads on TLS should not be a big consideration. They are always ridiculous. People start freaking out and declaring they are getting no callbacks wayyy too early then this spirals into more ppl freaking out. Next come the flames, people coming saying stuff like "No callbacks with 8 Hs", "One callback with 7 H and 2 DS" despite the fact that most of them dont even attend the school. Plus, its hard to figure out how many unique posters there are due to the anonymous feature. At the end of the day, those threads tell you almost nothing. Even ITE, no one doubts that at least 70-80%+ of Harvard's entire class is getting SA offers as compared to 60-70% at CCN. Idk how that translates to total OCI participants though but if ~8-10% dont participate its not out of the question to think that 85%+ of participants get SAs via OCI. I just dont know much of anything in this world that gets more secure than that.

In regards to LP, the mandatory LP requirement was removed so right now no one really knows whats going to happen with that.

As I understand it, the Dean's Scholar Prizes are what is no longer dictated. Previously it was no more than 2 students (I think?) per class, whereas now it is entirely discretionary. This might have a huge impact down the road, because DS Prizes count as 5.0 in GPA calculations.

The rest of the grades haven't changed, except in one regard: the curve that they published a little while back (the one with 8% LP's) is no longer published. The curve was never strictly mandatory, only highly suggested--in other words, profs had to justify sharp departures from it to the registrar. There's still an internally circulated curve among the professors. There's no reason to believe that the unpublished curve of today is any different from the published curve of last year. Certainly, they still give out LP's.

Also, I think you're right about the EIP thread. It seems highly unreliable. I just wish we had *some* reliable source.

Edit: Oh, and I remembered that I saw this on the website the other day, under the LRW program course description: "All Legal Research and Writing sections comply with the recommended HLS grade distribution: 37 percent Honors; 55 percent Pass; and 8 percent Low Pass/Fail." It might just be that they haven't updated this portion of the website; on the other hand, it could be a sign that the LP is here to stay.

[oxford_don]

I hate to be that guy, but has anyone read the Harvard 2010 EIP thread. A little discouraging, to be honest. Just seemed like a lot more people being unable to secure offers than I had expected, and the complaints about the grading scheme are a little troubling. Any thoughts? Any Harvard students want to shed some light on how things are looking?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=127544

[Still very excited about the acceptance, don't get me wrong]

+1. I'd be curious to hear what the employment landscape looks like for Harvard grads as someone who is still sitting on the fence about going $200k in debt when there are cheaper options.

The OCI threads on TLS should not be a big consideration. They are always ridiculous. People start freaking out and declaring they are getting no callbacks wayyy too early then this spirals into more ppl freaking out. Next come the flames, people coming saying stuff like "No callbacks with 8 Hs", "One callback with 7 H and 2 DS" despite the fact that most of them dont even attend the school. Plus, its hard to figure out how many unique posters there are due to the anonymous feature. At the end of the day, those threads tell you almost nothing. Even ITE, no one doubts that at least 70-80%+ of Harvard's entire class is getting SA offers as compared to 60-70% at CCN. Idk how that translates to total OCI participants though but if ~8-10% dont participate its not out of the question to think that 85%+ of participants get SAs via OCI. I just dont know much of anything in this world that gets more secure than that.

In regards to LP, the mandatory LP requirement was removed so right now no one really knows whats going to happen with that.

Thanks for the info. By now, I should know better than to read too deeply into the musings of TLS visitors.

[haver1234]

I hate to be that guy, but has anyone read the Harvard 2010 EIP thread. A little discouraging, to be honest. Just seemed like a lot more people being unable to secure offers than I had expected, and the complaints about the grading scheme are a little troubling. Any thoughts? Any Harvard students want to shed some light on how things are looking?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=127544

[Still very excited about the acceptance, don't get me wrong]

+1. I'd be curious to hear what the employment landscape looks like for Harvard grads as someone who is still sitting on the fence about going $200k in debt when there are cheaper options.

The OCI threads on TLS should not be a big consideration. They are always ridiculous. People start freaking out and declaring they are getting no callbacks wayyy too early then this spirals into more ppl freaking out. Next come the flames, people coming saying stuff like "No callbacks with 8 Hs", "One callback with 7 H and 2 DS" despite the fact that most of them dont even attend the school. Plus, its hard to figure out how many unique posters there are due to the anonymous feature. At the end of the day, those threads tell you almost nothing. Even ITE, no one doubts that at least 70-80%+ of Harvard's entire class is getting SA offers as compared to 60-70% at CCN. Idk how that translates to total OCI participants though but if ~8-10% dont participate its not out of the question to think that 85%+ of participants get SAs via OCI. I just dont know much of anything in this world that gets more secure than that.

In regards to LP, the mandatory LP requirement was removed so right now no one really knows whats going to happen with that.

Never before have I been met with so many unintelligible acronyms. I am obviously not ready for law school.

[rundoxierun]

As I understand it, the Dean's Scholar Prizes are what is no longer dictated. Previously it was no more than 2 students (I think?) per class, whereas now it is entirely discretionary. This might have a huge impact down the road, because DS Prizes count as 5.0 in GPA calculations.

The rest of the grades haven't changed, except in one regard: the curve that they published a little while back (the one with 8% LP's) is no longer published. The curve was never strictly mandatory, only highly suggested--in other words, profs had to justify sharp departures from it to the registrar. There's still an internally circulated curve among the professors. There's no reason to believe that the unpublished curve of today is any different from the published curve of last year. Certainly, they still give out LP's.

Also, I think you're right about the EIP thread. It seems highly unreliable. I just wish we had *some* reliable source.

Edit: Oh, and I remembered that I saw this on the website the other day, under the LRW program course description: "All Legal Research and Writing sections comply with the recommended HLS grade distribution: 37 percent Honors; 55 percent Pass; and 8 percent Low Pass/Fail." It might just be that they haven't updated this portion of the website; on the other hand, it could be a sign that the LP is here to stay.

Oops.. yea you are right. Once we get farther into the cycle I am going to e-mail HLS and see if they will give admitted students some kind of employment data. Probably not, but worth a shot.

[oxford_don]

As I understand it, the Dean's Scholar Prizes are what is no longer dictated. Previously it was no more than 2 students (I think?) per class, whereas now it is entirely discretionary. This might have a huge impact down the road, because DS Prizes count as 5.0 in GPA calculations.

The rest of the grades haven't changed, except in one regard: the curve that they published a little while back (the one with 8% LP's) is no longer published. The curve was never strictly mandatory, only highly suggested--in other words, profs had to justify sharp departures from it to the registrar. There's still an internally circulated curve among the professors. There's no reason to believe that the unpublished curve of today is any different from the published curve of last year. Certainly, they still give out LP's.

Also, I think you're right about the EIP thread. It seems highly unreliable. I just wish we had *some* reliable source.

Edit: Oh, and I remembered that I saw this on the website the other day, under the LRW program course description: "All Legal Research and Writing sections comply with the recommended HLS grade distribution: 37 percent Honors; 55 percent Pass; and 8 percent Low Pass/Fail." It might just be that they haven't updated this portion of the website; on the other hand, it could be a sign that the LP is here to stay.

Oops.. yea you are right. Once we get farther into the cycle I am going to e-mail HLS and see if they will give admitted students some kind of employment data. Probably not, but worth a shot.

Sometimes they have this information on the admitted students site, so we might get it once the e-binders go online.

[rv11]

As I understand it, the Dean's Scholar Prizes are what is no longer dictated. Previously it was no more than 2 students (I think?) per class, whereas now it is entirely discretionary. This might have a huge impact down the road, because DS Prizes count as 5.0 in GPA calculations.

The rest of the grades haven't changed, except in one regard: the curve that they published a little while back (the one with 8% LP's) is no longer published. The curve was never strictly mandatory, only highly suggested--in other words, profs had to justify sharp departures from it to the registrar. There's still an internally circulated curve among the professors. There's no reason to believe that the unpublished curve of today is any different from the published curve of last year. Certainly, they still give out LP's.

Also, I think you're right about the EIP thread. It seems highly unreliable. I just wish we had *some* reliable source.

Edit: Oh, and I remembered that I saw this on the website the other day, under the LRW program course description: "All Legal Research and Writing sections comply with the recommended HLS grade distribution: 37 percent Honors; 55 percent Pass; and 8 percent Low Pass/Fail." It might just be that they haven't updated this portion of the website; on the other hand, it could be a sign that the LP is here to stay.

Oops.. yea you are right. Once we get farther into the cycle I am going to e-mail HLS and see if they will give admitted students some kind of employment data. Probably not, but worth a shot.

Sometimes they have this information on the admitted students site, so we might get it once the e-binders go online.

Hope this is soon... How much do they really have to update from last year?

Edit: Nvm, it's up.

[apple430]

sorry, but where are these e-binders?

[tgir]

Reading my e-binder instead of writing final papers? Yes, I think so.

+1

[rundoxierun]

Ive made a conscious decision to let my current A- in one of my classes fall to a B or B+ via a disastrous final.. I just simply dont care anymore. If Harvard decides to rescind my offer over a 3.81 in my final semester then screw em.

ETA: They listed Elizabeth Warren as a professor. I would estimate the chances of her returning to teach at Harvard over the next 4 years are very small.

[pinkzeppelin]

I just read the entire e-binder instead of studying for my test tomorrow morning. This isn't going to be pretty.

[Vertigo963]

I must confess that I find the accomplishments listed for some of these people in the E-Binder a little intimidating.

[sarahh]

ETA: They listed Elizabeth Warren as a professor. I would estimate the chances of her returning to teach at Harvard over the next 4 years are very small.

I asked about it in my JR1 and he said she was coming back next year.

[mydogteddy]

I have to say I'm a little bit upset about having to read through a 305 page packet of fairly dense information online. The size/zoom is especially bothersome. I understand the desire to be green, but I think this binder would have been much more comprehensible, exciting, and easy to read in beautiful, color, hard form.

Does anyone else share my sentiments? Seriously thinking of just printing the whole thing...

[DoubleChecks]

I have to say I'm a little bit upset about having to read through a 305 page packet of fairly dense information online. The size/zoom is especially bothersome. I understand the desire to be green, but I think this binder would have been much more comprehensible, exciting, and easy to read in beautiful, color, hard form.

Does anyone else share my sentiments? Seriously thinking of just printing the whole thing...

i guess it would be a pain if you're reading it lol

[SullaFelix]

I have to say I'm a little bit upset about having to read through a 305 page packet of fairly dense information online. The size/zoom is especially bothersome. I understand the desire to be green, but I think this binder would have been much more comprehensible, exciting, and easy to read in beautiful, color, hard form.

Does anyone else share my sentiments? Seriously thinking of just printing the whole thing...

It can be saved as a pdf, which is much more readable.

[rundoxierun]

I have to say I'm a little bit upset about having to read through a 305 page packet of fairly dense information online. The size/zoom is especially bothersome. I understand the desire to be green, but I think this binder would have been much more comprehensible, exciting, and easy to read in beautiful, color, hard form.

Does anyone else share my sentiments? Seriously thinking of just printing the whole thing...

Just save as pdf no point in wasting 305 pages of tree when most likely all you are going to do is skim the thing and throw it away.

[4for44]

Just got the call! So excited to meet you all at ASW!!!

[catsparka]

I was actually in class and had my phone on silent and missed my JR2. But JR sent a supernice email to which I replied with multiple exclamation marks.

[hulahoop]

soo happy to be able to post in this thread. that is all.

[elliej]

From a 2L: I wouldn't worry about EIP. I only know a few people who tried to land a biglaw job and failed, and none of them works very hard in school or even really wanted a biglaw job in the first place except to go along with the crowd (which I'm sure came off in the interviews and is the bigger factor). I'm sure there are a few horror stories out there, but I don't personally know of any. On the whole people seem quite satisfied with their results, and not just those with straight Hs. To be honest, I picked a V25 firm over some V10 offers and I secretly felt a bit like an underachiever with so many S&C, Cravath, and DPW offers out there -- perhaps this should be more worrying to you as it says a lot about the personality types and how people casually brag about their offers.

I guess this is all to say that if you take it seriously (this does not mean study 100% of the time and get only perfect grades) you will be absolutely fine.

[eskimogirl]

so happy and surprised to be a part of this thread!

[dooterdude11]

so happy and surprised to be a part of this thread!

+1,000,000 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[haver1234]

Congratulations everyone. See you in Cambridge soon

[dbfriedman]

Congratulations to all the new arrivals in this thread!

[TheTallOne0602]

Dang that was fast. Applied a little over three weeks ago, got the JR1 email a little over two weeks ago, got the JR1 last week, got the JR2 voicemail (I was in class dangit) today.

Then I did some random jumping, fistpumping and yelling at things.

I am flabergasted. My gast is flabbered.