AUSA/USAO hiring Forum

[Anonymous User]

Current circuit clerk on one of 2/7/9. Have three years (civil) practice experience at a well-respected biglaw in my metro, fairly meaty stand-up/substantive stuff but no trials, with some pro bono criminal (on defense side). Did not intern with an AUSA or anything like that in LS. In part because of my experience working on criminal cases during the clerkship, am considering pursuing the AUSA thing when the clerkship ends next fall.

(a) Am I competitive as it stands, or better to go back and practice / clerk at the d.ct level / etc. for a year or two first?
(b) For those who came off clerkships, when did you start submitting apps? I've kept an eye on USAJobs for the last couple years in general but didn't get a great sense of how the timing actually works out in practice. Have read through the thread but seems to mostly be about hiring timing after interviews.

I get your desire to try to "plan" out your timing when it comes to applying. But, AUSA positions are a bit like unicorns. The right advice always has been: whenever a position opens up, apply. The one exception to this is, of course, if the job posting has a minimum experience requirement, which you don't appear to have an issue with. Aside from that, apply as soon as a job opens up. If you don't, you never know when another position will open up again. Even if you apply and don't get it based on experience, the fact that you will have already applied once before when you reapply will show commitment and be a positive factor.

Anon above -- thanks, this is really helpful.

[Anonymous User]

To the poster who interviewed with S.D. Cal - did you hear anything yet?

No, but I expect I'll hear soon. They said they were doing interviews until June 28, and so they expected to make some decisions in the first few weeks of July. Plus, I got another job offer which needs to know my decision by Monday, which I told SDCA about, so I expect I'll hear soon either way.

Do you know anything about it?

Same boat re: SDCA. Interviewed several weeks ago but have not heard anything yet. Good luck!

Same to you! I'll update, of course, if I hear anything.

edit: I ended up taking the other job. More money, less work, wouldn't have to move family across the country, etc. Probably not as good for longterm career goals, though.

Anyway, good luck to you!

[foreversport]

Any updates on cdca or ndil? Both have had a few openings in the last 6-12 months, wondering if there’s been any movement or if perhaps vacancies have been filled internally.

I, too, am curious about this wrt ND Ill. Also anything for NDCA or EDNY too.

[Anonymous User]

Any updates on cdca or ndil? Both have had a few openings in the last 6-12 months, wondering if there’s been any movement or if perhaps vacancies have been filled internally.

I, too, am curious about this wrt ND Ill. Also anything for NDCA or EDNY too.

CDCA definitely still interviewing.

[wisdom]

Current circuit clerk on one of 2/7/9. Have three years (civil) practice experience at a well-respected biglaw in my metro, fairly meaty stand-up/substantive stuff but no trials, with some pro bono criminal (on defense side). Did not intern with an AUSA or anything like that in LS. In part because of my experience working on criminal cases during the clerkship, am considering pursuing the AUSA thing when the clerkship ends next fall.

(a) Am I competitive as it stands, or better to go back and practice / clerk at the d.ct level / etc. for a year or two first?
(b) For those who came off clerkships, when did you start submitting apps? I've kept an eye on USAJobs for the last couple years in general but didn't get a great sense of how the timing actually works out in practice. Have read through the thread but seems to mostly be about hiring timing after interviews.

Current AUSA here. For what it's worth, that sounds like a competitive resume just about anywhere, although hiring standards and preferences vary a lot by office. For instance, SDNY is heavily populated with former clerks from SDNY/CA2. Almost anywhere else in the country is going to be interested in a COA clerk with practice experience. The biggest x-factor is local ties, which are valued more by USAOs than big law firms. If you're applying to a city you've never lived in before, that's going to be something you have to address at the interview. Aside from the hypos and more substantive components to interviews, interviews boil down to your likability/apparent collegiality and two key question: why do you want to be an AUSA and why that particular location.

[houstonlaw468]

Any updates from SDTX, Houston vacancies?

[Anonymous User]

What's the protocol for re-applying after hearing nothing from an office? Wait 2-3 years? If so, do I need to put in fresh recommendation letters or just send a letter reiterating interest and updated resume?

[Anonymous User]

So that probably gives away where you applied because the vast majority of offices don’t require LORs (I have never had to submit actual letters). Since that office does, I would suggest re-sending them, for ease of not making them track down letters from years before, unless when you were rejected they said anything about keeping your application on file (you don’t know how long they keep unsuccessful application materials). But you could also inquire directly.

(Most offices don’t take applications directly at any time, but make you apply through USAjobs when there is an opening. You’d have to submit all LORs at the time of application in that case, because USAjobs wouldn’t mark your application as complete without them, but like I said, many many offices just ask for references and don’t require LORs.)

Also, if you actually wait 2-3 years, ideally your recommenders will have newer and better things to say that will make your application stronger than it is now.

[Anonymous User]

If all things are the same, aside from having a slight preference of SF > NY, which is better between EDNY and NDCA?

[Anonymous User]

If all things are the same, aside from having a slight preference of SF > NY, which is better between EDNY and NDCA?

Define "better"? Do you mean kind of work available, office culture, exit options, or what?

[Anonymous User]

If all things are the same, aside from having a slight preference of SF > NY, which is better between EDNY and NDCA?

Define "better"? Do you mean kind of work available, office culture, exit options, or what?

Exit options and culture mainly.

[TheProsecutor]

As a general matter, exit options in the private sector depend on an AUSA successfully handling high profile matters - - usually in securities or corporate fraud or, more recently, cybercrime - - and/or becoming a supervisor in a relevant unit or division. I would give EDNY the edge on financial crimes (although SDNY across the river is better). I think NDCA is slightly better in cyber, but EDNY is close. My general impression is that opportunities for supervision are more plentiful in EDNY, but that's just an impression.

As for culture, I think it would be hard for anyone to compare two offices. But culture is often driven by geography and the people attracted to that location. If you are attracted to SF, I think you'd probably be happier at NDCA than EDNY.

All in all, I think along with SDNY and EDVA, EDNY is generally thought to be one of the top 3 offices in the country. NDCA is a slight tier below that in perception, but it hires super smart AUSAs and has great cases. You can't go wrong choosing either - - although New York winters are way worse than SF winters.

[andythefir]

If all things are the same, aside from having a slight preference of SF > NY, which is better between EDNY and NDCA?

I have only rumors to substantiate this, but I bet EDNY churns through many, many more AUSAs than NDCA. My intuition is NDCA would be mostly absurdly credentialed folks under 40 and nice people over 60 who got in before the USAO was so insanely competitive.

[Anonymous User]

Went through this thread and saw varying opinions, but would like to hear from more border AUSAs (or others) if possible: what is the portability of doing a tour in a border district to being able to transfer to another office in that district or nationally? I'm not implying a border district-->SDNY/EDNY/DDC/NDCAL etc., but maybe with an intra-district transfer to a larger office or another office in a separate district. I ask because any interest I'd receive from these offices would require a separation from my husband for what I'm assuming would be three years since he would not be able to relocate. Would be thrilled to do the border-specific work and wouldn't be thinking this scenario out if not for my husband's job.

[Anonymous User]

Went through this thread and saw varying opinions, but would like to hear from more border AUSAs (or others) if possible: what is the portability of doing a tour in a border district to being able to transfer to another office in that district or nationally? I'm not implying a border district-->SDNY/EDNY/DDC/NDCAL etc., but maybe with an intra-district transfer to a larger office or another office in a separate district. I ask because any interest I'd receive from these offices would require a separation from my husband for what I'm assuming would be three years since he would not be able to relocate. Would be thrilled to do the border-specific work and wouldn't be thinking this scenario out if not for my husband's job.

You probably saw answers from me earlier in the thread, but I made this jump and many people in my former border office have done so as well, usually to districts where we had ties. I know I did have to assuage some concerns with my current office that I didn’t have enough experience with the kinds of cases worked here (mostly larger drug investigations), but my mentors from the border district were able to go to bat for me and argue that I could learn what I needed to learn. And another colleague here who was previously in a border district had got into more specialized investigations there before coming here, so there were no concerns about him in that respect.

However, most offices (not SDNY and maybe not others, but the majority) don’t take rolling applications and take applications only when an opening is posted/they need someone. It’s not generally possible actually to transfer, you need to apply to an opening like everyone else; I personally believe that you have a significant edge over non-AUSA candidates, but you can’t just choose to go to another district. Technically there’s the possibility of a hardship transfer, and I know someone who did this based on her husband, who was in the military, getting transferred (I think that’s almost the only basis for such a thing), but even then the district she wanted to transfer to had to approve it (and did so mostly b/c she’d worked there before and they liked her).

I have to confess I don’t know much about transferring offices within a district. I know one person who did this, but I don’t know anything about the circumstances around it.

[andythefir]

Went through this thread and saw varying opinions, but would like to hear from more border AUSAs (or others) if possible: what is the portability of doing a tour in a border district to being able to transfer to another office in that district or nationally? I'm not implying a border district-->SDNY/EDNY/DDC/NDCAL etc., but maybe with an intra-district transfer to a larger office or another office in a separate district. I ask because any interest I'd receive from these offices would require a separation from my husband for what I'm assuming would be three years since he would not be able to relocate. Would be thrilled to do the border-specific work and wouldn't be thinking this scenario out if not for my husband's job.

Not an ausa, but among those I know who are, the jobs are like other somewhere v anywhere issues. All things else being equal, a border ausa is more competitive than a random DA from a different region but less competitive than a clerk in the district for a given entry level spot. Now, if you’re ok spraying all over the country, I’m sure you’ll find somewhere after 3+ years willing to take a former border prosecutor. Also I’ve heard within SDTX or WDTX for example border>main office isn’t impossible. But if you have one office in mind, you’ll have to do research on what that one office does or doesn’t like.

[Anonymous User]

Original poster on this: I think we would be ok with a national search - his job is really only transferable to cities. Heard the opposite about clerks generally not being competitive (excluding a big push from their judge) minus either the DA or biglaw track and the biglaw track should include court time/depositions.

Just to clarify I do know there is no separate internal transfer system between offices whether inside the district or elsewhere. I meant that I'd apply to a separate office just like any other applicant.

[Anonymous User]

Anon ex-border AUSA. Yeah, I don't think people coming straight out of clerking are particularly competitive, even if they clerked in that district, unless you mean that's in their background and they also have DA/biglaw work. For one thing, quite a lot of districts require at least 3 years experience, so a clerk wouldn't get past the initial screening. In fact, the only districts I know where someone's been hired straight out of clerking (aside from Honors) are border districts, and it's still uncommon. But then, a lot of the AUSAs getting hired even in border districts have done clerkships already. (And I figured you might know that about transfers, but just wanted to check.)

[andythefir]

I originally meant clerk>biglaw in the district is going to be more competitive than border ausa out of district, but I take your point. Also it’s crucial to know the actual office/USA you’re targeting, some literally only hire former clerks and nothing can remove the stain of not having clerked.

[Maizey703]

So I just stumbled onto this thread and wanted to see if anyone had some advice or insight into my situation. I work at DOJ HQ in a non litigation section. I have been casting a very wide net on AUSA jobs. I got an offer from WDTX (Del Rio) last year that I turned down for my current job.

So I had a 2nd round ( interview with USA) in SDWV 7 weeks ago......have not heard back (They said they would be making decisions in a week - week and half). I saw a new posting 3 weeks later. They have not checked any of my references.

I had a first round interview with SDIL 5 weeks ago......radio silence.

I had a final interview (USA) with North Dakota a week and a half ago..... they said a week - week and a half.

I am definitely having more luck in smaller less competitive offices. Have I been soft rejected in SDVW and SDIL? 7 weeks seems like a long time, given that they said 7 - 10 days. I am also probably way too old to be starting as an AUSA (class of 04').

[Anonymous User]

I have had far greater success with smaller USAOs as well. I have a dozen jury trials, 6 years of experience, half of that as an ADA in an urban market. The only large office I've landed an interview with was USAO-DC (Superior Court), and I sense that they're a lot less selective than urban USAOs who are filling District Court positions.

What I've noticed is that the smaller offices (Nebraska, Iowa, etc.) all say they will get back to you soon (within a couple weeks) but that rejections take months to receive, even with a small pool of perhaps 5-10 interviewees for the combined first/second/third round interviews. I'm not too impressed with the turnaround time or lack of communication there. It appears to me that the people getting offers in those types of offices are usually well-connected to the area and are 3-5 years out of law school. They don't all necessarily have a lot of trial experience or prosecution experience.

North Dakota isn't a bad place to land. I practiced criminal defense there for several years. The AUSAs were excellent to work with, and I got the sense that they had decent work-life balance. One of the state's attorneys I worked with a lot ended up in that office and he's a good guy.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody hear from SDCA yet?

[Anonymous User]

Anybody hear from SDCA yet?

Regarding SDCA - Radio silence, been 6.5 weeks since my interview

[Anonymous User]

Anybody hear from SDCA yet?

Regarding SDCA - Radio silence, been 6.5 weeks since my interview

Yikes, me too.

[Maizey703]

Thanks for the reply about small USAOs. That was helpful. Quick update on me.
Dinged by SDIL (they actually called me on the phone to ding me). 1st round interview 6/7.
8 weeks from final interview at SDVW (they just reposted the job for a 4th time sigh). So much for a week - week and a half.
2.5 weeks from ND..... again So much for a week - week and a half.
Just got offered an interview with EDMI.....I think that would be an awesome job.