Military Law Forum

[Patrick Bateman]

For those saying you would intern for free: I called the defense council at the local Air Force Base and asked if I could intern for credit this spring. He said yes. Nothing complicated there. Give it a shot.

For you young and hungry types, I think this is an excellent strategy to get your foot in the door. I have seen volunteer internships lead to selections a few times now. Obviously, if you can land the official Summer Internship, great, but I think this is a solid second option for those that can afford it and have the initiative.

[wannabejag]

Looks like it wasn't meant to be. Undecided if I'll try again. Looks like it's the year for T10

hmmm...coincidence...?

You guys are ridiculous with this stuff. I like how you target this post. How about the one about 5 back where the guy was middle of the Class at a Tier III.

Looks like its the year for ignorance.

[babyt8_99]

Looks like it wasn't meant to be. Undecided if I'll try again. Looks like it's the year for T10

hmmm...coincidence...?

You guys are ridiculous with this stuff. I like how you target this post. How about the one about 5 back where the guy was middle of the Class at a Tier III.

Looks like its the year for ignorance.

I'm not going to get in a pissing match with you. But I do know what schools the Army chose this year. That guy wasn't Army. He was navy

[wannabejag]

Looks like it wasn't meant to be. Undecided if I'll try again. Looks like it's the year for T10

hmmm...coincidence...?

You guys are ridiculous with this stuff. I like how you target this post. How about the one about 5 back where the guy was middle of the Class at a Tier III.

Looks like its the year for ignorance.

I'm not going to get in a pissing match with you. But I do know what schools the Army chose this year. That guy wasn't Army. He was navy

So now this is just an Army Law Forum??? Funny, I thought the topic said military law.

[CFC_Essien]

Fair enough. Sorry to all those Army folk who did not make the cut, and any info regarding the stats of those who did make it (Air Force and Navy too!) would be greatly appreciated...

Has anyone checked out Coast Guard? According to their site, the Direct Commission Lawyer Program hires between 6 and 12 new attorneys each year! Talk about competition...

[wordtoyourmother12]

Yup, I am applying to the Coast Guard. In fact, my interview is next week.

It is really competitive, probably by far the most competitive. They are only taking 2 people this board. 2!

Also, the application process is extremely long and complicated. You have to qualify before you interview. That means going through MEPS, submitting loads of documentation, and even submitting tax withholding information, etc. The process takes months and involves waiting to hear back from your recruiter.

[CFC_Essien]

Yeah, I looked at it a year ago and the application process coupled with the competitive nature dissuaded me from applying. Further, I hear their JAGs compete with every other officer for rank -- not just within JAGC (but that's just what I heard: DISCLAIMER -- THIS IS JUST WHAT I HEARD AND I DO NOT HOLD MYSELF OUT AS AN EXPERT OF ALL THINGS COAST GUARD!)

That being said, good luck on your interview!

Yup, I am applying to the Coast Guard. In fact, my interview is next week.

It is really competitive, probably by far the most competitive. They are only taking 2 people this board. 2!

Also, the application process is extremely long and complicated. You have to qualify before you interview. That means going through MEPS, submitting loads of documentation, and even submitting tax withholding information, etc. The process takes months and involves waiting to hear back from your recruiter.

[Groundie]

But I do know what schools the Army chose this year. That guy wasn't Army. He was navy

How do you know? Which schools? I guess for those of us who haven't heard by now, we're toast.

[babyt8_99]

But I do know what schools the Army chose this year. That guy wasn't Army. He was navy

How do you know? Which schools? I guess for those of us who haven't heard by now, we're toast.

My FSO was reading some of them off (mind you not all the schools but when there are 2 Harvard, a Cornell and a University of Michigan right off the bat...my school-a T1 but MUCH lower than those). My FSO said that they had a choice of whether to call or not and he wanted to call and let me know since I was his #1

[Groundie]

Thank you for the information. Looks like it was a lot more competitive this year. I wish everyone who hasn't heard by now the best. There may be spots in the Reserve and on the Alternate list.

[MilotheCloud]

For me, it's not done until the list is published.

I feel like I put down a solid packet this year, but who knows. (great law gpa, good rank, clerkships, jobs, CALI awards, other experience)

I'm not looking forward to it, but I can guarantee I'll apply again after the bar exam this summer.

Congrats to those who have already been notified!

[babyt8_99]

For me, it's not done until the list is published.

I feel like I put down a solid packet this year, but who knows. (great law gpa, good rank, clerkships, jobs, CALI awards, other experience)

I'm not looking forward to it, but I can guarantee I'll apply again after the bar exam this summer.

Congrats to those who have already been notified!

My problem is that age is going to become a factor quickly. I also tried for the Reserves, so we'll see what happens with that list. I'm not sure what else I could have done to make my application better than to go to a school farther from home

[bjack347]

But I do know what schools the Army chose this year. That guy wasn't Army. He was navy

How do you know? Which schools? I guess for those of us who haven't heard by now, we're toast.

My FSO was reading some of them off (mind you not all the schools but when there are 2 Harvard, a Cornell and a University of Michigan right off the bat...my school-a T1 but MUCH lower than those). My FSO said that they had a choice of whether to call or not and he wanted to call and let me know since I was his #1

I'm not Navy. I'm an AD Army JAG select from a so-so tier III school. There's still hope, especially if you consider the FSOs admission that FSOs could choose whether or not to call their selects.

[CFC_Essien]

For me, it's not done until the list is published.

I feel like I put down a solid packet this year, but who knows. (great law gpa, good rank, clerkships, jobs, CALI awards, other experience)

I'm not looking forward to it, but I can guarantee I'll apply again after the bar exam this summer.

Congrats to those who have already been notified!

My problem is that age is going to become a factor quickly. I also tried for the Reserves, so we'll see what happens with that list. I'm not sure what else I could have done to make my application better than to go to a school farther from home

Agreed, baby. Sorry that you didn't get in, and although "age is becoming a factor quickly," if your FSO is calling you and telling you that you're his No. 1, then I'd definitely be applying again.

It's easy to be bitter (as I was just a couple days ago), but you'll get over it very shortly. You better re-apply!

[Groundie]

So, does everyone think that it is probably a safe bet that if we don't hear anything on Friday, chances are that we weren't selected? I'm guessing FSO's won't be making calls on Sat or Sun, then results will be posted on Monday.

Any news, Rocky?

[wannabejag]

Yeah, I looked at it a year ago and the application process coupled with the competitive nature dissuaded me from applying. Further, I hear their JAGs compete with every other officer for rank -- not just within JAGC (but that's just what I heard: DISCLAIMER -- THIS IS JUST WHAT I HEARD AND I DO NOT HOLD MYSELF OUT AS AN EXPERT OF ALL THINGS COAST GUARD!)

That being said, good luck on your interview!

Yup, I am applying to the Coast Guard. In fact, my interview is next week.

It is really competitive, probably by far the most competitive. They are only taking 2 people this board. 2!

Also, the application process is extremely long and complicated. You have to qualify before you interview. That means going through MEPS, submitting loads of documentation, and even submitting tax withholding information, etc. The process takes months and involves waiting to hear back from your recruiter.

This is quasi correct. In the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard a JAG Officer is still "an officer of the line" or an officer eligible to take Command. In the Air Force and Army, you are not. What that means that in theory a Marine JAG could be the Commander of an Infantry Battalion and things like that...In the Army that is not aloud. You are a Special Branch officer and your oath is different then the others O's.

[Rocky Estoppel]

So, does everyone think that it is probably a safe bet that if we don't hear anything on Friday, chances are that we weren't selected? I'm guessing FSO's won't be making calls on Sat or Sun, then results will be posted on Monday.

Any news, Rocky?

Nothing yet.

[Paichka]

This is quasi correct. In the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard a JAG Officer is still "an officer of the line" or an officer eligible to take Command. In the Air Force and Army, you are not. What that means that in theory a Marine JAG could be the Commander of an Infantry Battalion and things like that...In the Army that is not aloud. You are a Special Branch officer and your oath is different then the others O's.

I've never heard of a different oath of service for JAG officers than for other (say, MI or Infantry) officers. What's different about it than the usual "support and defend" oath of service for other branches?

[Bowl]

Air Force JAGs are line officers and can take command. They typically don't however and remain JAGs throughout their career. In fact, there is one General Officer who is a commander of the Air Force Legal Operations Agency.

[wannabejag]

This is quasi correct. In the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard a JAG Officer is still "an officer of the line" or an officer eligible to take Command. In the Air Force and Army, you are not. What that means that in theory a Marine JAG could be the Commander of an Infantry Battalion and things like that...In the Army that is not aloud. You are a Special Branch officer and your oath is different then the others O's.

I've never heard of a different oath of service for JAG officers than for other (say, MI or Infantry) officers. What's different about it than the usual "support and defend" oath of service for other branches?

The JAG Corps is the only officer branch that US Code specifically grants special provisions to. The wording in the Oath is different. If you are MI or Infantry Officer and rebranch to JAG you are sworn in again. In no other branch is that the case. Wel....maybe the Chaplaincy, but that is an entirely different beast in of itself.

[Patrick Bateman]

Yeah, I looked at it a year ago and the application process coupled with the competitive nature dissuaded me from applying. Further, I hear their JAGs compete with every other officer for rank -- not just within JAGC (but that's just what I heard: DISCLAIMER -- THIS IS JUST WHAT I HEARD AND I DO NOT HOLD MYSELF OUT AS AN EXPERT OF ALL THINGS COAST GUARD!)

That being said, good luck on your interview!

Yup, I am applying to the Coast Guard. In fact, my interview is next week.

It is really competitive, probably by far the most competitive. They are only taking 2 people this board. 2!

Also, the application process is extremely long and complicated. You have to qualify before you interview. That means going through MEPS, submitting loads of documentation, and even submitting tax withholding information, etc. The process takes months and involves waiting to hear back from your recruiter.

This is quasi correct. In the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard a JAG Officer is still "an officer of the line" or an officer eligible to take Command. In the Air Force and Army, you are not. What that means that in theory a Marine JAG could be the Commander of an Infantry Battalion and things like that...In the Army that is not aloud. You are a Special Branch officer and your oath is different then the others O's.

It may be that different MOS/AFSC/Rates have their own specific oath as an esprit de corps thing but officers from all seven of the Uniformed Services take the exact same oath of office, irrespective of job/mission. This is Federal Law – 5 USC 3331.

And Bowl is absolutely correct – Air Force JAGs are Line Officers.

[wannabejag]

Air Force JAGs are line officers and can take command. They typically don't however and remain JAGs throughout their career. In fact, there is one General Officer who is a commander of the Air Force Legal Operations Agency.

I correct myself about the Navy in my statement,...it is only the Marine Corps and Coast Guard who are line O's.

Your example is relevant and irrelevant. It's an excpetion to the rule, because regardless Special Branch officers can command others in their Branch. Like a Doctor Commanding a Hospital. But Air Force JAGs are NOT Line Officers.

[wannabejag]

Yeah, I looked at it a year ago and the application process coupled with the competitive nature dissuaded me from applying. Further, I hear their JAGs compete with every other officer for rank -- not just within JAGC (but that's just what I heard: DISCLAIMER -- THIS IS JUST WHAT I HEARD AND I DO NOT HOLD MYSELF OUT AS AN EXPERT OF ALL THINGS COAST GUARD!)

That being said, good luck on your interview!

Yup, I am applying to the Coast Guard. In fact, my interview is next week.

It is really competitive, probably by far the most competitive. They are only taking 2 people this board. 2!

Also, the application process is extremely long and complicated. You have to qualify before you interview. That means going through MEPS, submitting loads of documentation, and even submitting tax withholding information, etc. The process takes months and involves waiting to hear back from your recruiter.

This is quasi correct. In the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard a JAG Officer is still "an officer of the line" or an officer eligible to take Command. In the Air Force and Army, you are not. What that means that in theory a Marine JAG could be the Commander of an Infantry Battalion and things like that...In the Army that is not aloud. You are a Special Branch officer and your oath is different then the others O's.

It may be that different MOS/AFSC/Rates have their own specific oath as an esprit de corps thing but officers from all seven of the Uniformed Services take the exact same oath of office, irrespective of job/mission. This is Federal Law – 5 USC 3331.

And Bowl is absolutely correct – Air Force JAGs are Line Officers.

No. If you are already an Officer and Re Branch to JAG, you are dismissed and Re Sworn. The key sentence in the law you post is "This section does not affect other oaths required by law". If you are in the National Guard..Army or Air, you get an Entirely different Oath in each of the 54 territories as well. Its just that the oath you post in that law also is included.

[Groundie]

Regardless of the oath taken, this will surely be one of the brightest and best classes of Army JAs yet. Congratulations again.

I'll repeat my question since it got buried: For those of us non-selects who are graduating this year and taking the bar, what thoughts do you have on ways we could improve our application for November? It seems difficult, with only August, September, and October being open. I guess we should look for more volunteer legal experience if we don't have a job awaiting us at graduation.

[wannabejag]

Regardless of the oath taken, this will surely be one of the brightest and best classes of Army JAs yet. Congratulations again.

I'll repeat my question since it got buried: For those of us non-selects who are graduating this year and taking the bar, what thoughts do you have on ways we could improve our application for November? It seems difficult, with only August, September, and October being open. I guess we should look for more volunteer legal experience if we don't have a job awaiting us at graduation.

If Active Component fails there is JAG in the Reserves and the Guard. And remember, you can be Full Time in the Reserves/Guard.