Once timing starts... Everything goes out the window? Forum

[Captain Rodeo]

Ooook, so I hope that any response to this will help others out as well. For those who have any thoughts, thank you.

So- Pretty cool with LG, even when timing, still need to work on it- but I have done literally hundreds of games (I started doing them about 2 years ago because I though I was going to take the LSAT while in college still- decided not to in 10', then in 11', decided this year was the year).

As with LR and RC- (still with LG, just not as much because of familiarity) I find all of the cool PowerScore techniques, and advantages I have almost go out the window once I time myself- not completely, generally.

Actually, when I go to take any section timed (once again, less with LG) I feel as if I am not even taking the LSAT anymore- I know it's nerves and everything- but what I'm asking is all of the neat techniques and thorough thought processes we use during untimed prep- HOW MUCH of that can be transposed to timed tests?

Is it just time and those techniques (e.g., diagramming for formal Sufficient Assumption questions, using Voyager's nifty RC technique, all of the PowerScore LR specific-tests to weed out incorrect answer, &c.) eventually become second nature- OR does everything, or mostly everything drastically change once the 35 minute window is set?

BTW:

I have only recently been doing RC and LR timed- I believe with a calming of the nerves RC will be fine, just LR is pretty gnarly.

The only full LSAT practice tests I took were two years ago and did horribly (140s) on the 2 tests (honestly, both times- yes the 2nd time as well except for maybe knowing some conditional logic- I had no idea what the hell I was doing/ looking at)

I use PP's study plan (began with LSAT Blog's)

I am taking the LSAT in December

[ilovelawtays]

I like your avatar.

I don't understand the question, though. Are you asking what you need to master to achieve a high LSAT score? The consensus around here seems to be drilling, PTing, and reviewing. The drilling will get you familiar with techniques, the PTing will help with your timing and implementation of techniques, and the reviewing will solidify your understanding of the techniques and show you where you need to improve.

Good luck!

[05062014]

In june I used to cheat and do 2-3 questions I knew would be difficult within each section before I began timing to keep calm and finish sections on time (although I was not really, lol). I kept doing this until I could finish sections within 30 with this little handicap. After that I no longer needed it.

Repetition is key but so is the psychology of staying positive and optimistic. My strategy worked because it let me think I was finishing sections timed and allowed me to employ my strategies with less stress initially. If you do what I did, I would start now though. It takes time to improve timing.

[Captain Rodeo]

Wow! Thank you ilovelawtayz and Cardozo for responding so quickly and with great answers!

@ilove: I like my avatar too haha; I think Coffee would be a wonderful president: COFFEE 2013

Anyway: apologies for the nebulous question (it was interspersed with worrisome comments, including the low timed prep mention so that someone would say, "Hey that's no problem buddy! You'll still get a 180!- I guess that's just the ever present desire to be affirmed/confirmed/and have worries alleviated by others)- ANYWAY...

I was trying to ask how much actually sticks from untimed prep to actually timed prep. We learn all this great stuff via PowerScore, Manhattan LSAT and TLS forums, etc., and its easy to apply during untimed Qs- but I was wondering (and this is evidence that I haven't done much timed prep, aside from LG) how much of that actually goes through our mind during RC and especially LR timed sections.

So- quick question- "drilling?" I mean, I'm just about done going through Kaplan Mastery LR, and I do about 10 a day- however, I don't do timed, drilled sections of LR (like I would for LG). I just took my first timed LR section today (PT 42) and I guess that's why I'm a little freaked. So, drilling as in, specific LR types??

And to answer your first question,, "Yes." I am always open to advice on how to achieve a higher LSAT score.


@Cardozo: Thank you very much; that is great advice and I will definitely be referring back to it during my prep.

[Captain Rodeo]

In june I used to cheat and do 2-3 questions I knew would be difficult within each section before I began timing to keep calm and finish sections on time (although I was not really, lol). I kept doing this until I could finish sections within 30 with this little handicap. After that I no longer needed it.

So, abdistotle, do you mean like doing the last 2 or 3 questions of that section first, before timing begins? I like the idea of doing problems to get nerves down.

I can be pretty pessimistic and I get nervous doing timed sections when I just in the back room of my house haha

[CardozoLaw09]

@Cardozo: Thank you very much; that is great advice and I will definitely be referring back to it during my prep.

Really? lol, I deleted it because I reread your question and then my answer and thought it didn't really answer your question haha. But glad it helped!

[05062014]

Yeah, I used to do the last 2-3 (although in hindsight I would have used the handicap on the later teens (16-19) as they're usually harder than the last few questions of the section).

My strategy worked because it let me do quasi-timing constantly before strict timing eventually. The psychological boost gave me the will power to keep taking more sections which eventually gave me the experience necessary to get under the 35 min per section

[ilovelawtays]

@Cardozo: Thank you very much; that is great advice and I will definitely be referring back to it during my prep.

Really? lol, I deleted it because I reread your question and then my answer and thought it didn't really answer your question haha. But glad it helped!

I'm really glad you admitted this, because I thought I was going crazy.

[Captain Rodeo]

Well, I thought it was good advice generally, ha

Thanks for clearing that up abdistotle! Makes sense to me.

[JazzOne]

I think both factors are in play.

(1) Drilling time-consuming techniques can make you more proficient at the technique, which increases its utility on the timed exam. An example of this would be diagramming games. As you get better at diagramming, your timed accuracy goes up.

(2) However, I think there are other techniques like diagramming conditionals or the negation test which help you understand the underlying concepts, but you can't hope to use these technique all the time. The main utility is the conceptual understanding you gain by using the technique on un-timed practice. I throw these techniques "out the window" when a question is clear to me without the technique.

As always, it probably varies from person to person, but that was my experience. There was some overlap between the two categories as well. For instance, diagramming games certainly helped me to conceptualize them more clearly, and I do resort to diagramming conditionals for a couple arguments where the conditional relationship is particularly important (e.g., parallel reasoning questions).

[Captain Rodeo]

Thank you JazzOne! I really appreciate your answer. I just need to do more LR. Good luck with whatever you are doing post-LSAT!

[sabanist]

The advice above is all great, and I hope I can help a little with the timing issues.
I'm retaking in October, and right now I'm wrapping up Manhattan LR and drilling individual question types before I move on to PTs. Manhattan is all new to me, so when I drill, I'm not giving myself 35 minutes to do 25 questions - I'm noting my start and stop times and giving myself an average time per question when I finish. That way, I have a baseline for evaluation and motivation to work quickly, but it doesn't feel like too much pressure on top of the challenge of remembering and applying new techniques. If I'm under the 1:20 mark, I feel pretty good about it. If not, I note it as a problem area and work harder on it. There's never a need to panic - like LG, there will always be those games that take 5 minutes and those that take 10.

You have a while before test day. Your confidence and speed will build as you get a better handle on the material. Get to where you don't think LR is quite so gnarly before you force yourself to sprint through it.