February 2012 LSAT Study Group Forum

[willwash]

Wow. Some hard core LG drills tonight. I've discovered that I swear by Manhattan LSAT's free practice LGs. They are ridiculously hard compared to the real test. I went through 5 or 6 sections (individual games) and got my ass kicked on almost all of them. Then did 2 actual LSAT LG sections. -0 on both with TONS of time to spare.

I had a definite feeling as I worked through the Manhattan LSAT games that time was "flying". IE, by the time I'd gotten my initial diagram set up and developed a pretty good "feel" for the game, much more time had passed than I was used to having passed. After drilling a bunch of these, then doing the real thing, I experienced the opposite feeling. I'd get my diagrams set up and develop a feel for the game, look at my watch, and feel like I was ahead of schedule. And my accuracy was greatly improved.

Happily, there are lots more of these Manhattan LSAT games left that I haven't even looked at yet. I am going to make them an integral part of my LG drilling now.

[outlookingin]

Wow. Some hard core LG drills tonight. I've discovered that I swear by Manhattan LSAT's free practice LGs. They are ridiculously hard compared to the real test. I went through 5 or 6 sections (individual games) and got my ass kicked on almost all of them. Then did 2 actual LSAT LG sections. -0 on both with TONS of time to spare.

I had a definite feeling as I worked through the Manhattan LSAT games that time was "flying". IE, by the time I'd gotten my initial diagram set up and developed a pretty good "feel" for the game, much more time had passed than I was used to having passed. After drilling a bunch of these, then doing the real thing, I experienced the opposite feeling. I'd get my diagrams set up and develop a feel for the game, look at my watch, and feel like I was ahead of schedule. And my accuracy was greatly improved.

Happily, there are lots more of these Manhattan LSAT games left that I haven't even looked at yet. I am going to make them an integral part of my LG drilling now.

Interesting, I'd never even heard of these games... I'll try to get my hands on them. Do you find them on their website under the "Games Challenge" section? Or somewhere similar?

I second your experience--the more time you spend getting your ass kicked by games, the better off you'll be when it comes time to take a "real" game that is nowhere near as hard. Exceptions to that rule are, of course, when a "real" game is mega hard, and that throws me off a lot. Like the jugglers in two teams. Or the snakes and lizards.

[outlookingin]

OK, so I took PT 47 today. First test that I have taken in while, ever since deciding that I was going to go back and re-asses the fundamentals of LR. That was about 20 days ago. I'm disappointed about the result:

LR1: -3
LR2: -1
RC: -3
LG: -2
Raw: 91
Scaled: 171

And here is my log:

10/28 - PT 20 - 171
11/10 - PT 25 - 170
11/22 - PT 26 - 172
11/24 - PT 32 - 172
12/18 - PT 47 - 171

So essentially I have spent about 2.5 months going nowhere, at least PT score-wise. I really feel like this does not reflect my potential, I KNOW that the LR work I have been doing is effective... but somehow I'm not using it well or something?? More PTs to come to see if I can finally move into the mid 170s. Or even just 173 for Pete's sake.

So yeah pretty discouraging. And my time is running out b/c Xmas is upon us and I have some "mandatory down-time" coming up soon. Sooo that's going to hit the ol' LSAT score.

Hope all is well with everyone else. I saw the discussion about losing steam... I feel it too, particularly as I feel like I am running in place. Still, it is very motivating to be here with you guys, because even though you might not be working your asses off, you still score like savants. Gisney--178. Come on man. Killing the rest of us.

Cheers!

[Eichörnchen]

OK, so I took PT 47 today.
LR1: -3
LR2: -1
RC: -3
LG: -2
Raw: 91
Scaled: 171
...
And my time is running out b/c Xmas is upon us and I have some "mandatory down-time" coming up soon. Sooo that's going to hit the ol' LSAT score.

Hey, PT 47 was my last PT as well! If you want to talk anything from the test out let me know. Discussing specific problems is always great. And about the downtime - it can actually be really helpful. Trust me, you do NOT want to burn out. I did and my PTs scores plummeted. I went down to a 163 (!). I took over a month and did absolutely nothing and came back with a 170 as my first PT. So breaks are your friend. Maybe think of it like weights - you need the rest days to recover and let the ol' muscles grow. (Ahem, I've had way too many rest days lately personally though. )

For PT 47, RC was my worst. I got one wrong in each passage. I thought P1 was really dull and I didn't really capture what they were trying to get across to me, but this was made up by my strong love for P4. I've wondered before why parasites would ever be so virulent as to kill their own hosts, so I felt like I actually learned something there. In LG I went -3, two of them being careless errors.

I'm going to PT tomorrow. I'm not sure which one yet, but I hope it goes OK. (Scared...)

Gisney--178. Come on man. Killing the rest of us.

Oh and +1 to this.

[princeR]

Finished Cambridge RC package, a total of 76 passages complete, definitely felt much more confident in myself and developed a method of moving through them. I am now reworking my LR methods using Manhattans LR guide and than drilling them with Cambridges LR bundle (PT 21-40). Doing assumptions today.

Sufficient: Difficulty 1-4
1: 8/8
2: 13/13
3: 2/2
4: 13/19

[john1990]

Finished Cambridge RC package, a total of 76 passages complete, definitely felt much more confident in myself and developed a method of moving through them. I am now reworking my LR methods using Manhattans LR guide and than drilling them with Cambridges LR bundle (PT 21-40). Doing assumptions today.

Sufficient: Difficulty 1-4
1: 8/8
2: 13/13
3: 2/2
4: 13/19

JW, did you get the book or the PDF? I'm thinking of getting some PDF's and would like to know if they are printable

[Eichörnchen]

Finished Cambridge RC package, a total of 76 passages complete, definitely felt much more confident in myself and developed a method of moving through them. I am now reworking my LR methods using Manhattans LR guide and than drilling them with Cambridges LR bundle (PT 21-40). Doing assumptions today.

Sufficient: Difficulty 1-4
1: 8/8
2: 13/13
3: 2/2
4: 13/19

JW, did you get the book or the PDF? I'm thinking of getting some PDF's and would like to know if they are printable

The PDFs are printable. You can print them three times.

[willwash]

Wow. Some hard core LG drills tonight. I've discovered that I swear by Manhattan LSAT's free practice LGs. They are ridiculously hard compared to the real test. I went through 5 or 6 sections (individual games) and got my ass kicked on almost all of them. Then did 2 actual LSAT LG sections. -0 on both with TONS of time to spare.

I had a definite feeling as I worked through the Manhattan LSAT games that time was "flying". IE, by the time I'd gotten my initial diagram set up and developed a pretty good "feel" for the game, much more time had passed than I was used to having passed. After drilling a bunch of these, then doing the real thing, I experienced the opposite feeling. I'd get my diagrams set up and develop a feel for the game, look at my watch, and feel like I was ahead of schedule. And my accuracy was greatly improved.

Happily, there are lots more of these Manhattan LSAT games left that I haven't even looked at yet. I am going to make them an integral part of my LG drilling now.

Interesting, I'd never even heard of these games... I'll try to get my hands on them. Do you find them on their website under the "Games Challenge" section? Or somewhere similar?

I second your experience--the more time you spend getting your ass kicked by games, the better off you'll be when it comes time to take a "real" game that is nowhere near as hard. Exceptions to that rule are, of course, when a "real" game is mega hard, and that throws me off a lot. Like the jugglers in two teams. Or the snakes and lizards.

I found them on the Cambridge LSAT website, even though they're from Manhattan LSAT:

http://www.cambridgelsat.com/productdet ... actice/410

They are RETARDED hard. I recommend doing 4 or 5 of these, then doing a real LG section. It will feel like cake.

In other news, PT 54 for me tonight. Encouraging results, as I'm now two for two in the 170's (my hot streak continues!).

RC: -4 (this is very weak for me, I very rarely miss more than 2 in RC)
LR1: -2
LG: -1 (shoulda been a -0 but sometimes I don't know how to read)
LR2: -1

Raw 93
Scale 172

Trend:

PT 61 on 11/6=163
PT 64 on 11/9=168
PT 62 on 11/27=169
PT 63 on 12/3=168
RT 61 on 12/7=172
PT 60 on 12/11= 167
PT 52 on 12/14=174
PT 54 on 12/18=172

I'm VERY happy with that trend. May it continue linearly until test day
Just fooled around with Excel a little bit--according to its regression analysis, I should expect a 182 on 10 Feb

EDIT: Wow. Fucking idiot. Went over my wrong answers, and on one of them (RC#27), I straight up bubbled the wrong bubble on the scantron from my intended response, which was TCR. I don't know if I should call this a 173 or not? Either way, lesson effing learned the easy way this time.

[outlookingin]

OK, so I took PT 47 today.
LR1: -3
LR2: -1
RC: -3
LG: -2
Raw: 91
Scaled: 171
...
And my time is running out b/c Xmas is upon us and I have some "mandatory down-time" coming up soon. Sooo that's going to hit the ol' LSAT score.

Hey, PT 47 was my last PT as well! If you want to talk anything from the test out let me know. Discussing specific problems is always great. And about the downtime - it can actually be really helpful. Trust me, you do NOT want to burn out. I did and my PTs scores plummeted. I went down to a 163 (!). I took over a month and did absolutely nothing and came back with a 170 as my first PT. So breaks are your friend. Maybe think of it like weights - you need the rest days to recover and let the ol' muscles grow. (Ahem, I've had way too many rest days lately personally though. )

For PT 47, RC was my worst. I got one wrong in each passage. I thought P1 was really dull and I didn't really capture what they were trying to get across to me, but this was made up by my strong love for P4. I've wondered before why parasites would ever be so virulent as to kill their own hosts, so I felt like I actually learned something there. In LG I went -3, two of them being careless errors.

I'm going to PT tomorrow. I'm not sure which one yet, but I hope it goes OK. (Scared...)

Gisney--178. Come on man. Killing the rest of us.

Oh and +1 to this.

Cool thanks for the offer. Yeah I'm going to review today and we'll see what tripped me up. P3 was the courts vs. mediators article, and for some reason I missed two in a row on that one. I'll get to you with questions--but here's one: what did you use to study for RC?

[john1990]

Willwash, thanks for the link. Much appreciated

[willwash]

Willwash, thanks for the link. Much appreciated

NP. Have fun with those.

[Gisney]

So finished up the SuperPreps by taking C on Saturday

LR1 -4
LR2 -1
LG -3
RC -4

Raw: 89
Scaled: 172

About the same level of difficulty as SP B. The games were a little easier I just missed up a game by diagramming the rules in the wrong direction. I caught the mistake but fixing it took so much time I had to guess on 3 and got all three wrong.

I was suprised I got a -4 on RC. I thought I had done better than that but this seems to be the case with all my RC. I really and truly at the time think I have gotten the right answer and I am wrong. I guess I need to start drilling these more. Practice Practice mas y mas

So my pts thus far have been
PT RAW SCALED
1) 53 87 168
2) 40 94 173
3) 43 90 171
4) 56 83 165
5) 44 89 172
6) SPA 98 178
7) SPB 87 170
SPC 89 172

Averages for 8 Tests
Raw: 89.6
Scaled: 170.8

Average Missed each section for 8 tests
LR: -2.8
RC: -3.4
LG: -2.4

So I still have a long way to go. My scores feel very up and down. I want to be consistently scoring around 175 before test day so I have a 3 pt drop leeway that people say happens on test day. Ideally I hope to be scoring in the 178 range but we will see.

Okay so only two PTs this week (46 and 52)

At a cyber to print them out. The people love me here cause I keep printing out all this shit and its 15 cents a page which might not seem like a lot but on a Peace Corps salary I want to cry

[Gisney]

I'm going to PT tomorrow. I'm not sure which one yet, but I hope it goes OK. (Scared...)

Buena Suerte,
Glück,
and
Good Luck!

Gisney--178. Come on man. Killing the rest of us.

Oh and +1 to this.

Though really it seems to be a bit of an outlier. Glad I scored it because it shows I can but I think realistically we are all in the same range.

But may we all end up with my outlier score

[willwash]

So finished up the SuperPreps by taking C on Saturday

LR1 -4
LR2 -1
LG -3
RC -4

Raw: 89
Scaled: 172

Nice work. I'm in roughly the same boat. Looking to reach 176-178 range on PTs by test day for a 172-173 on the real thing.

I got the 10 new actual official tests with comparative reading book. 10 recent PTs for 22 bucks can't be beat.

Man, the tests I've been taking have been having brutal curves. I guess I should give the SuperPreps a try too.

[willwash]

So finished up the SuperPreps by taking C on Saturday

LR1 -4
LR2 -1
LG -3
RC -4

Raw: 89
Scaled: 172

Nice work. I'm in roughly the same boat. Looking to reach 176-178 range on PTs by test day for a 172-173 on the real thing.

I got the 10 new actual official tests with comparative reading book. 10 recent PTs for 22 bucks can't be beat.

Man, the tests I've been taking have been having brutal curves. I guess I should give the SuperPreps a try too.

I've revised my goal upward a little bit based on my PT trend. Originally gunning just for a 170, but given my recent PT performances I see no reason why I can't improve into the mid to high 170s. Chicago/Columbia might be within reach after all? Also wondering if a Hail Mary to HYS isn't out of the question if I get 178+...yeah, it probably is.

[Eichörnchen]

Cool thanks for the offer. Yeah I'm going to review today and we'll see what tripped me up. P3 was the courts vs. mediators article, and for some reason I missed two in a row on that one. I'll get to you with questions--but here's one: what did you use to study for RC?

Eh...to be honest...nothing. That makes me sound so lazy haha. I haven't really done any RC studying as of yet, but I bought the Manhattan RC book and plan on going through it. What's helped me in RC is being a naturally quick reader (thank God for being an insatiable reader as a child) and also I would go through Reading Comp sections with fellow studiers in the Manhattan online study room. There were a few people who would regularly ask me to read and mark up a passage, and then explain to them what my tactics were. Initially, t was to help them improve, but I'm sure that it helped me a lot as well! It used to be that PTing regularly was enough to keep my RC at my -2 average, but this past -4 has made it clear that I need to stop neglecting it.

For PT 47, as you review all the sections, if you have any questions, feel free to ask! I went -0 on both LRs (not expecting to keep that going in today's PT, but one can hope ) so I might be of some use there, plus there were still some that I found tricky so it'd be good to discuss.

I'm going to PT tomorrow. I'm not sure which one yet, but I hope it goes OK. (Scared...)

Buena Suerte,
Glück,
and
Good Luck!

Danke schön!

Nice work. I'm in roughly the same boat. Looking to reach 176-178 range on PTs by test day for a 172-173 on the real thing.

^ This is my hope...if I got a 173 on the real deal, this city wouldn't even be able handle my freakout.

[willwash]

That being said, there is a program the Navy has called the Law Education Program (LEP) that is seriously too good to be true. After your first tour, you go on shore duty...for those accepted to this program, their shore duty IS law school. Your tuition is completely paid, you continue to be paid your active duty salary, and when you graduate you enter the JAG corps. That's a full ride to law school, a near-six-figure salary while enrolled in law school (with no other military duties), and guaranteed employment upon graduation at about 100k a year.

Needless to say, now that I'm about halfway through my tour and need to start thinking about where I want my Navy career to go, I am looking seriously at this program.

Well, I've followed up on this and it turns out LEP is going to be impossible for me due to the time in service limitations. I've decided going on sabbatical is also a bad idea, because I lose all flexibility. The best thing for me is to finish up my service obligation completely, which gives my wife time to go to grad school and earn a higher salary for my eventual entry into LS.

This means I will not be applying for the 2013 cycle. My service obligation ends in December 2015, but if I save up enough leave (75 days by 1 October 2014), I will have enough leave to go on terminal leave and begin LS in the fall of 2015.

Pros to this are many:

1) I get to be an NROTC instructor (hopefully AT UVA) prior to applying to law school there. It's a fairly easy job that leaves lots of time for personal development, so that's good, and it would get my foot in with faculty at UVA. I could take some classes there and get good grades too...while this will not help my official UGPA, it will show how my increased maturity has allowed me to perform at a high level academically (not that having made it through Navy flight school doesn'd do that).

2) I gain complete control over my destiny. If I used the sabbatical program, I would be required to reenter Naval service (JAG or not!) because the sabbatical program incurs additional service obligation that would be in addition to my unfulfilled aviation service obligation. This way I could take a 160k BigLaw job rather than rejoin the Navy (tough call there) if I wanted to.

3) My wife is finishing up her Bachelor's in Nursing right now. Original plan was for her to work as a BSN while I went to LS and we'd barely squeak by. New plan lets her get her masters in nursing before I leave the Navy and earn a much higher salary while I'm not earning anything.

4) Less stressful...CIPP is going away and they may or may not renew it in time for me to have used it for my original plan anyway. Just going ahead and doing NROTC for 2 years alleviates all worry.

5) It also keeps my ~$90k salary coming in for 2 years longer. This should be long enough to pay off most of my mortgage balance before I leave Norfolk.

Cons are few:

1) So I'll be 2 years older (35 instead of 33) upon completion of law school.

And that's all I can really think of.

So I'll still take the LSAT in Feb, I think, because it looks based on my current PT trend that I am going to time my peak perfectly for a great score. Don't wanna screw with that. But I won't apply until the 2015 cycle.

[Gisney]

Took PT 46 today with esp

RC: -4 (mierda)
LR1: -0
exp LR from pt 28: -2
LR2: -3 (hmpf)
LG: -1

Raw: 92
Scaled: 172

The lack of improvement on RC is totally my fault. I am not doing anything to fix it but I keep hoping it will improve magiically in the next test.

Okay so I will reread MLSAT and drill RC. For those ho drill RC, how many do you do in one day?

[Eichörnchen]

I did PT 48 yesterday...

LR1: -1
RC: -0
LR2: -1
...

LG: -9

LG: -9

LG: -9

LG: -9

Agh. I was in the silent study room of the library, and the girl sitting next to me at the table let her phone ring at the end of my LG section, and then picked it up and started talking. Totally threw me off. Soo...I had -0 in LG til #14, and then during the cell phone fiasco - EVERY SINGLE QUESTION I DID WAS WRONG. Damn.

Came to a grand total of a 168. Not bad, but every other section was soo good I could've done really well. Crap. That puts a scare back into me. Guess my battle with LG is far from over.

willwash, that sounds like a good plan, though it's doubtful that I understood most of those acronyms. Feb full speed ahead!

Gisney, nice work on the 172!

[bdegoli1]

Hey everybody! First time posting on this site, been reading threads on here for about a year and a half. I did 3 months of prep last summer ('10), chose not to take the October test, took about a year off from prep to finish senior year, and now I'm 'funemployed' and attacking the LSAT like it's my business with the intention of taking the February test.

My goal is a 178 or better, but honestly I'm shooting for a 180. My UGPA is about a 3.73 from a top-3 LAC, which I think is good enough to get me in anywhere but YLS with a 178-180 LSAT. Recent PTs: 178 178 175 178 178 (all in the last 10 days). So I'm getting close. If anybody is in the same boat, PM me and let's chat about strategy.

All that said, here are a few thoughts:

1: Check out this thread. It is IMO the best out there, and somehow has slipped under the radar for most folks:

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 2&t=120471

2: Take your time. Especially if you're taking this February test, it means you won't be applying in the 2011-2012 cycle, so if you aren't happy with your PT scores, hold off and take the test later. Even if you take a few months off from prep, it comes back easily. My initial diagnostic was a 163, and now I haven't PTed under a 175 in my last 10 tests.

3: Check out the above thread. Anything I can tell you I learned there. Good luck. Hit me up if you want to talk strategy. I'm in the Bay Area and would be down to meet up with people for study sessions. I'll keep updating over the next 7 weeks (as for right now, my plan is to take 35 PTs in that time, often doubling up (8-section PTs), and figuring out how to best manage my body (daily exercise, ideal caffeine intake, meditation, etc.)

[Eichörnchen]

Welcome to TLS bdegoli1! (Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate )

How long did it take you to get from the low 170s to the upper? I'm hoping I have enough time to get there before the big day. Any suggestions (especially if LG was your weakness)? And I'll +1 TLS1776. Dude's crazy.

[princeR]

Finished the Cambridge Necessary Assumptions yesterday, had something like 120 questions. Started working on Flaw today. As I've posted earlier, I am going through the Manhattan LR guide and drilling with the Cambridge PDFs from PT's 21-40. I would definitely recommend Manhattan over PS. I plan on finishing flaw tomorrow and return to RC and continue to mix in just a couple passages to continue to fine tune that area. I'll go back to LG (which I got to the point of consistently getting -0, and pretty sure that's what I got on the Dec LSAT) after new years. I am feeling VERY confident right now. Manhattan definitely has some better ways of describing its methods than PS and I really do feel like I'm getting better. I was PT'ing consistently around 161-163, and a couple of times hit 170 and 168. On the Dec test I really have no idea how the LRs went, I was starting to burnout on these before the test, but I know that I aced LG but the RC was just a monster. I really had NO idea how to approach them and tried to read and remember everything, so in my PT's I was ranging anywhere from -5/-13. I ended up having to guess on almost all of the last passage because I forgot to start my timer and freaked out, plus it was a tough passage. I really feel like I should be able to at least get 165, which is what I am shooting for, but I know I could do much better. Lets go February!

[outlookingin]

I did PT 48 yesterday...

LR1: -1
RC: -0
LR2: -1
...

LG: -9

LG: -9

LG: -9

LG: -9

Agh. I was in the silent study room of the library, and the girl sitting next to me at the table let her phone ring at the end of my LG section, and then picked it up and started talking. Totally threw me off. Soo...I had -0 in LG til #14, and then during the cell phone fiasco - EVERY SINGLE QUESTION I DID WAS WRONG. Damn.

Came to a grand total of a 168. Not bad, but every other section was soo good I could've done really well. Crap. That puts a scare back into me. Guess my battle with LG is far from over.

willwash, that sounds like a good plan, though it's doubtful that I understood most of those acronyms. Feb full speed ahead!

Gisney, nice work on the 172!

I definitely feel your pain. I got a pretty hefty dose of feeling shitty yesterday after taking PT 50. Started out wrong and never recovered:

RC: -3
LR1: -2
LG: -2
LR2: -6

Scaled: 167

Minus six on LR2. For real. All but one in a row, from 12 to 16. It's like I started tripping and fell flat on my face until I turned the page. I was panicking the whole test, couldn't stop thinking about the last RC passage (which turns out I only missed 2 on, but that is purely luck because I had no idea what the hell was going on): RIDDLED BASINS. Holy moley was that impossible. I almost took a poo on myself and quit right there.

So yeah what bdegoli just said is kinda resonating with me right now... if I'm not hitting the scores I want (mid-to-high 170s) by registration time (January 16th for me, overseas) I am not taking this in February. Something seems off, and I KNOW I can do better...

Taking PT 48 tomorrow (I'll keep an eye out for that game, Eich), as my last chance at not feeling like a total weenie. After tomorrow I'm not going to look at the LSAT until after the year turns.

Yeah I also want to second what bdegoli said about TLS1776. That guy is like my Mohammed, Jesus, Buddha, everything. Jonathan Livingston Seagull too. I'm going to print his thread out, have it bound, and give it to myself for Christmas.

[outlookingin]

Took PT 46 today with esp

RC: -4 (mierda)
LR1: -0
exp LR from pt 28: -2
LR2: -3 (hmpf)
LG: -1

Raw: 92
Scaled: 172

The lack of improvement on RC is totally my fault. I am not doing anything to fix it but I keep hoping it will improve magiically in the next test.

Okay so I will reread MLSAT and drill RC. For those ho drill RC, how many do you do in one day?

Yeah word on this RC stuff. It's like the silent sleeper of score disasters. I did some searching around after taking PT 50 and discovered that I'm in for a world of hurt. RC seemed like a done deal before, and now I'm wondering what hit me.

[Gisney]

Finished up Parallel Flaw andEvaluate today. Been ignoring these for awhile bc I was burntout.

Parallel Flaw

1: 100%
2: 80%
3: 90%
4: 96%

Evaluate

1: 100%
2: 80%
3: 100%
4: 100%

All I have left is Paradox and I am finally done!

Reviewing Sp C and PT 46 today then taking 52 tomorrow. After that I will be off til Dec 27th.