real The Official December 2016 Waiters Group - Patience is a Virtue Forum

[SunDevil14]

Tied my personal best yesterday.

PT 42: 172
LG: -0
LR: -2
LR: -5
RC: -2

[Walliums]

How are you all aiming timing-wise for LG? I feel like I am so slow... Right now I'm aiming for 2:00 diagram, then about 1:00 per question (but it definitely doesn't always work out that way question-wise).

Try doing most of the work up front. A lot people find it preferable to take 4-5 minutes setting up the game and making inferences and then only spending a few minutes on the questions.

How is that possible? My process is to read through the scenario and the rules, decide how I want to diagram, notate the rules, try to fill out the diagram as much as possible, and then move onto the questions.

[Barack O'Drama]

How are you all aiming timing-wise for LG? I feel like I am so slow... Right now I'm aiming for 2:00 diagram, then about 1:00 per question (but it definitely doesn't always work out that way question-wise).

I also try to do as much work upfront as possible, especially with grouping games. The newer sequencing I have heard tend to have fewer inferences, though I'm not sure how true that is.

My LG strategy has been just trying to get beastly fast and accurate at sequencing games that I find easier, then give myself more time for the one harder game that usually takes me longer.

I think aiming for 2 minutes for a set up sounds about right though.

[Mikey]

PT50 (2 sections)
LG3: -0 (33 mins)
LR2: -3 (35 mins) -- almost ran out of time on the 1 parallel question but got lucky and chose an answer that i read first and THINK i got it right, we'll see.

Did LG earlier and just finished LR2 a few moments ago. Will be reviewing the LR in a bit.

My biggest LR issue, besides going like -3/-4 per section, is not being able to finish 26Q sections on time. I always have 1 left over and the 25Q ones i usually finish right on 35 mins, sometimes a min before if i zoom through the easy ones but i always fall into the time sink of the harder questions, smfh.

[SunDevil14]

How are you all aiming timing-wise for LG? I feel like I am so slow... Right now I'm aiming for 2:00 diagram, then about 1:00 per question (but it definitely doesn't always work out that way question-wise).

Try doing most of the work up front. A lot people find it preferable to take 4-5 minutes setting up the game and making inferences and then only spending a few minutes on the questions.

How is that possible? My process is to read through the scenario and the rules, decide how I want to diagram, notate the rules, try to fill out the diagram as much as possible, and then move onto the questions.

With some games it is not possible, but many games allow you to master all the possibilities or at least concisely diagram most of the possibilities. In addition, a lot of the time 1 or 2 key inferences will allow you to quickly answer the questions. Often these inferences are found by combining rules, taking stock of limited options in the diagram etc. You may want to also draw more than one diagram. By splitting the diagram into 2 or 3 sub diagrams you may be better able to see different insights.

Really simplistic Example for a 1 to 1 sequence game:
-F is either in slot 1 or else slot 6
-G is either in slot 2 or else 5

Draw 4 diagrams before hitting the questions:
-F1 G2
-F1 G5
-F6 G2
-F6 G5

Fill in the 4 diagrams as much as possible before attacking the questions. You may find that between splitting the diagram and combining some additional rules that you can in fact completely fill out 3/4 diagrams and have a good grasp of the few options in the 4th diagram. This will help you answer the questions more quickly rather than 1 Diagram that has several options which are not readily deduced.

[SunDevil14]

Tied my personal best yesterday.

PT 42: 172
LG: -0
LR: -2
LR: -5
RC: -2

Did a Review Today and realized that I got 2 questions wrong due to mistakes while transferring answers from the test book to the scantron. If I discount the transferring error, then I attained a new personal best.

PT 42: 174
LG:-0
LR 1: -2
RC: -1
LR 2: -4

^ That being said, when I have about a minute left at the end of a section I go back and double check to make sure I transferred my answers correctly. Although occasionally time does not permit, and when reviewing I notice transferring errors. I use the cluster transfer method, where I usually do a page or two of questions before transferring all at once. I have chosen this method because I believe that it is quick and allows me to get into a better flow. TBH any mistake made in transferring answers is too many, so I am considering transferring after every question. Does the latter method slow you down to a noticable degree or tend to interrupt your flow while answering questions? Those two factors are my main concern.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Tied my personal best yesterday.

PT 42: 172
LG: -0
LR: -2
LR: -5
RC: -2

Did a Review Today and realized that I got 2 questions wrong due to mistakes while transferring answers from the test book to the scantron. If I discount the transferring error, then I attained a new personal best.

PT 42: 174
LG:-0
LR 1: -2
RC: -1
LR 2: -4

^ That being said, when I have about a minute left at the end of a section I go back and double check to make sure I transferred my answers correctly. Although occasionally time does not permit, and when reviewing I notice transferring errors. I use the cluster transfer method, where I usually do a page or two of questions before transferring all at once. I have chosen this method because I believe that it is quick and allows me to get into a better flow. TBH any mistake made in transferring answers is too many, so I am considering transferring after every question. Does the latter method slow you down to a noticable degree or tend to interrupt your flow while answering questions? Those two factors are my main concern.

I haven't tested the different methods against each other, but for LR i do it after every question to give my mind a mental rest or every two. Honestly, just whatever i think of doing. Then in LG/RC I'll do it after every game/passage or if I get through like three questions and just want to breath I second, I will stop and bubble in now. I haven't had any time issues per se from bubbling... But, ya you should not be making bubbling mistakes. Thats a silly way to not perform at your best!

[SunDevil14]

Tied my personal best yesterday.

PT 42: 172
LG: -0
LR: -2
LR: -5
RC: -2

Did a Review Today and realized that I got 2 questions wrong due to mistakes while transferring answers from the test book to the scantron. If I discount the transferring error, then I attained a new personal best.

PT 42: 174
LG:-0
LR 1: -2
RC: -1
LR 2: -4

^ That being said, when I have about a minute left at the end of a section I go back and double check to make sure I transferred my answers correctly. Although occasionally time does not permit, and when reviewing I notice transferring errors. I use the cluster transfer method, where I usually do a page or two of questions before transferring all at once. I have chosen this method because I believe that it is quick and allows me to get into a better flow. TBH any mistake made in transferring answers is too many, so I am considering transferring after every question. Does the latter method slow you down to a noticable degree or tend to interrupt your flow while answering questions? Those two factors are my main concern.

I haven't tested the different methods against each other, but for LR i do it after every question to give my mind a mental rest or every two. Honestly, just whatever i think of doing. Then in LG/RC I'll do it after every game/passage or if I get through like three questions and just want to breath I second, I will stop and bubble in now. I haven't had any time issues per se from bubbling... But, ya you should not be making bubbling mistakes. Thats a silly way to not perform at your best!

Makes sense I will give it shot. It is usually the LR sections that I make these errors. Probably because more time is spent between questions where as RC and LG are done in quick succession.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Tied my personal best yesterday.

PT 42: 172
LG: -0
LR: -2
LR: -5
RC: -2

Did a Review Today and realized that I got 2 questions wrong due to mistakes while transferring answers from the test book to the scantron. If I discount the transferring error, then I attained a new personal best.

PT 42: 174
LG:-0
LR 1: -2
RC: -1
LR 2: -4

^ That being said, when I have about a minute left at the end of a section I go back and double check to make sure I transferred my answers correctly. Although occasionally time does not permit, and when reviewing I notice transferring errors. I use the cluster transfer method, where I usually do a page or two of questions before transferring all at once. I have chosen this method because I believe that it is quick and allows me to get into a better flow. TBH any mistake made in transferring answers is too many, so I am considering transferring after every question. Does the latter method slow you down to a noticable degree or tend to interrupt your flow while answering questions? Those two factors are my main concern.

I haven't tested the different methods against each other, but for LR i do it after every question to give my mind a mental rest or every two. Honestly, just whatever i think of doing. Then in LG/RC I'll do it after every game/passage or if I get through like three questions and just want to breath I second, I will stop and bubble in now. I haven't had any time issues per se from bubbling... But, ya you should not be making bubbling mistakes. Thats a silly way to not perform at your best!

Makes sense I will give it shot. It is usually the LR sections that I make these errors. Probably because more time is spent between questions where as RC and LG are done in quick succession.

Yeah, i think with LR if you have a bunch of questions to bubble in--you naturally are going to try to go as fast as possible and the more questions you have in a short amt of time, the more likely you are to make a mistake. If you like doing grouping, try smaller groups like: Columns, or every 2-3 questions--something like that

[34iplaw]

I really hope I won't be posting here next week.

Keep killing it December people.

[blackmamba8]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

[SunDevil14]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Great score, very impressive on logical reasoning. 7sage has helped me a lot LG Could you elaborate a bit on how 7sage has helped you with LR?

[blackmamba8]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Great score, very impressive on logical reasoning. 7sage has helped me a lot LG Could you elaborate a bit on how 7sage has helped you with LR?

Thanks! I've been averaging around -2 per LR section and hadn't gone -0 total on two sections before so I was pleasantly surprised. 7sage has helped me pick up on a lot of minor details that just didn't really click for me while I was going through the Manhattan LR Book. Their videos where they'll spend 6-7 minutes on a single question have really helped me with breaking down the stimulus and understanding what exactly I'm supposed to be looking for given a certain question stem. For example, I'm going through the Weaken lessons right now and it's finally clicking for me that I'm not looking to attack the premises or conclusions which had caused me problems in the past. Going through their videos has also helped me start to pick up on a lot of the common "trap answers" LSAC likes to throw at us which has helped me a lot when I've narrowed it down to two answers. Have you bought one of their courses or do you just use their free LG explanations?

[connordalto]

Hi all, hope your prepping is going well. I am now at my pt and drilling stage and am running into problems with endurance and stamina. I am consistently going -1-3 on lg, and do great on my first lr section (-3-5), but seem to lose focus on the 4th and 5th sections, and have even gone as bad as -9/10 on lr/ RC, -5/6 games on these later ones. It seems that these are not comprehension issues, since I do much better on individual sections, but that my brain gets tired and fuzzy.

Have you guys experienced anything like this yourselves, and did any remedies work? My plan is just to bang out as many pts as possible between now and test day and hope this fixes it. Thanks!!!

[SunDevil14]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Great score, very impressive on logical reasoning. 7sage has helped me a lot LG Could you elaborate a bit on how 7sage has helped you with LR?

Thanks! I've been averaging around -2 per LR section and hadn't gone -0 total on two sections before so I was pleasantly surprised. 7sage has helped me pick up on a lot of minor details that just didn't really click for me while I was going through the Manhattan LR Book. Their videos where they'll spend 6-7 minutes on a single question have really helped me with breaking down the stimulus and understanding what exactly I'm supposed to be looking for given a certain question stem. For example, I'm going through the Weaken lessons right now and it's finally clicking for me that I'm not looking to attack the premises or conclusions which had caused me problems in the past. Going through their videos has also helped me start to pick up on a lot of the common "trap answers" LSAC likes to throw at us which has helped me a lot when I've narrowed it down to two answers. Have you bought one of their courses or do you just use their free LG explanations?

Thanks for the explanation. Aside from their LG videos, I am more or less self taught. I buy the prep books and pt's and really analyze all that I do. I am not too sure how much I'd benefit from their videos at this point. My last three tests were 170, 172, 174* (discount a small bubbling error). My average LR score on the last 3 tests was -3.5 per section. At this point I am just brute forcing way may through my weak question types and really analyzing each question, 50 or 100 so questions at a time.

[LSAT Hacks (Graeme)]

Anyone studying for the Dec LSAT in Toronto? I'm going to be visiting for a few days towards the end of the month, I'll be teaching a weekend class on the 29th and 30th. If you're interested in that class, let me know and I'll send you details.

But I'm also looking to meet with people who use my site. For those who don't recognize me from my username, I'm the creator of LSAT Hacks, which has a few thousand free LSAT explanations. So I'm guessing there are people here in Toronto who use my stuff. If you'd like to meet up while I'm in town, let me know.

I think posting this here is alright as far as TLS policy goes, but if it isn't, let me know.

[blackmamba8]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Great score, very impressive on logical reasoning. 7sage has helped me a lot LG Could you elaborate a bit on how 7sage has helped you with LR?

Thanks! I've been averaging around -2 per LR section and hadn't gone -0 total on two sections before so I was pleasantly surprised. 7sage has helped me pick up on a lot of minor details that just didn't really click for me while I was going through the Manhattan LR Book. Their videos where they'll spend 6-7 minutes on a single question have really helped me with breaking down the stimulus and understanding what exactly I'm supposed to be looking for given a certain question stem. For example, I'm going through the Weaken lessons right now and it's finally clicking for me that I'm not looking to attack the premises or conclusions which had caused me problems in the past. Going through their videos has also helped me start to pick up on a lot of the common "trap answers" LSAC likes to throw at us which has helped me a lot when I've narrowed it down to two answers. Have you bought one of their courses or do you just use their free LG explanations?

Thanks for the explanation. Aside from their LG videos, I am more or less self taught. I buy the prep books and pt's and really analyze all that I do. I am not too sure how much I'd benefit from their videos at this point. My last three tests were 170, 172, 174* (discount a small bubbling error). My average LR score on the last 3 tests was -3.5 per section. At this point I am just brute forcing way may through my weak question types and really analyzing each question, 50 or 100 so questions at a time.

Ahh okay gotcha. A lot of the LR content I've went through on 7sage has been on foundational things. If you've got a good handle there then there probably wouldn't be very much added that you didn't already know. When you're going through your weak question types do you do them untimed and break down each question as you go along or do you do timed sets and then break them down once you've finished the set?

[earldasquirel]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Well done! I just took PT 57 today too and -0 on LR is very impressive. There were some pretty tough questions (siberian clovis points...). I went -0 LG, -7 LR, -3 RC. Dinosaur game was tough and time consuming.

[blackmamba8]

PT57 - 174

LG: -3
LR1: -0
LR2: -0
RC: -4

The things I'd do for this to end up being my September score. 7sage has really been helping me with LR. I finished the first two games in 15 minutes and then proceeded to spend about 18 minutes on game 3

Well done! I just took PT 57 today too and -0 on LR is very impressive. There were some pretty tough questions (siberian clovis points...). I went -0 LG, -7 LR, -3 RC. Dinosaur game was tough and time consuming.

Thank you! I feel like I've done several questions lately with similar topics as the Siberian clovis one. Remembering what those questions wanted helped me figure out how to deal with it. Great job on going -0 on that LG section! Dinosaurs was definitely terrible. How long did it take you to get through it? By the time I got to the last question or two I think I realized a few things that would've helped me early on so I'm going to try it again in a few days before I watch the 7sage video on it.

[Instrumental]

I really hope I won't be posting here next week.

Keep killing it December people.

Love you guys, but this.

[earldasquirel]

Thank you! I feel like I've done several questions lately with similar topics as the Siberian clovis one. Remembering what those questions wanted helped me figure out how to deal with it. Great job on going -0 on that LG section! Dinosaurs was definitely terrible. How long did it take you to get through it? By the time I got to the last question or two I think I realized a few things that would've helped me early on so I'm going to try it again in a few days before I watch the 7sage video on it.

The dino game took me between 12-14 minutes. Luckily, I breezed through the very first game in around 5 minutes so I did have some time to spare, and the other two games were not too bad. My strategy lately has been focusing on finishing the first 2 games quickly (but dont hurry) in <15 mins so I have more time for the inevitably tougher last 2 games

[Rigo]

Was originally going to take February after not touching LSAT stuff since 2014. Started doing LG sections today and although I'm rusty, I think I can pull it together quickly if I put the time in.

Considering signing up for December and going full throttle like a madman. The thought of spending of 3 more months on LSAT is depressing. I just want it to be over with once and for all.

Tentative check-in. I'm going to take a diagnostic Monday and then decide.

[WWhitman]

I am really enjoying the approach of the trainer. Love the approach-- it is helping me really build on to my already extremely strong foundation and understanding how LSAC things. Although, sometimes I feel like there is a lot of fluff, it does usually tie in and I have an epiphany.

I feel the same way about The Trainer. the fluff does usually tie in. Usually, lol.

I have the 2013 version of The Trainer, and was wondering if I should be buying the 2016 version or are they almost the same?

[WWhitman]

Just briefly ran into someone today, who got 179 last year, and instead of admiring him, I had a brief moment of pure hatred toward him. What has the LSAT done to me and who have I become?!?!?!

[Rupert Pupkin]

I am really enjoying the approach of the trainer. Love the approach-- it is helping me really build on to my already extremely strong foundation and understanding how LSAC things. Although, sometimes I feel like there is a lot of fluff, it does usually tie in and I have an epiphany.

I feel the same way about The Trainer. the fluff does usually tie in. Usually, lol.

I have the 2013 version of The Trainer, and was wondering if I should be buying the 2016 version or are they almost the same?

Im not too sure how much the version updates differ. Maybe PM mike kim on TLS or post on the Trainer thread