October Test Takers Prep starts HERE Forum

[hennenr]

I'm going to take the October test as well. Started studying about 5 weeks ago using the 5 month schedule on the lsatblog.blogspot.com website. Almost finished with his logical reasoning section but I'm still 6 weeks away from taking my first prep test. Hopefully it'll be worth the wait.

[weejonbu]

I'm having trouble understanding grouping games. Do you guys use an Out Group as well as an In Group? That is, identify the variables that are selected and those that are not selected?

I use the Logic Games Bible method for grouping games, which I believe is different from what you're talking about. I think that identifying two separate groups can be more time consuming as opposed to identifying what MUST BE TRUE and what CANNOT BE TRUE and then setting up restrictions with Not Laws, Blocks, Not Blocks, etc. Sorry if you have not gone through the LG Bible and these terms are foreign. Basically, the LGB teaches that instead of defining an "In Group" and "Out Group," it is most effective to define what MUST BE TRUE and what CANNOT BE TRUE. This gives you the spectrum of availabe spaces and variables. Hope that makes sense.

[amoore]

List your background and study techniques.
Background:
Finished my Undergrad in Dec 06, MBA May 10
I'm limited to Houston schools (have a husband and 3 year old) so UH is my goal

Biggest Strength: Reading Comprehension

Biggest Weakness: LG

Target: 172 for now, but realistically I'm looking for 165-170

I'm going to use Pithypikes method unless I find something that is better but I dont have much time to look. Haven't really had much time to study finishing up my MBA and working full time as an accountant with a family so.....I am SO with you hard core test takers.

Good luck everyone!!

[Campagnolo]

Thanks, weejonbu.

I've read through the LG Bible, but I guess I have trouble using and keeping track of double not arrow rules, e.g., A <--/--> B

If you have two 'in groups' and one 'out group', how do you show a double not arrow rule in the setup? If you have an out group, you can put a dual-option in the out group, because you know that at least one of A and B will not be selected. If you don't have an out group, you can't represent the rule in your diagram because both A and B could be unselected.

Does this make sense?

Thanks everyone.

[LSAT Blog]

You could just put the double not arrow on the side with your other rules.

[DavidYurman85]

I'm work full time so I'm prepping in the evenings, on lunch breaks, weekends, and during any lull in the day. I started in May, but I have about a month before I take a full practice test.

Oh, I'm also self-prepping and I have an "in home tutor" (g/f is an atty and scored high on the lsat). G/L to all!

[brickman]

Thanks, weejonbu.

I've read through the LG Bible, but I guess I have trouble using and keeping track of double not arrow rules, e.g., A <--/--> B

If you have two 'in groups' and one 'out group', how do you show a double not arrow rule in the setup? If you have an out group, you can put a dual-option in the out group, because you know that at least one of A and B will not be selected. If you don't have an out group, you can't represent the rule in your diagram because both A and B could be unselected.

Does this make sense?

Thanks everyone.

I usually represent it with some numerical indicators such as:

a<--0--/---1--->b The numbers indicate the possibilities, i.e. neither (0) are selected or one (1) of the variables is selected. This means that it is not the case that (2) both could be selected.

For the double arrow I represent it as:

a<---0---2--->b

Since this represents a biconditional statement in which each variable is necessary and sufficient for the other, it is not the case that there could exist one or the other (1) variable, but it is possible that neither could be represented (0), or that both could be represented (2).

For the double not arrow with negative terms, I represent it as follows:

~a<--1---/----2--->~b

This means when A is not selected it is not the case that b can not be selected, thus b must be selected. The absence of one variable insures the presence of the other, thus (1) is the minimum number of variables that could be represented. Further, since we know we can not have zero variables represented (due to the fact that the absence of one variable insures the presence of the other), it is not limited from having both variables present, because the relationship does not restrict it, thus 2=both is a potential option.

[TMT90]

To those of you who swear by the Powerscore bibles, how poorly were you performing in LG and LR prior to studying the bibles? I'm doing sections of a PT untimed and so far I have -11 LR1 and -5 on two LG games, with two more to go before I hit LR2 and RC. So far -16 and barely half way is terrible and my bibles are en route as we speak, arriving Thursday. I'm hoping my numbers improve before I start to lose hope even though my studying has just begun. Not looking forward to getting a score after this, even though it probably doesn't count if it isn't timed.

[brickman]

To those of you who swear by the Powerscore bibles, how poorly were you performing in LG and LR prior to studying the bibles? I'm doing sections of a PT untimed and so far I have -11 LR1 and -5 on two LG games, with two more to go before I hit LR2 and RC. So far -16 and barely half way is terrible and my bibles are en route as we speak, arriving Thursday. I'm hoping my numbers improve before I start to lose hope even though my studying has just begun. Not looking forward to getting a score after this, even though it probably doesn't count if it isn't timed.

I wouldn't be so pessimistic, rather look to apply yourself to your work within a system. I found for myself that the following info is a good mix of data to draw from when it comes to preparing (at least it quelled any of my potential fears about finding a system to prepare myself for the test)

5-month lsat study guide:
http://lsatblog.blogspot.com/2010/05/5- ... -plan.html

Pithypike's study guide:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =6&t=41657

StanleyOttoSwift's PT review approach:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =6&t=36512

Voyager's reading comprehension guide:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... f=6&t=7240

The benefit of each of these documents to your own study plan is dependent on what you are looking to do. Take each of the suggestions and try to distill them to create your own plan of study. I find that the 5 month lsat study guide is quite a good framework to work within and can be supplemented by the daily exercises id'd by Pithpike's. SOS pt review approach seems like it makes the most out of each PT and is a good way to understand your absolute as well as time skills. Finally, voyager's reading comprehension guide is a nice intro to how to approach the section and some useful tips.

Finally, as a personal note, don't stress. There is no value to stressing. There is value in planing on what you want to do and then executing it. Don't get frustrated by initial or even late indicators of performance. Trust in the benefits of studying and concentration. After all, you can't really do too much else, we all have our own limitations and we have to come to accept them and then study a shiddd ton to make up for them.

[Campagnolo]

Thanks, weejonbu.

I've read through the LG Bible, but I guess I have trouble using and keeping track of double not arrow rules, e.g., A <--/--> B

If you have two 'in groups' and one 'out group', how do you show a double not arrow rule in the setup? If you have an out group, you can put a dual-option in the out group, because you know that at least one of A and B will not be selected. If you don't have an out group, you can't represent the rule in your diagram because both A and B could be unselected.

Does this make sense?

Thanks everyone.

I usually represent it with some numerical indicators such as:

a<--0--/---1--->b The numbers indicate the possibilities, i.e. neither (0) are selected or one (1) of the variables is selected. This means that it is not the case that (2) both could be selected.

For the double arrow I represent it as:

a<---0---2--->b

Since this represents a biconditional statement in which each variable is necessary and sufficient for the other, it is not the case that there could exist one or the other (1) variable, but it is possible that neither could be represented (0), or that both could be represented (2).

For the double not arrow with negative terms, I represent it as follows:

~a<--1---/----2--->~b

This means when A is not selected it is not the case that b can not be selected, thus b must be selected. The absence of one variable insures the presence of the other, thus (1) is the minimum number of variables that could be represented. Further, since we know we can not have zero variables represented (due to the fact that the absence of one variable insures the presence of the other), it is not limited from having both variables present, because the relationship does not restrict it, thus 2=both is a potential option.

I see what you're doing here, and I think the numbers inserted in your arrows are a little redundant in the sense that the <---> and <--/--> symbols already capture the idea that variables are selected as a block or cannot be selected together, respectively. I guess I long for a system that incorporates rules where ever possible, and including an 'out group' helps me do this. This doesn't seem to be an issue for others, and I'll just have to try grouping games both with and without the out group to see what works best for me.

[TMT90]

To those of you who swear by the Powerscore bibles, how poorly were you performing in LG and LR prior to studying the bibles? I'm doing sections of a PT untimed and so far I have -11 LR1 and -5 on two LG games, with two more to go before I hit LR2 and RC. So far -16 and barely half way is terrible and my bibles are en route as we speak, arriving Thursday. I'm hoping my numbers improve before I start to lose hope even though my studying has just begun. Not looking forward to getting a score after this, even though it probably doesn't count if it isn't timed.

I wouldn't be so pessimistic, rather look to apply yourself to your work within a system. I found for myself that the following info is a good mix of data to draw from when it comes to preparing (at least it quelled any of my potential fears about finding a system to prepare myself for the test)

5-month lsat study guide:
http://lsatblog.blogspot.com/2010/05/5- ... -plan.html

Pithypike's study guide:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =6&t=41657

StanleyOttoSwift's PT review approach:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =6&t=36512

Voyager's reading comprehension guide:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... f=6&t=7240

The benefit of each of these documents to your own study plan is dependent on what you are looking to do. Take each of the suggestions and try to distill them to create your own plan of study. I find that the 5 month lsat study guide is quite a good framework to work within and can be supplemented by the daily exercises id'd by Pithpike's. SOS pt review approach seems like it makes the most out of each PT and is a good way to understand your absolute as well as time skills. Finally, voyager's reading comprehension guide is a nice intro to how to approach the section and some useful tips.

Finally, as a personal note, don't stress. There is no value to stressing. There is value in planing on what you want to do and then executing it. Don't get frustrated by initial or even late indicators of performance. Trust in the benefits of studying and concentration. After all, you can't really do too much else, we all have our own limitations and we have to come to accept them and then study a shiddd ton to make up for them.

Great response, thanks. I guess it's just difficult coming on TLS and seing so many people averaging 169+ on PTs and i'm not, but I have to realize people doing that well have well-developed study plans they have been using for months whereas I litereally started maybe a few days - week ago. Surprisingly the only section that i'm almost acing is RC which seems to be a weakness for many.

[Campagnolo]

I've got some tips for those struggling with RC that is much more specific than, "just read the Economist." PM me if you're interested.

[northwood]

been watching the forum for a bit
was planning on taking the june lsat until this monday- decided that it would be better to take an absence and take the test in october

diagnostic- took lsat in feb got a 143 ( took it cold and right after I left my job and moved back to my hometown- should have skipped the test, but didnt.

biggest problem games ( can only get 10 right)

best area- reading comp ( skim the questions, read the passage- look for words in the question in the passage and highlight them- then skim the passage as you answer the questions- average -7 over 3 areas

goal 162+ ( will take at least 1 pt a week until august- then take 2-3 week until october)

undergrad gpa 3.5 graduate 3.9

is anyone else taking a class to supplement their studies? I am leaning towards princeton review live online,( i am working 6 days a week to pay off loans and save for fall 2011)

goodluck to all

[s0ph1e2007]

Background:
Going into senior year in UG

Took the LSAT in February and scored well but lower than my average

Get out of school pretty soon; plan on using the summer to study LGs obsessively so I dont choke on them next time

Biggest Strength: LR, second RC

Biggest Weakness: LG (time choke)

Target: 180

Plan on starting mid June (was going to take the June LSAT, but i doubled up on classes this term and didnt have time to study, so OCT it is)

[mstaten]

I just registered for the October LSAT on LSAC. So, I'm all in.

Background:

- Graduated (UG) from a good state school
- Political Science major
- Registered to take the September LSAT (2009), but decided to wait a year
- URM
- Target score: 174-180

[speechie]

Background
UG Senior, majoring in Communication Sciences & Disorders

I planned to take the February LSAT but decided to put it off until October so I could study over the summer.

Biggest Strength: LR

Biggest Weakness: LG

Target: 168+

[jsander1]

Hi everyone. I am also taking the October LSAT and am currently making my way through the LG bible.

Background:

- Graduated (UG) in 2009 from a relatively unknown liberal arts school (4.0 GPA)
- International Relations / Spanish majors
- Currently on a Business Fulbright in Mexico City
- Target score: 170

I am going to follow lsatblog's 5 month plan. We will see how it goes!

[Blindsided]

I just finished undergrad, taking october test. I did the LR bible and like 10 lr sections last summer, now I am going through the lg bible, then i'm going to pound out lg sections mixed with lr sections until I am a lr/lg raping machine. I have big orange book and mastery practice so I can redo all the problems and focus on question types that are more difficult. I figured I would do rc sections after I do a bunch of lr and lg stuff.

[northwood]

since were all studying and taking the october test... who thinks it would be a good idea to make this a big study group and get ready for the test using similar materials and preps- that way we can bounce ideas off one another, and get advice/ encouragement... any takers?

if so... whats the consensus on which materials to get.. i hear a lot about the bibles so what else?

[TMT90]

since were all studying and taking the october test... who thinks it would be a good idea to make this a big study group and get ready for the test using similar materials and preps- that way we can bounce ideas off one another, and get advice/ encouragement... any takers?

if so... whats the consensus on which materials to get.. i hear a lot about the bibles so what else?

I like the idea of a study group, I think this is basically what we are doing as we speak though. If anyone wants to be "study buddies" so to speak online, feel free to PM me and we can exchange email addresses or routinely PM to keep each other in check with our studies and help each other out.

[luxxe]

since were all studying and taking the october test... who thinks it would be a good idea to make this a big study group and get ready for the test using similar materials and preps- that way we can bounce ideas off one another, and get advice/ encouragement... any takers?

if so... whats the consensus on which materials to get.. i hear a lot about the bibles so what else?

i think a lot of us are doing pithypike's/lsatblog's 4-5 month study schedules. keeping up with those ITT would be helpful!

[brickman]

I agree. I'm on the 5 month plan and integrating some pithy elements (mostly approach to material review cycling).

I also have questions that seem to have been neglected in other forums, so I might as well through them to the audience that would probably benefit from knowing them as well. Here are some statements that I've run into in the first couple of chapters and corresponding questions for the LGB:

First,
What would the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If Fleure left any message, Pasquale and Theodore did also, all of Pasquale's preceding any of Theodore's.

Next,
What would the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If both French plays are selected, then the Russian play is not selected.

Lastly,
What would the conditional as well as the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If the stand carries watermelons, then it carries figs or tangerines or both.

If you can use the PS symbols that would be helpful for me to understand.

This is probably one of the stumbling points for me, I get nervous when I don't know how to translate a statement properly (though I think I am capable of translating most of them), but it doesn't do much for my confidence to be uncertain about a particular conditional during a game.

Thanks in advance.

[Campagnolo]

I agree. I'm on the 5 month plan and integrating some pithy elements (mostly approach to material review cycling).

I also have questions that seem to have been neglected in other forums, so I might as well through them to the audience that would probably benefit from knowing them as well. Here are some statements that I've run into in the first couple of chapters and corresponding questions for the LGB:

First,
What would the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If Fleure left any message, Pasquale and Theodore did also, all of Pasquale's preceding any of Theodore's.

Next,
What would the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If both French plays are selected, then the Russian play is not selected.

Lastly,
What would the conditional as well as the contrapositive of this statement look like:

If the stand carries watermelons, then it carries figs or tangerines or both.

If you can use the PS symbols that would be helpful for me to understand.

This is probably one of the stumbling points for me, I get nervous when I don't know how to translate a statement properly (though I think I am capable of translating most of them), but it doesn't do much for my confidence to be uncertain about a particular conditional during a game.

Thanks in advance.

First: F --> P > T (T>P --> ~F)

Next: F,F <--/--> R (no CP with the double-not arrow)

Final: W --> F or T (~F and ~T --> ~W) I just did this game! Remember that if you see if W then F or T or both, then you know that the 'or both' is irrelevant. F or T means that you can have F selected, T selected, or both selected.

I hope this makes sense!

[TMT90]

Hey all, I found this thread yesterday featuring another study method that seems to have yielded good results by teaching you to keep up with a time limit and also allowing you to answer questions untimed.
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =6&t=36512

I like all of the study methods i've come across so far, so I plan on finding a way to incorporate the SOS method (above), lsatblog 4-month plan, and pithypike's method while I wait for my bibles and PTs to be delivered to my house today. I'm going to type up whatever hybrid study plan I come up with and print it out just so I have something tangible to go by.

[gca0385]

Hello everyone. I will be writing the October LSAT, which will be my second time. I wrote the June 2009 LSAT and only managed a 151. However, that was with studying for only about three weeks with horrible books and doing eight tests that weren't even official LSATs. Regardless, I hope to achieve a much higher score this time around. I have already been studying for about two weeks now and I am almost through the LGB. My first full test since my official writing last June will be tomorrow. Here is a little about me:

Background:
Finished my UG this past April with a double Honours in Contemporary Studies and History and a minor in Human Rights and Human Diversity. My UG was a long journey with extreme ups and downs as I changed majors three times. I finished with a CGPA of 2.9 and my last two years was a 3.88. I will be starting Graduate school in September for History.

Biggest Strength: Logical Reasoning (although it might be the games as of right now)

Biggest Weakness: Reading Comprehension

Target: 170, but realistically I would be ecstatic to be in the 164-169 range.

I am currently using a four-month study plan that I found online. I have all three of the PowerScore Bibles, the three Official LSAT Preptest books, the LSAT Superprep, and I plan on ordering some of the Preptests in the 50s.

I will also be using this message board for support and guidance as I have already found it to be extremely useful and motivating. Good luck to you all.