The Official September 2016 Study Group - WAKE ME UP WHEN SEPTEMBER ENDS Forum

[Alexandros]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

[34iplaw]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

haha. I dunno. I'll see. Probably depends on tuition differences. I somewhat imagine it's pretty easy to get a 3.0+++ in a MBA without much effort (higher GPAs requiring significantly more effort)...I feel like a JD and getting an EMBA later on in life (a few years in) makes more sense (or accelerated MBA if you need a break from big law life or something).

I dunno. Berkeley is just odd. I probably wouldn't mind there. I imagine they have strong real estate law professors (which is a possible area of interest) given the Haas school which is probably the best program for Real Estate outside of perhaps Wharton and, maybe, Sloan? IIRC Sloan has a really good finance driven real estate program.

Oh man. This kid straight out of the 90s (early 00s?) just walked into Starbucks. Converses, denim vest, & at least 20 livestrong type cause bracelets on their arm.

[Alexandros]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

haha. I dunno. I'll see. Probably depends on tuition differences. I somewhat imagine it's pretty easy to get a 3.0+++ in a MBA without much effort (higher GPAs requiring significantly more effort)...I feel like a JD and getting an EMBA later on in life (a few years in) makes more sense (or accelerated MBA if you need a break from big law life or something).

I dunno. Berkeley is just odd. I probably wouldn't mind there. I imagine they have strong real estate law professors (which is a possible area of interest) given the Haas school which is probably the best program for Real Estate outside of perhaps Wharton and, maybe, Sloan? IIRC Sloan has a really good finance driven real estate program.

Oh man. This kid straight out of the 90s (early 00s?) just walked into Starbucks. Converses, denim vest, & at least 20 livestrong type cause bracelets on their arm.

I was considering JD/MA for a little while, but ruled it out since I wouldn't be a very good MA applicant in my areas of interest for any of the top schools.

The main advantage of Berkeley for me is that it's on the west coast, so much closer to where I'm from - easier and less expensive travel, etc. Not a whole lot going for it aside from that, but that's interesting about the real estate factor.

Re: 90s kid - that's hilarious.

[appind]

hell that 12 LG is a killer

Got screwed by this section

Last game is one of those unusual types that can take a while to understand

[tofuspeedstar]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Nope, unfortunately my GPA is sub 3.0 cause of medical reasons my first 2 1/2 years of college. So I'm locked out of most west coast schools.

[Shemp]

welcome back

did you take the test since last year when you're prepping?

Pretty sure the last LSAT I took was the real one in February 15. I'm going to take a rediagnostic sometime tonight and see what happens.

[proteinshake]

welcome back

did you take the test since last year when you're prepping?

Pretty sure the last LSAT I took was the real one in February 15. I'm going to take a rediagnostic sometime tonight and see what happens.

why do you want to increase from a 175? just curious.

[appind]

i think there were a few in a recent study thread who also retook a very similar score aiming for 180.

it's pretty much a crapshoot at this level. LSAC kinda always throws some surprise or a couple questions that can go either way for anyone just to screw with the test takers.

[Shemp]

why do you want to increase from a 175? just curious.

Vanity.

[SunDevil14]

Came across the site lsathacks.com which offers explanations for all questions on all past tests. Has anyone used this site, and would be willing to chime in with a review? Particularly for their explanations on LR questions. While reviewing, I am able to understand why a particular answer is correct for the vast majority of the questions. Although, every so often I run into 1 or 2 question(s) on a PT that is a real head scratcher even after I check for the correct answer.

[appind]

Came across the site lsathacks.com which offers explanations for all questions on all past tests. Has anyone used this site, and would be willing to chime in with a review? Particularly for their explanations on LR questions. While reviewing, I am able to understand why a particular answer is correct for the vast majority of the questions. Although, every so often I run into 1 or 2 question(s) on a PT that is a real head scratcher even after I check for the correct answer.

i found that for the questions that really stumped me, the explanations at the site were too simplistic or in a couple instances incorrect. sometimes, they'd gloss over or handwave the issue that i was concerned with.

[SunDevil14]

Came across the site lsathacks.com which offers explanations for all questions on all past tests. Has anyone used this site, and would be willing to chime in with a review? Particularly for their explanations on LR questions. While reviewing, I am able to understand why a particular answer is correct for the vast majority of the questions. Although, every so often I run into 1 or 2 question(s) on a PT that is a real head scratcher even after I check for the correct answer.

i found that for the questions that really stumped me, the explanations at the site were too simplistic or in a couple instances incorrect. sometimes, they'd gloss over or handwave the issue that i was concerned with.

Thanks for the review. At first glance, their explanations seem err on the side of being concise rather than all encompassing.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

haha. I dunno. I'll see. Probably depends on tuition differences. I somewhat imagine it's pretty easy to get a 3.0+++ in a MBA without much effort (higher GPAs requiring significantly more effort)...I feel like a JD and getting an EMBA later on in life (a few years in) makes more sense (or accelerated MBA if you need a break from big law life or something).

I dunno. Berkeley is just odd. I probably wouldn't mind there. I imagine they have strong real estate law professors (which is a possible area of interest) given the Haas school which is probably the best program for Real Estate outside of perhaps Wharton and, maybe, Sloan? IIRC Sloan has a really good finance driven real estate program.

Oh man. This kid straight out of the 90s (early 00s?) just walked into Starbucks. Converses, denim vest, & at least 20 livestrong type cause bracelets on their arm.

I was considering JD/MA for a little while, but ruled it out since I wouldn't be a very good MA applicant in my areas of interest for any of the top schools.

The main advantage of Berkeley for me is that it's on the west coast, so much closer to where I'm from - easier and less expensive travel, etc. Not a whole lot going for it aside from that, but that's interesting about the real estate factor.

Re: 90s kid - that's hilarious.

I've considered the dual JD/MBA. Talk about a stacked background!! Im Acc undergrad and doing my 5th year (Master's of Accounting) at a top 10 b-school so since I already have that and the GMAT im highly considering the dual program. GOtta pull off the LSAT Score first thougH!

Good news- this is my last week of work and then im back 100000% full-time lsat studying which im looking forward too.

[Alexandros]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

haha. I dunno. I'll see. Probably depends on tuition differences. I somewhat imagine it's pretty easy to get a 3.0+++ in a MBA without much effort (higher GPAs requiring significantly more effort)...I feel like a JD and getting an EMBA later on in life (a few years in) makes more sense (or accelerated MBA if you need a break from big law life or something).

I dunno. Berkeley is just odd. I probably wouldn't mind there. I imagine they have strong real estate law professors (which is a possible area of interest) given the Haas school which is probably the best program for Real Estate outside of perhaps Wharton and, maybe, Sloan? IIRC Sloan has a really good finance driven real estate program.

Oh man. This kid straight out of the 90s (early 00s?) just walked into Starbucks. Converses, denim vest, & at least 20 livestrong type cause bracelets on their arm.

I was considering JD/MA for a little while, but ruled it out since I wouldn't be a very good MA applicant in my areas of interest for any of the top schools.

The main advantage of Berkeley for me is that it's on the west coast, so much closer to where I'm from - easier and less expensive travel, etc. Not a whole lot going for it aside from that, but that's interesting about the real estate factor.

Re: 90s kid - that's hilarious.

I've considered the dual JD/MBA. Talk about a stacked background!! Im Acc undergrad and doing my 5th year (Master's of Accounting) at a top 10 b-school so since I already have that and the GMAT im highly considering the dual program. GOtta pull off the LSAT Score first thougH!

Good news- this is my last week of work and then im back 100000% full-time lsat studying which im looking forward too.

DUDE.

Glad to hear you'll be done work soon, and can focus full time on LSATs! That's gonna feel great!

[Rupert Pupkin]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Berkeley Law seems to be more like applying to an MBA than Law School (tons more subjective)... nothing against MBAs (granted, I actually loathe the ideas of MBAs... as someone who is sadistic enough they may do a MBA JD if my LSAT is good enough). Either way, I think I'm going to take the GMAT or GRE if I crack 170, so I'm pretty sure that I'll end up taking it.

True, true. The acceptance rate's crazily low for a non-HYS with pretty low medians, but I was getting encouraged by how green the lawschoolnumbers' graph is for 173+, for 2015-2016 cycle. I was wondering if the low acceptance rate might be because it's less self-selective than many of the other schools, but I dunno.

MBA JD? Are you sure you'd be able to make a comfortable living with that kind of degree? Might want to throw in a MD as well.

haha. I dunno. I'll see. Probably depends on tuition differences. I somewhat imagine it's pretty easy to get a 3.0+++ in a MBA without much effort (higher GPAs requiring significantly more effort)...I feel like a JD and getting an EMBA later on in life (a few years in) makes more sense (or accelerated MBA if you need a break from big law life or something).

I dunno. Berkeley is just odd. I probably wouldn't mind there. I imagine they have strong real estate law professors (which is a possible area of interest) given the Haas school which is probably the best program for Real Estate outside of perhaps Wharton and, maybe, Sloan? IIRC Sloan has a really good finance driven real estate program.

Oh man. This kid straight out of the 90s (early 00s?) just walked into Starbucks. Converses, denim vest, & at least 20 livestrong type cause bracelets on their arm.

I was considering JD/MA for a little while, but ruled it out since I wouldn't be a very good MA applicant in my areas of interest for any of the top schools.

The main advantage of Berkeley for me is that it's on the west coast, so much closer to where I'm from - easier and less expensive travel, etc. Not a whole lot going for it aside from that, but that's interesting about the real estate factor.

Re: 90s kid - that's hilarious.

I've considered the dual JD/MBA. Talk about a stacked background!! Im Acc undergrad and doing my 5th year (Master's of Accounting) at a top 10 b-school so since I already have that and the GMAT im highly considering the dual program. GOtta pull off the LSAT Score first thougH!

Good news- this is my last week of work and then im back 100000% full-time lsat studying which im looking forward too.

DUDE.

Glad to hear you'll be done work soon, and can focus full time on LSATs! That's gonna feel great!

Yup! Very thankful to have the time to really hone in and focus on crushing it!

[34iplaw]

Any tips for games like Oct 2000 G1 and Dec 94 G3?

Yes - they are identical games. I just struggled with them. I'll have to redo them paying special attention to the out group. Any other similar games to these for practice?

[Alexandros]

Any tips for games like Oct 2000 G1 and Dec 94 G3?

Yes - they are identical games. I just struggled with them. I'll have to redo them paying special attention to the out group. Any other similar games to these for practice?

Not sure if this is helpful for you at all, but a few things that I find useful for those:
- Make note of which elements *can* fit in a spot with a lot of limitations. I tend to write them directly in the spot(s). This makes something like q 5 on 32 so much easier.
- If two elements have to go after X if it's in the first or second day, if neither of those two are in a partial list of elements on days 2 and 3/ T and W, you know that that X is either day 3 or out.
- Really keep in mind how many elements can be out at once. If a local question forces two elements to be out, you know that all of the other elements have to be in; or, if it forces one element to be out, you know that only one additional element can be out.

There are other games quite similar - 22.4, and that one about people on stages??? Not sure of the number right now just a sec.
(eta: I could have sworn there was a game about people on stages, and this wasn't just an LGB drill. I.. might be wrong. But there are definitely more games that follow that pattern. Let you know if I think of any.)

[FayRays]

Damn. So thrilled with today.

LR: -2
LG: -1
LR: -0
RC: -4

Total: 175

Wish I could just stop studying now.

Awesome keep it up

[Alexandros]

Wondering if I should start BR-ing PTs or something....

[proteinshake]

Aside from one old LR section, done nothing for the LSAT today. I'm gonna look again at the questions I got wrong and might print out some more sets.

Moving forward with LR, I'm thinking - continue with the drilling, making a word doc with just the hardest questions, alternatively/additionally, word doc with just the questions I got wrong, and be able to completely understand why the right answer's right and my answer's wrong.

To change topics completely - Anyone looking at Berkeley?

Nope, unfortunately my GPA is sub 3.0 cause of medical reasons my first 2 1/2 years of college. So I'm locked out of most west coast schools.

if there's one school that'll look past your numbers, its Berkeley.

[ngogirl12]

Going back and rewatching the NA lessons in 7sage I feel so dumb. JY explains them in perfect terms I can relate to (basketball) I nearly fell out of my chair laughing because they're so simple to find....tomorrow needs to come sooner so I can wreck PT60.

NA's one of the types that get really easy/predictable once you get the hang of them. Definitely my favorite LR type. Good luck on the PT tomorrow!

Whaaat!? I legit hate NA questions, I sometimes mess up with my diagramming.I actually hate the diagramming the opposite rule. I'm hoping that it will change when I get to the NA lesson. What's your trick to "getting the hang of it"?

You diagram NA questions? I'm not too sure whether that's really necessary tbh. I can see diagramming for SA and MBT questions, but not for NA. Maybe that's why you hate NA questions?

Well, not right now, but before I started going through the 7Sage curriculum slowly when I was taking PT's (and rushing through the first half of the curriculum) I would diagram the answer choices. Don't most of the books (I think Manhattan does) tell you to diagram the logical opposite of the conclusion and whatever breaks the conclusions strength is the correct answer? I was trying to do that, but I suck at that so I would try the same approach as SA questions and it was not the best approach. I haven't gotten to the NA questions yet in the curriculum, so I'm hoping whatever JY's approach is will be sufficient lol.

How do you approach these questions? I've always had issues with this type ugh.

Just stating the answer choice in it's negative and thinking about how it impacts the argument should be enough for most NA questions, IMO. I think it would actually be a challenge to diagram a lot of NA questions. Many of them just don't lend themselves to being diagrammed.

Yeah, that's what made me nervous in the past, not making the correct logical opposite diagram. Hopefully that will change this time around though!

[ngogirl12]

How do you approach these questions? I've always had issues with this type ugh.

I just approach them with knowing why the premises "support" the conclusion. The right answer choice, when negated, will destroy the arguments support, therefore leaving no argument to be made. The right answer is (shocker lol) something that the argument depends on, and without it, it won't make sense.

Frank likes cats. Therefore, Frank hates dogs.

The argument is relying on the fact that everyone who likes cats must hates dogs.

Answer choice example: anyone who likes cats also hate dogs
When negated, it can read as something like: not all people who like cats also hate dogs. If this were true, then the fact that frank likes cats doesn't justify him hating dogs.

I suck at explaining negations, but i do it in a way that makes sense to me sooo ye

Yeah. Hoping the NA lesson will have drills and quizzes like the SA lesson and the Valid/Invalid arguments lesson. Doing those over and over again helped me out A LOT!!

Question: Did you memorize all the vocabulary flashcards from the SA lesson?

[ngogirl12]

Going back and rewatching the NA lessons in 7sage I feel so dumb. JY explains them in perfect terms I can relate to (basketball) I nearly fell out of my chair laughing because they're so simple to find....tomorrow needs to come sooner so I can wreck PT60.

NA's one of the types that get really easy/predictable once you get the hang of them. Definitely my favorite LR type. Good luck on the PT tomorrow!

Whaaat!? I legit hate NA questions, I sometimes mess up with my diagramming.I actually hate the diagramming the opposite rule. I'm hoping that it will change when I get to the NA lesson. What's your trick to "getting the hang of it"?

You diagram NA questions? I'm not too sure whether that's really necessary tbh. I can see diagramming for SA and MBT questions, but not for NA. Maybe that's why you hate NA questions?

Well, not right now, but before I started going through the 7Sage curriculum slowly when I was taking PT's (and rushing through the first half of the curriculum) I would diagram the answer choices. Don't most of the books (I think Manhattan does) tell you to diagram the logical opposite of the conclusion and whatever breaks the conclusions strength is the correct answer? I was trying to do that, but I suck at that so I would try the same approach as SA questions and it was not the best approach. I haven't gotten to the NA questions yet in the curriculum, so I'm hoping whatever JY's approach is will be sufficient lol.

How do you approach these questions? I've always had issues with this type ugh.

The only questions I diagram relatively often are parallel flaw/reasoning.

I bracket the conclusion, underline the support, and pay extra attention to anything that alters - terms, percentage/numbers, relationships - conclusion and support. Basically there's going to be a gap in there somewhere, sometimes a few, and one of the answers will address that gap / one of the gaps (as opposed to all of the gaps, which would be SA). I find them easier than ID the flaw because there's usually less room for ambiguity. Once you drill more of that type, I think you get more used identifying the gap(s) and anticipating what the answer. If you're really not sure or caught between two, the negation test that you describe is a good approach, but I find it too time consuming and effortful to be worth applying to every question.

Yeah, I plan on doing all 226 questions from the Necessary Assumption cambridge packet when I get to that lesson. I'm REALLY hoping I will kick ass at this question type, but it's always been my downfall lol. I hate the negation test.

[ngogirl12]

Going back and rewatching the NA lessons in 7sage I feel so dumb. JY explains them in perfect terms I can relate to (basketball) I nearly fell out of my chair laughing because they're so simple to find....tomorrow needs to come sooner so I can wreck PT60.

NA's one of the types that get really easy/predictable once you get the hang of them. Definitely my favorite LR type. Good luck on the PT tomorrow!

Whaaat!? I legit hate NA questions, I sometimes mess up with my diagramming.I actually hate the diagramming the opposite rule. I'm hoping that it will change when I get to the NA lesson. What's your trick to "getting the hang of it"?

The way JY explained it stuck out to me because I've been an athlete all my life (specifically basketball, which he explains it in) so for NA questions I'm looking for a "Luc Longley" type answer. Michael Jordan (the argument) needs Luc for the argument to be valid. Without Luc, Michael is just shit out of luck.

For sufficient assumptions I look for a "Michael Jordan" answer, because Michael can get the job done himself w/o help because he is the GOAT.

Oh I love this analogy, hopefully it'll come in handy! Does it work for you?

[ngogirl12]

Came across the site lsathacks.com which offers explanations for all questions on all past tests. Has anyone used this site, and would be willing to chime in with a review? Particularly for their explanations on LR questions. While reviewing, I am able to understand why a particular answer is correct for the vast majority of the questions. Although, every so often I run into 1 or 2 question(s) on a PT that is a real head scratcher even after I check for the correct answer.

i found that for the questions that really stumped me, the explanations at the site were too simplistic or in a couple instances incorrect. sometimes, they'd gloss over or handwave the issue that i was concerned with.

I completely agree with appind. I do not like LSAT hacks because their explanations are too simplistic and not helpful at all. Sometimes I feel JY glosses over some of the LR questions too, in those cases I always go to the Manhattan forums. Some of the posters are there are very helpful. That's only when I'm completely stumped, I feel the most progress is made when you try to reason the explanations yourself.