The Official September 2014 Study Group Forum

cavalier2015 · Post by **cavalier2015** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:44 pm

did first PT. Started with PT 45.

LR: -8
RC: -8 (thank you Hippocratic oath..)
LG: -0
Raw: 83
Converted: 167

I missed only MBT,Most Strongly Supported, and Paradox LR questions. Any tips on those?

As for RC, fuck. back to doing passages tomorrow.

sashafierce · Post by **sashafierce** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:18 pm

Just finished PT55 scored 162

RC -7
LR1 -2
LR2 -7
LG -3
EXP RC -5

My LR score is still terrible so I knw I have alot more drilling to do, my RC score also needs alot of work, I've been stuck in the low 160s for a minute now which is so frustrating

ilikebaseball · Post by **ilikebaseball** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:22 pm

sashafierce wrote:Just finished PT55 scored 162

RC -7
LR1 -2
LR2 -7
LG -3
EXP RC -5

My LR score is still terrible so I knw I have alot more drilling to do, my RC score also needs alot of work, I've been stuck in the low 160s for a minute now which is so frustrating

Decent job on the dinosaur game!

sashafierce · Post by **sashafierce** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:48 pm

choward014 wrote:Decent job on the dinosaur game!

Wrong PT

danmcc413 · Post by **danmcc413** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:21 pm

Just finished up 41, 169 - Okay with my results considering the difficulty of the circle game caused me to miss more in LG than normal. I really really have to focus more on LR though, it's my glaring weakness. Anyway, my breakdown was:

LR1:-5
LG: -3
LR2:-3
RC: -2

Like I said, I'm pretty happy with this because I know that I most likely am not going to get a game that will throw me for a loop like that one. So, as always, gotta work on the LR. Taking 42 on Saturday morning...

ilikebaseball · Post by **ilikebaseball** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:23 pm

danmcc413 wrote:Just finished up 41, 169 - Okay with my results considering the difficulty of the circle game caused me to miss more in LG than normal. I really really have to focus more on LR though, it's my glaring weakness. Anyway, my breakdown was:

LR1:-5
LG: -3
LR2:-3
RC: -2

Like I said, I'm pretty happy with this because I know that I most likely am not going to get a game that will throw me for a loop like that one. So, as always, gotta work on the LR. Taking 42 on Saturday morning...

recent history leads us to believe that the likelihood of an irregular game is actually pretty high. I'd prepare for anything and everything because, like you, LG is my strong section as well and I need to keep it at -1 or 0

chimera · Post by **chimera** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:43 pm

I think getting two difficult, irregular games in a row is unlikely. We could get something similar to December's section with two substitution questions. LSAT uses both methods, and others, to get the same results; the irregular games just -points from you more directly... That said I am still reviewing all the miscellaneous and weird games I have

Louis1127 · Post by **Louis1127** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:02 pm

cavalier2015 wrote:did first PT. Started with PT 45.

LR: -8
RC: -8 (thank you Hippocratic oath..)
LG: -0
Raw: 83
Converted: 167

I missed only MBT,Most Strongly Supported, and Paradox LR questions. Any tips on those?

As for RC, fuck. back to doing passages tomorrow.

Nice Cav!

I also took 45 today, got a 162. For whatever reason, LR is giving me fits (I missed 16 combined today). I need to review LR really badly.

Just an interesting thought: I got 77 raw and got a 162, and you got 7 more questions right than me but got a 167. But the difference between a 162 and 167 is HUGE in terms of law school admissions and scholarships. Just interesting.

Anyway, time to review LR. I thought me and LR were friends

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:43 am

Post removed.

Louis1127 · Post by **Louis1127** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:57 am

Thinking about making a quick thread on this, but I'll get y'alls thoughts first.

On LR questions that have arguments (strengthen, weaken, flaw, principle justify, necessary assumption, sufficient assumption, other types that I can't think of right now), after reading the stimulus, pause and think to yourself: "Okay, what is the argument saying"? And then put the argument in your own words? Or do you do something else other than put the argument in your own words?

flash21 · Post by **flash21** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:09 am

Louis1127 wrote:Thinking about making a quick thread on this, but I'll get y'alls thoughts first.

On LR questions that have arguments (strengthen, weaken, flaw, principle justify, necessary assumption, sufficient assumption, other types that I can't think of right now), after reading the stimulus, pause and think to yourself: "Okay, what is the argument saying"? And then put the argument in your own words? Or do you do something else other than put the argument in your own words?

Hi Louis.

I'll read it really deliberately and make sure I have a full understand of what it's saying, what what the support is for the conclusion. I think of it as spending time up front on the stimulus so I can get through the ACs faster - much like we do with logic games or reading comprehension.

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:39 am

Taking about a week and a half break from PT's, going to read Manhattans LG book, and re-read the LR book. Hopefully that'll boost my LG score.

boris09 · Post by **boris09** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:49 pm

Been a while since I've posted, but hoping to be more active this time around now that I'm ready to actually tackle this test once and for all. Currently beginning the drilling phase of the test. Feeling a little worried that I may not have enough time to do as many preptests as I want, but hopefully things will work themselves out. Feeling really glad that there's a strong community like this that supports each other wholeheartedly and without judgment!

I do have one quick question though: perhaps I'm blind (which is a possibility, my vision isn't the greatest), but people mention that they are doing level 1, 2, 3, 4 questions from the cambridge packets, but where does it mention the 'level' of the question that you're on?

Also, is there some sort of a strategy that anyone would like to recommend when approaching the packets? I figured that I would just print off 50 or so questions from maybe two or three types of LR, and slip in a couple of games of one type a day, and then maybe keep switching things up daily?

Any critiques or recommendations would be really helpful!

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:57 pm

Post removed.

boris09 · Post by **boris09** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:04 pm

mornincounselor wrote:
boris09 wrote:Been a while since I've posted, but hoping to be more active this time around now that I'm ready to actually tackle this test once and for all. Currently beginning the drilling phase of the test. Feeling a little worried that I may not have enough time to do as many preptests as I want, but hopefully things will work themselves out. Feeling really glad that there's a strong community like this that supports each other wholeheartedly and without judgment!

I do have one quick question though: perhaps I'm blind (which is a possibility, my vision isn't the greatest), but people mention that they are doing level 1, 2, 3, 4 questions from the cambridge packets, but where does it mention the 'level' of the question that you're on?

Also, is there some sort of a strategy that anyone would like to recommend when approaching the packets? I figured that I would just print off 50 or so questions from maybe two or three types of LR, and slip in a couple of games of one type a day, and then maybe keep switching things up daily?

Any critiques or recommendations would be really helpful!
The answer key at the end of each packet shows where the divisions between the levels of questions are. Each packet has a certain number of level 1 questions, followed by a certain number of level 2 questions, etc.

I went straight through a packet before starting another one. I regularly checked my answers to make sure I was progressing well, I noted and made flash cards out of all the questions I found difficult (and especially those that I thought were easy but which I ended up getting wrong) I looked up incorrect questions on the Manhattan forums, and if I felt I was missing something with questions or I ended up missing a number of questions I would return to the prep books or pose a question in this thread or in one of the ask an expert threads on this website.

Wow this is extremely helpful, and exactly what i was looking for. Did you ever find yourself having a drop off in accuracy after doing a question type that you hadn't seen in a while? There's a lot of question types and questions to go through, so if you finish one packet and then move on I figure that you may not have seen that question type again for a while until you started preptesting. By the way, i've been keeping up with this thread and I just wanted to say I'm really happy with all the progress you've made, you've gone a long way and you're definitely an individual i'm trying to emulate throughout this process

vracovino · Post by **vracovino** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:05 pm

mornincounselor wrote:
boris09 wrote:Been a while since I've posted, but hoping to be more active this time around now that I'm ready to actually tackle this test once and for all. Currently beginning the drilling phase of the test. Feeling a little worried that I may not have enough time to do as many preptests as I want, but hopefully things will work themselves out. Feeling really glad that there's a strong community like this that supports each other wholeheartedly and without judgment!

I do have one quick question though: perhaps I'm blind (which is a possibility, my vision isn't the greatest), but people mention that they are doing level 1, 2, 3, 4 questions from the cambridge packets, but where does it mention the 'level' of the question that you're on?

Also, is there some sort of a strategy that anyone would like to recommend when approaching the packets? I figured that I would just print off 50 or so questions from maybe two or three types of LR, and slip in a couple of games of one type a day, and then maybe keep switching things up daily?

Any critiques or recommendations would be really helpful!
The answer key at the end of each packet shows where the divisions between the levels of questions are. Each packet has a certain number of level 1 questions, followed by a certain number of level 2 questions, etc.

I went straight through a packet before starting another one. I regularly checked my answers to make sure I was progressing well, I noted and made flash cards out of all the questions I found difficult (and especially those that I thought were easy but which I ended up getting wrong) I looked up incorrect questions on the Manhattan forums, and if I felt I was missing something with questions or I ended up missing a number of questions I would return to the prep books or pose a question in this thread or in one of the ask an expert threads on this website.

Adversely I spent a great deal of time organizing each question type packet into 22-25 question sections so I could (somewhat) be accustomed to going through 25 question sections. So for example: eight Level 1 questions, eight leveI 2, four level 3, and four level 4. Of course it doesn't always turn out to that exact disparity. I can't say or not if it makes a difference or helped me yet, but I don't regret doing it that way.

Edit: also, because your relatively short on time it may be easier to just go straight through the packets

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:19 pm

Post removed.

ilikebaseball · Post by **ilikebaseball** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:39 pm

mornincounselor wrote:Thank you for the kind remarks, boris09.

One advantage to doing the packets in sections of 25 with difficulties roughly proportional to what one will see on test day is the ability to track your timing. Doing the packets straight through limits a person's ability to keep track of their timing. There's debate over whether its best to keep track of timing when drilling or not. Personally, I did not, mostly because I don't have timing issues on LR sections. I did keep time for LG (the second and third time through them) and RC (where I just went prep test by prep test instead of splitting into types as in Cambridge)

By going back over the flash cards I've made up for the difficult questions (I'm about 5/8ths done with the packets and have ~200 cards) I regularly see at least some of each question type. By writing out how you correctly solved the problem on the back of the cards it allows you to get back into the motions of particular question type.

Could you PM me with a little more on these flashcards? I've been looking for something like this for awhile

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:26 pm

Just did the super crazy ordering set from Manhattan's LG book.

Game 1: 6/7 - literally didn't read a problem correctly, got it perfectly in like 15 seconds once i re-did it.
Game 2: 3/7 - Circle games always leave me clueless, got the first 3 correct, and then just started blanking. (I usually circle C for the ones I don't know (if I cant make an educated guess), and that would have brought me to 4/7 on a real test.)
Game 3: 3/5 - Last question was a time sink for me, just couldn't figure it out, so I skipped it and I rushed through another question, crossing out the SUPER OBVIOUSLY correct answer. Should have went 4/5.
Game 4: 6/6 - Very happy with this, took me under 8 minutes.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with this. 18/25 is about my average on a section, BUT this was a very tough section, I didn't go over the 35 minute mark and only 1 game actually screwed me. If I can just stop making careless mistakes - and panicking during circle games - I'd be adding about 2-4 points for LG.

kbrizz · Post by **kbrizz** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:06 pm

Wisdom teeth have had me on my back for 2 solid days now. Was not expecting that. Hoping to get back on the train later today.

Great to see all the PTing going on. Wish I was at that point.

Colonel_funkadunk · Post by **Colonel_funkadunk** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:22 pm

Checking into this thread. I had a 163 on the December 2011 test. Took a couple years off and worked.

Took my first PT today since I started studying again. PT 40

I scored a 166.
LR1: -4
LG: -2
LR2: -4
RC: -5

4 of the 8 LR I missed were sufficient assumption questions so I need to figure out what my issue is there. Hope everyone's studying is going well.

BillPackets · Post by **BillPackets** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:31 pm

So I've been PT'ing since June, started studying in march. I've taken PTs 40-54.

I was getting my scores up in the high 160s pretty consistently, then today I took PT 54 and totally f*cking bombed it. This is after I finally hit 170 on PT 53.

On 53 I went -0 lg, combined -6 on LR, and -5 on RC.

On 54 I went -12 combined LR, -5 RC and -3 lg.

I'm disgusted with myself and feel like a huge fucking failure. I had been going consistently -3 on RC and now I've jumped to -5 on the last two tests. I have no fucking clue what's going on.

This is extremely disheartening. I now feel like I've made no progress despite putting so much work in.

Has this happened to anyone else? And advice? Words of encouragement??

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:41 pm

BillPackets wrote:So I've been PT'ing since June, started studying in march. I've taken PTs 40-54.

I was getting my scores up in the high 160s pretty consistently, then today I took PT 54 and totally f*cking bombed it. This is after I finally hit 170 on PT 53.

On 53 I went -0 lg, combined -6 on LR, and -5 on RC.

On 54 I went -12 combined LR, -5 RC and -3 lg.

I'm disgusted with myself and feel like a huge fucking failure. I had been going consistently -3 on RC and now I've jumped to -5 on the last two tests. I have no fucking clue what's going on.

This is extremely disheartening. I now feel like I've made no progress despite putting so much work in.

Has this happened to anyone else? And advice? Words of encouragement??

It's just an aberration man, don't beat yourself up about it. It seems that you're prob overdoing the LSAT. Take a couple days, relax, go to the beach, hang with friends, drink a ton of beer. Whatever it is you do relax, do that for a couple days, and start studying again with a fresh outlook.

BillPackets · Post by **BillPackets** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:47 pm

gnomgnomuch wrote:
BillPackets wrote:So I've been PT'ing since June, started studying in march. I've taken PTs 40-54.

I was getting my scores up in the high 160s pretty consistently, then today I took PT 54 and totally f*cking bombed it. This is after I finally hit 170 on PT 53.

On 53 I went -0 lg, combined -6 on LR, and -5 on RC.

On 54 I went -12 combined LR, -5 RC and -3 lg.

I'm disgusted with myself and feel like a huge fucking failure. I had been going consistently -3 on RC and now I've jumped to -5 on the last two tests. I have no fucking clue what's going on.

This is extremely disheartening. I now feel like I've made no progress despite putting so much work in.

Has this happened to anyone else? And advice? Words of encouragement??

It's just an aberration man, don't beat yourself up about it. It seems that you're prob overdoing the LSAT. Take a couple days, relax, go to the beach, hang with friends, drink a ton of beer. Whatever it is you do relax, do that for a couple days, and start studying again with a fresh outlook.

Taking days off makes me nervous. I usually feel like I forget shit if I take a couple of days off, but maybe I'll try bc that was just fucking ridiculous.

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:56 pm

BillPackets wrote:
gnomgnomuch wrote:
BillPackets wrote:So I've been PT'ing since June, started studying in march. I've taken PTs 40-54.

I was getting my scores up in the high 160s pretty consistently, then today I took PT 54 and totally f*cking bombed it. This is after I finally hit 170 on PT 53.

On 53 I went -0 lg, combined -6 on LR, and -5 on RC.

On 54 I went -12 combined LR, -5 RC and -3 lg.

I'm disgusted with myself and feel like a huge fucking failure. I had been going consistently -3 on RC and now I've jumped to -5 on the last two tests. I have no fucking clue what's going on.

This is extremely disheartening. I now feel like I've made no progress despite putting so much work in.

Has this happened to anyone else? And advice? Words of encouragement??

It's just an aberration man, don't beat yourself up about it. It seems that you're prob overdoing the LSAT. Take a couple days, relax, go to the beach, hang with friends, drink a ton of beer. Whatever it is you do relax, do that for a couple days, and start studying again with a fresh outlook.
Taking days off makes me nervous. I usually feel like I forget shit if I take a couple of days off, but maybe I'll try bc that was just fucking ridiculous.

Honestly, you're not gonna forget much - if anything - by taking one or two days off. On the contrary if you write down everything that troubles you and just go over the concepts, without doing any questions, that might actually solidify the process in your head.

Also, this is NOT a race, there is absolutely no penalty for not taking the test in Sept. or even sitting out a cycle. My target is a 172+ If i'm not ready for September (by which I mean, I'm PT'ing consistently over 175) there's just no way I'm taking it then.

Set a goal for yourself, but don't hesitate to change your time frame. It will pay off in the long run with scholarship$ and better school prospects.