Homework in Law School...How Does It Work? Forum

[01020304050607]

Being as I have never been a law student before, I am stuck in the mindset that going back to law school means homework that is comparable to undergraduate work. For example, small reading assignments with quizzes, 4 or 5 papers spread through the course of semester, and 2 or 3 big tests.

What is homework like in law school? I am more concerned with what it is like from a part-time perspective. Is it just ungraded reading assignments and 1 exam at end?

[swampman]

Is it just ungraded reading assignments and 1 exam at end?

For virtually all first year classes, yes. Upper-level seminars often have a paper instead of an exam. A few classes have weekly response papers, or something similar, but the vast majority of classes are just one exam or paper at the end. You won't be graded on reading, but some professors will cold-call and expect you to have read it.

[kalvano]

homework that is comparable to undergraduate work. For example, small reading assignments with quizzes, 4 or 5 papers spread through the course of semester, and 2 or 3 big tests.

It will be a lot more reading than undergrad. Quite a lot.

[dwyf]

I had a 1L professor suggest that one should do two hours of preparation for each hour of class. So if you have 14 credit hours for the semester, you're doing about 42 hours of work. 4 hours of prep for a 2 hour class is probably a combination of reading, briefing cases or taking reading notes, meeting in a study group, outlining, etc.

I think this is roughly accurate for 1L, when you're really trying to come prepared to class, etc., you work less efficiently, and there is a lot of emphasis on grades. I think the amount of prep falls off over the course of school, but other things pop up (clinics, journal work, clubs, research assistant work, externships, etc.)

I should also note, though, that the prep work is largely at your discretion. At least at my place, there was only ever one grade per class: the exam, and it's graded anonymously.

[jselson]

It's just a buncha reading and then an exam at the end. Maybe 1 or 2 rando assignments thrown in the middle.

Just keep up with the reading, steal some outlines, cram two weeks out, and you'll be fine.

That is, unless you're going to a bad school.

Then retake.

[UnicornHunter]

homework that is comparable to undergraduate work. For example, small reading assignments with quizzes, 4 or 5 papers spread through the course of semester, and 2 or 3 big tests.

It will be a lot more reading than undergrad. Quite a lot.

Nah

[lavarman84]

homework that is comparable to undergraduate work. For example, small reading assignments with quizzes, 4 or 5 papers spread through the course of semester, and 2 or 3 big tests.

It will be a lot more reading than undergrad. Quite a lot.

Nah

Yea.

[A. Nony Mouse]

homework that is comparable to undergraduate work. For example, small reading assignments with quizzes, 4 or 5 papers spread through the course of semester, and 2 or 3 big tests.

It will be a lot more reading than undergrad. Quite a lot.

Nah

Yea.

Depends where you did your undergrad, what you majored in, and maybe how seriously you take your law school reading, but for me, no, law school was not a lot more reading than undergrad.

[UnicornHunter]

I don't think I ever had more than 250 pages of reading/week for law school. Would regularly get 1,000+/ week in undergrad. And the idea that you have to read cases more closely than upper level reading in the social sciences is a joke. Like yeah, maybe I wasn't a cold-call all star, but I did just fine 1L skimming cases and just googling case notes so I'd have something to jog my memory if I got cold called.

Effort has almost no correlation to success in law school. The die are cast before you get there, you either have the skill set for it or you don't on day 1.

[03152016]

ya depends on ug

i was a music major
i just checked my ug transcript, i had 6 courses total that had reading assignments of any sort
was v rare for me to have more than 10 pgs of reading assignments per wk, and most wks i didn't have anything to read

in ls it feels like all i do is read

[Ron Howard]

For your first year, most of the work (expect for legal writing and research) will be to read, unless you're going to Penn and get this guy: http://abovethelaw.com/2013/09/new-law- ... to-adults/.

But if you were a social science (minus economics and psychology) or humanities major, it might actually be less reading. The big difference is (1) the readings are a lot denser (except maybe if you were reading philosophy; see Kant) and (2) you actually have to do said dense readings (unless you want to gamble on horn books and other people's outlines, which is not the credited response).

[lavarman84]

I don't think I ever had more than 250 pages of reading/week for law school. Would regularly get 1,000+/ week in undergrad. And the idea that you have to read cases more closely than upper level reading in the social sciences is a joke. Like yeah, maybe I wasn't a cold-call all star, but I did just fine 1L skimming cases and just googling case notes so I'd have something to jog my memory if I got cold called.

Effort has almost no correlation to success in law school. The die are cast before you get there, you either have the skill set for it or you don't on day 1.

I had 250+ pages of reading per week routinely 1L year. And I did it all. Almost never read in undergrad unless I was cramming for a test. And even then, it wasn't as much as what I had to read in law school.

[Ron Howard]

I don't think I ever had more than 250 pages of reading/week for law school. Would regularly get 1,000+/ week in undergrad. And the idea that you have to read cases more closely than upper level reading in the social sciences is a joke. Like yeah, maybe I wasn't a cold-call all star, but I did just fine 1L skimming cases and just googling case notes so I'd have something to jog my memory if I got cold called.

Effort has almost no correlation to success in law school. The die are cast before you get there, you either have the skill set for it or you don't on day 1.

I had 250+ pages of reading per week routinely 1L year. And I did it all. Almost never read in undergrad unless I was cramming for a test. And even then, it wasn't as much as what I had to read in law school.

Amen

[A. Nony Mouse]

So basically you all went to easy schools? My freshman year history class, the syllabus was 10 monographs, and we read all of all of them. I was a history major; I read way more in undergrad than I ever got assigned in law school.

[Ron Howard]

So basically you all went to easy schools? My freshman year history class, the syllabus was 10 monographs, and we read all of all of them. I was a history major; I read way more in undergrad than I ever got assigned in law school.

Perhaps that, but I wan't a social science or humanities major either. You just don't get a lot of reading in most math/stat courses (though there is always the occasional crazy professor). Most reading was through (easy) electives.

[rnoodles]

For your first year, most of the work (expect for legal writing and research) will be to read, unless you're going to Penn and get this guy: http://abovethelaw.com/2013/09/new-law- ... to-adults/.

But if you were a social science (minus economics and psychology) or humanities major, it might actually be less reading. The big difference is (1) the readings are a lot denser (except maybe if you were reading philosophy; see Kant) and (2) you actually have to do said dense readings (unless you want to gamble on horn books and other people's outlines, which is not the credited response).

What the hell did I just read? God speed to Penn kids that had/have to deal with that 'system.'

[ManoftheHour]

(unless you want to gamble on horn books and other people's outlines, which is not the credited response).

Depends. That could be TCR. Some people can just pay attention in class and read other people's outlines and book classes. Also depends on the class/prof, but that's for you to figure out.

I stopped reading for Crim halfway through the semester and got 1 of 5 As in a class of 90. Couldn't do that for Con law.

[joejoe]

You'll get the hang of it. People tend to panic a bit sometimes, but most tend to be ok as well.
Just expect Socratic lessons with no grade at all, and then a final that is worth 100% of your grade (but that too only seems huge until you realize that just memorizes canned outlines from the school bookstore is a lock for an A- on the curve)

Worst thing you can do? Make and study your own notes from class like the Prof tells you to. Classic 1L mistake.

[03152016]

You'll get the hang of it. People tend to panic a bit sometimes, but most tend to be ok as well.
Just expect Socratic lessons with no grade at all, and then a final that is worth 100% of your grade (but that too only seems huge until you realize that just memorizes canned outlines from the school bookstore is a lock for an A- on the curve)

Worst thing you can do? Make and study your own notes from class like the Prof tells you to. Classic 1L mistake.

everyone is different
my experience has been the exact opposite

[03152016]

also, to a point made earlier itt, i don't buy that there's no correlation between effort and grades



from a survey of 123 1Ls last year

[joejoe]

Not saying not to try your best, just saying not to over sweat it. If you want to coast by, its pretty easy (and at a decent GPA too)
and if you want to do good, great. But I still stand by using those canned outlines in that effort. Those things are made to make money.


If you want really good grade, I'll toss in what any 2L knows, but not all 1L's might know yet. The multiple choice part tends to be canned from past exams and more what the book actually says. Its either 100% right or 100% wrong (if its not A then anything else is wrong, no partial credit given)
But the essays tend to be written by the prof and graded based on what they THINK the law is. You will soon learn that different Profs (as with humans anywhere else in life) have their own opinions and interpretations of stuff. Even if what they think is right is WRONG according to everyone else on the planet, including the text book itself, they will grade based on THEIR opinions. My point being memorize two different set of rules. The one for the multiple choice (where real world rules apply) and one for the essays (where your profs opinions apply) Odds are there will be like 99% overlap between the two, but be prepared for that 1%. It can help or hurt the grade.

[A. Nony Mouse]

also, to a point made earlier itt, i don't buy that there's no correlation between effort and grades



from a survey of 123 1Ls last year

But brut, doesn't that show that slightly more people who ended up in the top 10 actually worked 0-19 hours than over 20? I actually agree that there's some correlation between effort/grades, but I definitely think you hit diminishing returns.

Perhaps that, but I wan't a social science or humanities major either. You just don't get a lot of reading in most math/stat courses (though there is always the occasional crazy professor). Most reading was through (easy) electives.

Oh, well, math; I take it back.

[ManoftheHour]

everyone is different

This is probably the TCR. There are a lot of factors at play. Personally for me, my grades correlated with how many PTs I did. I did the worst in classes where there were no or just 1-2 PTs. I did really well in classes where there were 5+ PTs.

[lavarman84]

So basically you all went to easy schools? My freshman year history class, the syllabus was 10 monographs, and we read all of all of them. I was a history major; I read way more in undergrad than I ever got assigned in law school.

Easy school? Sure. I was a Sports Management major so they had to keep the reading to a minimum because we're not really literate. Plus, the major had a lot more accounting and finance than one would expect. Not much reading in those courses.

You'll get the hang of it. People tend to panic a bit sometimes, but most tend to be ok as well.
Just expect Socratic lessons with no grade at all, and then a final that is worth 100% of your grade (but that too only seems huge until you realize that just memorizes canned outlines from the school bookstore is a lock for an A- on the curve)

Worst thing you can do? Make and study your own notes from class like the Prof tells you to. Classic 1L mistake.

That's exactly the opposite of my experience.

Your notes are catered towards the professor's opinion...which is what they want to read on the final exam.

[joejoe]

I mention the law profs opinions in my other post, and which parts to ignore that on as well.

But I'd lean MOST on the canned ones. Just my honest opinion to avoid scabs on the GPA even in doubt. (if you are a 4.0 law student you know who you are and disregard this)