Organizing Employment Data (WIP) Forum

[Crowing]

Alright I'm gonna try to go through all these employment forms and organize them for tl;drers so we can eyeball some stuff.

Yale: http://www.law.yale.edu/studentlife/cdo ... tstats.htm
Stanford: http://www.law.stanford.edu/careers/pro ... /aba-forms
Harvard: http://law.harvard.edu/current/careers/ ... index.html
Columbia: http://www.law.columbia.edu/careers/emp ... statistics
Chicago: http://www.law.uchicago.edu/prospective/employmentdata
NYU: http://www.law.nyu.edu/careerservices/e ... /index.htm
Berkeley: --LinkRemoved--
Penn: https://www.law.upenn.edu/careers/emplo ... istics.php
Virginia: http://www.law.virginia.edu/html/career/stats.htm
Michigan: http://www.law.umich.edu/careers/classs ... stats.aspx
Duke: http://law.duke.edu/career/employmentdata/
Northwestern: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/career/statistics/
Georgetown: can only find c/o 2011 http://law.georgetown.edu/careers/ocs/u ... y-2013.pdf
Cornell: http://www.lawschool.cornell.edu/career ... istics.cfm

[rad lulz]

Worthless without federal and/or AIII clerkships

[Crowing]

Worthless without federal and/or AIII clerkships

Can't find that for c/o 2010 and 2011 atm. I'll look more in a min.

ETA: Unless you got links to it

[09042014]

CCNorthwestern.

[rad lulz]

Worthless without federal and/or AIII clerkships

Can't find that for c/o 2010 and 2011 atm. I'll look more in a min.

ETA: Unless you got links to it

Not on me dude

[Crowing]

I'm pretty confused atm. Rayiner made this chart: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B11ijye ... 2JPQQ/edit

It doesn't distinguish between AIII and non-AIII federal clerkships.

Now this thread has some AIII percentages: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=150004

But some of these numbers seem impossible. For example UVA c/o 2008 and 2009 if we reference those two sources... put MORE graduates into AIII federal clerkships (according to Lawlcat's post) than into AIII and non-AIII federal clerkships combined (according to Rayiner's chart). Obviously that's impossible.

Idk what I'm missing here.

[banjo]

I also think these NLJ numbers systematically understate CLS/NYU placement due to underreporting among NYC firms and because 101+ firms casts a wider net than NLJ250 (I think). You can see the disparity if you look at http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=181415

[09042014]

I also think these NLJ numbers systematically understate CLS/NYU placement due to underreporting among NYC firms and because 101+ firms casts a wider net than NLJ250 (I think). You can see the disparity if you look at http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=181415

Why would NYC be underreported? NLJ 250 over represents NYC.

[banjo]

I also think these NLJ numbers systematically understate CLS/NYU placement due to underreporting among NYC firms and because 101+ firms casts a wider net than NLJ250 (I think). You can see the disparity if you look at http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=181415

Why would NYC be underreported? NLJ 250 over represents NYC.

I was referencing this whole scandal: http://www.law.nyu.edu/news/REBUTTAL

[banjo]

I was reading over http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 9&start=25 again this morning. Out of curiosity, I looked at the NLJ vs. self-reported discrepancies for c/o 2011:

2011 NLJ250 / 101+ Firm / Discrepancy

Harvard.......49% / 49% / +0%
Columbia.....52% / 61% / +9%
NYU.............40% / 43% / +3%
Chicago.......45% / 45% / +0%
Penn............57% / 58% / +1%
Cornell........38% / 39% / +1%

Sources:
http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 0118083359
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?r=ny#jobs

The official explanation of course is that a bunch of NYC-based big firms don't report their first-year associates and are not counted in the NLJ250. It's just strange that the discrepancy is so much larger for CLS that for these other schools that also place heavily into NYC.

[Tiago Splitter]

I was reading over http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 9&start=25 again this morning. Out of curiosity, I looked at the NLJ vs. self-reported discrepancies for c/o 2011:

2011 NLJ250 / 101+ Firm / Discrepancy

Harvard.......49% / 49% / +0%
Columbia.....52% / 61% / +9%
NYU.............40% / 43% / +3%
Chicago.......45% / 45% / +0%
Penn............57% / 58% / +1%
Cornell........38% / 39% / +1%

Sources:
http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 0118083359
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?r=ny#jobs

The official explanation of course is that a bunch of NYC-based big firms don't report their first-year associates and are not counted in the NLJ250. It's just strange that the discrepancy is so much larger for CLS that for these other schools that also place heavily into NYC.

Look at the discrepancy for other years. The "winners" in this game seem to change every year.

[09042014]

There are more than 100 firms that are above 101 lawyers and yet not NJL250. The smallest NLJ 250 is 160 lawyers. Trying to compare the two is stupid.

[banjo]

I decided to look at 2010 too. I'm starting to see what Tiago Splitter meant...

Harvard.......50% / 57% / +7%
Columbia.....55% / 69% / +14%
NYU.............43% / 57% / +14%
Chicago.......59% / 60% / +1%
Penn............53% / 59% / +6%
Cornell........58% / 76% / +18%

There are more than 100 firms that are above 101 lawyers and yet not NJL250. The smallest NLJ 250 is 160 lawyers. Trying to compare the two is stupid.

The point is that those old NLJ250 charts are really, really misleading. What's worse is that they tend to distort the placement at some schools more than others and in unpredictable ways. Maybe this is an obvious point, but this thread did start out as a compilation of NLJ250 data...

[09042014]

I decided to look at 2010 too:

Harvard.......50% / 57% / +7%
Columbia.....55% / 69% / +14%
NYU.............43% / 57% / +14%
Chicago.......59% / 60% / +1%
Penn............53% / 59% / +6%
Cornell........58% / 76% / +18%

There are more than 100 firms that are above 101 lawyers and yet not NJL250. The smallest NLJ 250 is 160 lawyers. Trying to compare the two is stupid.

The point is that those old NLJ250 charts are really, really misleading. What's worse is that they tend to distort the placement at some schools more than others and in unpredictable ways. Maybe this is an obvious point, but this thread did start out as a compilation of NLJ250 data...

Picking 101+ lawyers is just as arbitrary as picking NLJ 250. And it favors places like NYC where even some shitty firms have that many attorneys.