Job Prospects Out of T14 Schools? Forum

[rad lulz]

You're not that good with analogies, are you. They should have kept those on the SATs.

[RodneyBoonfield]

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[L’Étranger]

When I read the OP a couple of days ago I thought it was so goofy that it was a flame, but the issue being argued on the previous page was interesting.

As I understand it, the issue being debated is: Do 0Ls posses the ability to give valid career advice on these threads?

My feeling is that although I personally don't know a ton about the ins-and-outs of the legal market and firm life as a 2L, I definitely now know a great deal more than I did as a 0L. That plus the fact that people who read these threads often can't easily tell how much a poster really knows about what they're talking about, would lead me to agree with the policy that 0Ls should not be posting on employment threads or giving career advice on TLS.

TLDR: I would say to 0Ls, wait one more year (or a few more months for some) and then you all can post misleading and poorly informed advice on here with the rest of us!

[Chickensoup]

You're not that good with analogies, are you. They should have kept those on the SATs.

You're not that good with grammar, are you? Good thing lawyers don't do any work that requires writing arguments.

[Richie Tenenbaum]

I've worked closely with established lawyers who were graduates of Harvard, Cornell, and Rutgers. They all argued frequently (while discussing their cases), they all read and summarized countless pages of boring shit, and they all were not miserable. Sooooooo....

In my experience, the "conventional wisdom" of TLS fails again.

Oh, and the Rutgers grad actually made a lot more than the Cornell grad. The Harvard grad was the boss of both of them, though.

What was the "conventional wisdom" of TLS? That "loving to argue" and not minding reading a lot of boring shit is not the best reason to want to be a lawyer? I'm not sure that is TLS conventional wisdom, but I don't mind supporting that proposition. There's way better reasons than those for wanting to be a lawyer. I don't think I'd go as far as radlaw in saying people who like to argue make shitty lawyers, but I will say that those people are generally more annoying to be around, whether they're law students or lawyers. (Though there is something to be said about the ability to compartmentalize traits--a person can really be great at making legal arguments and really enjoy doing it, and not have a more argumentative-type of personality in his normal life.)

And, for the record, no one gives a shit about your 0L experience in a law firm. TLS has enough 1) people already working in biglaw and 2) law students with summer experience in biglaw. Dropping your nuggets of wisdom about What It's Like To Be a Lawyer is unnecessary.

[mbuckner]

To clarify a bit, I've wanted to be a lawyer for a long time. I love to debate and argue, and I've really taken to my Philosophy classes,

If this is what you've enjoyed in school, you're going to hate being a lawyer.

You are easily the most irritating poster on this site. You're tacky and I hate you.

[gaud]

You're not that good with analogies, are you. They should have kept those on the SATs.

You're not that good with grammar, are you? Good thing lawyers don't do any work that requires writing arguments.

[IAFG]

You're not that good with analogies, are you. They should have kept those on the SATs.

You're not that good with grammar, are you? Good thing lawyers don't do any work that requires writing arguments.

Oh deary dear, if only there were some sort of process in law firms to proof grammar! But I am sure you'd know about any such processes or mechanisms, if they existed, oh wise 0L law firm summer intern.

[Chickensoup]

To clarify a bit, I've wanted to be a lawyer for a long time. I love to debate and argue, and I've really taken to my Philosophy classes,

If this is what you've enjoyed in school, you're going to hate being a lawyer.

You are easily the most irritating poster on this site. You're tacky and I hate you.

Yes rad lulz sucks. He has always sucked and he will continue to suck for some time. Soon, however, the ignominy of striking out at OCI at his TTT will put him in his place and he will live out the rest of his life from his mother's basement, eating moonpies and watching marathons of Thunder Cats.

[bk1]

1. Everyone chill the fuck out.

2. Working in a law firm as a 0L doesn't give you magical insight.

[Davidbentley]

To clarify a bit, I've wanted to be a lawyer for a long time. I love to debate and argue, and I've really taken to my Philosophy classes,

If this is what you've enjoyed in school, you're going to hate being a lawyer.

You are easily the most irritating poster on this site. You're tacky and I hate you.

Yes rad lulz sucks. He has always sucked and he will continue to suck for some time. Soon, however, the ignominy of striking out at OCI at his TTT will put him in his place and he will live out the rest of his life from his mother's basement, eating moonpies and watching marathons of Thunder Cats.

[John Mill]

Jeez I didn't think that would spout a two page flame fest. When I said I liked to argue I was only brought it up because Iv'e read that arguing or debating a lot gives you an analytical frame of mind, and that's a kind of thought process that serves you well in law school, and as a lawyer. I know that actual argument skills rarely come up in corporate law.

You're engaged as a freshman in college? You're probably missing out on lots of tail.

Im actually 22, I took a four year break after high school. I know its still a tad young, but I got laid enough in high school and afterwards tbh, I'm happy with my choices.

[dingbat]

a brief is... a summary of an argument

no, a brief is the argument, in written form (close, but no cigar)

Yes rad lulz sucks. He has always sucked and he will continue to suck for some time. Soon, however, the ignominy of striking out at OCI at his TTT will put him in his place and he will live out the rest of his life from his mother's basement, eating moonpies and watching marathons of Thunder Cats.

It's a little late for that, he's already had a successful summer, and his school isn't exactly a TTT, but I digress

Iv'e read that arguing or debating a lot gives you an analytical frame of mind, and that's a kind of thought process that serves you well in law school, and as a lawyer

That depends on whether you're arguing for argument's sake and being an obstinate douche about it, or if you're having fierce discussions with someone of similar disposition but alternate view and you learn from it

Im actually 22, I took a four year break after high school. I know its still a tad young, but I got laid enough in high school and afterwards tbh, I'm happy with my choices.

whatever works for you. Sounds like you're a matureexperienced 22, and I hope you have a wonderful life

[John Mill]

That depends on whether you're arguing for argument's sake and being an obstinate douche about it, or if you're having fierce discussions with someone of similar disposition but alternate view and you learn from it

I think argument may have been a bad word. I never look for arguments, in fact I try my best to avoid them for the most part. I do enjoy having a good debate with somebody, especially if its something we both know enough about that somebody winds up learning something or rethinking their view.

In terms of actual arguments, no, Im not that much of an argumentative person, Im pretty easy to get along with.

[alwayssunnyinfl]

If there were a remote chance in hell that I'd get laid from it, I'd white knight rad right now.

[romothesavior]

There is nothing better than a college sophomore with an internship at the local DUI shop telling a community full of law students and practicing attorneys how they don't know anything. For far too long we have allowed law students with lawyer dads who worked in biglaw this past summer to tell us what law is like. Your rein of ignorance is over, Rad lulz. I, for one, welcome Chickenshit to our forum. I eagerly anticipate being enlightened by his insights.

[hume85]

There is nothing better than a college sophomore with an internship at the local DUI shop telling a community full of law students and practicing attorneys how they don't know anything. For far too long we have allowed law students with lawyer dads who worked in biglaw this past summer to tell us what law is like. Your rein of ignorance is over, Rad lulz. I, for one, welcome Chickenshit to our forum. I eagerly anticipate being enlightened by his insights.

LOL. You are one of the most consistently funny people on TLS. And Ron Burgundy is beyond legendary.

[vanwinkle]

Who cares that I'm a 0L?

Actually, they care that you're a clueless 0L. The TLS term for posters like you is "clueless 0L", for obvious reasons.

Also, lol @ romo.

[rad lulz]

There is nothing better than a college sophomore with an internship at the local DUI shop telling a community full of law students and practicing attorneys how they don't know anything. For far too long we have allowed law students with lawyer dads who worked in biglaw this past summer to tell us what law is like. Your rein of ignorance is over, Rad lulz. I, for one, welcome Chickenshit to our forum. I eagerly anticipate being enlightened by his insights.

Credited bro.

I did dece in LRW, but I would have done better if I just wrote some more summaries. That was my problem.

[afitouri]

I've worked closely with established lawyers who were graduates of Harvard, Cornell, and Rutgers. They all argued frequently (while discussing their cases), they all read and summarized countless pages of boring shit, and they all were not miserable. Sooooooo....

In my experience, the "conventional wisdom" of TLS fails again.

Oh, and the Rutgers grad actually made a lot more than the Cornell grad. The Harvard grad was the boss of both of them, though.

Honestly your 0L experiences really don't carry much weight on this forum. I would refrain from giving advice in the Law School or Employment Forums until you enter law school and complete at least a summer at a large firm.

All of you are speaking in negatives while he was the only one speaking in positives. If you know what being a lawyer is like, then describe it accurately. Don't come and claim his description is inaccurate while offering no evidence that you yourself understand it.

[EvilClinton]

All of you are speaking in negatives while he was the only one speaking in positives. If you know what being a lawyer is like, then describe it accurately. Don't come and claim his description is inaccurate while offering no evidence that you yourself understand it.

LOL that is not how it works. Should we just take everyone's description because they once knew or worked with a lawyer? The whole point of our admonishment was that his perspective of lawyers before going to law school was not relevant to this forum.

[John Mill]

All of it just spawned because of a misunderstanding. When I talked about arguing and philosophy I was saying that in reference to an analytical mind set set that debating gives you, and the ability to read, summarize, and analyze long difficult documents that philosophy gives you. Some people thought I was saying that there is a lot of argument and philisophical thinking as a lawyer, which is a common misconception, especially about corporate law, so I don't blame people for setting strait what they thought was a wrong opinion. It may have seemed negative, but considering how many people fall into the law school dept trap because of misconceptions of what law really is like, its better that they should be vigilant for people who don't know what their getting themselves in to. If anything I would have been being done a service by being shot down, if indeed that really was what I thought the practice of law was like.

Of course everybody has an opinion, but the opinion of a 0L should never count as much as those who have actually been through law school and/or are practicing lawyers. Chicken Soup obviously you have a better perspective than those who have never even worked around lawyers, but watching a lawyer go over a brief, and actually being trained to go over briefs are two very different things. It might appear one way to you, but you are still lacking the perspective of actually being trained to recognize what a brief is, and how to analyze it.

Your main point is that lawyers argue, because you've seen them argue over briefs. But anybody, in any kind of business argues like that. Doctors argue over what the best treatment for a patient is, businessmen argue over what the best ways to spend their companies money might be, generals argue over what the best military strategy is. So yes lawyers do argue, but its not a skill that's unique to their craft, except in certain types of law where you actually appear in court every day, which I already said I wasn't interested in.

So you might be technically right, but in this situation you should have backed off and let the majority of people with a more experienced perspective prevail. Especially since this is a site where people come for advice that could change their entire future, and may subconsciously want to grasp on to your more optimistic view, rather than change the career path they have had their hearts set on.

[tyler.durden]

This is very entertaining

[unc0mm0n1]

If this is what you've enjoyed in school, you're going to hate being a lawyer.

You are easily the most irritating poster on this site. You're tacky and I hate you.

Yes rad lulz sucks. He has always sucked and he will continue to suck for some time. Soon, however, the ignominy of striking out at OCI at his TTT will put him in his place and he will live out the rest of his life from his mother's basement, eating moonpies and watching marathons of Thunder Cats.

I'm not commenting on whether Rad sucks or not, but to be honest you're fighting a losing battle for a couple of reasons.

1) You are at a knowledge disadvantage to most people on here. I know that sucks but it's the truth.

2) Many people on here are jerks. They have a few internet friends and they like to gang up on 0L's and tell them how stupid they are. I know that sucks but it's the truth.

But there is a silver lining. You can stop it by just not feeding them. You made your point. No reason to keep this senseless "battle" going on.