Former T14 Dean of Admissions taking your questions Forum

[Irish11]

Ah, but there is a big difference between making excuses and and taking responsibility. So, if you were to say, for example, when I took the LSAT the first time, I had a full and challenging course load and I was juggling multiple responsibilities due to my involvement in extra-curricular activities on campus, that is making excuses. But saying something along the lines of: The first time I took the LSAT, I did not properly prioritize my commitments or manage my time. I learned a valuable lesson...(and here is what I did differently the next time I took the test, and now I know what I will need to do to succeed in law school). That is owning a mistake, taking responsibility, and showing what you learned from it. And that is important for many reasons: it shows strength of character, honesty, maturity, judgment, professionalism, and commitment. Extremely important qualities for success in law school and for the practice of law (big time).

Would you say the same thing in terms of a GPA addendum? I've written one that is basically exactly what you said - in college I prioritized my extracurriculars over my schoolwork, didn't take classes as seriously as I should have, etc., and now it's three years later, I'm older and wiser, and I get it. But I'm hesitant to attach it to any applications in case it's perceived as making excuses.

[bernie1992]

Thanks for taking questions!

I have a quick one regarding the admissions process--

If someone (aka me) was suspended for a semester during freshman year of college and has 4 expunged misdemeanors- what are the chances of getting into a T-25 law school?

*Keep in mind this information alone does not represent me entirely and I've cleaned up QUITE a bit since then.

Basically, what are the chances of someone with a criminal history such as mine being admitted? What is the weight on such a history?

[Gonoles6]

.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

I would say the biggest misconception about the law school application process is that it is based solely on numbers, and that misconception is particularly true for the top law schools. Of course, if your LSAT and UGPA are above a school's medians, you are starting off in a very strong position, but all of the other components of your application still need to be strong for admission. I know that at Penn (and at other top schools) each file is carefully reviewed in its entirety and each potential admission offer is taken very seriously. I recently attended a LAWS panel that the top 14 schools hosted, and one of the deans who was on the panel said something along the lines of: we may be choosing a future Supreme Court justice or the president of the United States, so great care goes into the reading of each application. Now, I know that may sound like somewhat of an extreme statement, but beyond the schools from which future justices and presidents typically graduate, the fact is, there is a tremendous amount of pressure on schools to get their students and graduates jobs (and not just any job, but jobs that require a JD). The admissions committees need to consider that when they are making admission offers. (A high LSAT and/or high UGPA alone does not necessarily make someone marketable as a lawyer!) My point is, regardless of what an applicant's numbers are, s/he should put together a thoughtful, polished application that is the best representation of her or him all the way around. Also, the non-numeric factors can make a big difference in the merit scholarship selection process; not all high LSAT/high UGPA admits are going to get a scholarship. So, applicants shouldn't let the "it's all about the numbers" misconception encourage a cavalier approach, even during a time when applications are down.

Dean Meeker,

With all due respect, the "it's not just about numbers" crowd has tended to come off as slightly disingenuous in the face of the admissions data we have. You say it isn't "solely" about numbers. I think nearly everyone would agree that "soft" (i.e. non-numeric) factors matter to some extent, and I don't doubt admissions committees do examine the entirety of each student's application. However, the predictive validity of a student's GPA and LSAT is so high that I don't think you could fault anyone for suggesting that, together, they are significantly more determinative than every other application factor combined.

Based on data from Lawschoolnumbers.com for my admissions cycle (2012-13), here were the acceptance rates of selected applicants at a few top schools, none of whom were early decision applicants or under-represented minorities, grouped into (a) those whose LSAT and GPA were both below a school's eventual median for that class, and (b) those whose LSAT and GPA were both above a school's median.

Harvard, above both: 98% (42/43)
Harvard, below both: 4% (5/141)

Columbia, above both: 86% (102/118)
Columbia, below both: 5% (4/84)

Chicago, above both: 85% (33/39)
Chicago, below both: 4% (4/85)

NYU, above both: 95% (137/144)
NYU, below both: 6% (4/68)

While nothing you've said is wrong in my opinion, I feel it's misleading to suggest that an applicant's LSAT and GPA have anything less than a drastic effect on admissions chances at the majority of top schools. I would feel comfortable advising an applicant to Penn in the upcoming cycle who was not an underrepresented minority that absent truly extraordinary circumstances, their chances of being admitted without either an LSAT of at least 169 or a GPA of at least 3.89 are quite low.

That aside, thank you for taking the time to answer questions.

[DerekMeeker]

I would say the biggest misconception about the law school application process is that it is based solely on numbers, and that misconception is particularly true for the top law schools. Of course, if your LSAT and UGPA are above a school's medians, you are starting off in a very strong position, but all of the other components of your application still need to be strong for admission. I know that at Penn (and at other top schools) each file is carefully reviewed in its entirety and each potential admission offer is taken very seriously. I recently attended a LAWS panel that the top 14 schools hosted, and one of the deans who was on the panel said something along the lines of: we may be choosing a future Supreme Court justice or the president of the United States, so great care goes into the reading of each application. Now, I know that may sound like somewhat of an extreme statement, but beyond the schools from which future justices and presidents typically graduate, the fact is, there is a tremendous amount of pressure on schools to get their students and graduates jobs (and not just any job, but jobs that require a JD). The admissions committees need to consider that when they are making admission offers. (A high LSAT and/or high UGPA alone does not necessarily make someone marketable as a lawyer!) My point is, regardless of what an applicant's numbers are, s/he should put together a thoughtful, polished application that is the best representation of her or him all the way around. Also, the non-numeric factors can make a big difference in the merit scholarship selection process; not all high LSAT/high UGPA admits are going to get a scholarship. So, applicants shouldn't let the "it's all about the numbers" misconception encourage a cavalier approach, even during a time when applications are down.

Dean Meeker,

With all due respect, the "it's not just about numbers" crowd has tended to come off as slightly disingenuous in the face of the admissions data we have. You say it isn't "solely" about numbers. I think nearly everyone would agree that "soft" (i.e. non-numeric) factors matter to some extent, and I don't doubt admissions committees do examine the entirety of each student's application. However, the predictive validity of a student's GPA and LSAT is so high that I don't think you could fault anyone for suggesting that, together, they are significantly more determinative than every other application factor combined.

Based on data from Lawschoolnumbers.com for my admissions cycle (2012-13), here were the acceptance rates of selected applicants at a few top schools, none of whom were early decision applicants or under-represented minorities, grouped into (a) those whose LSAT and GPA were both below a school's eventual median for that class, and (b) those whose LSAT and GPA were both above a school's median.

Harvard, above both: 98% (42/43)
Harvard, below both: 4% (5/141)

Columbia, above both: 86% (102/118)
Columbia, below both: 5% (4/84)

Chicago, above both: 85% (33/39)
Chicago, below both: 4% (4/85)

NYU, above both: 95% (137/144)
NYU, below both: 6% (4/68)

While nothing you've said is wrong in my opinion, I feel it's misleading to suggest that an applicant's LSAT and GPA have anything less than a drastic effect on admissions chances at the majority of top schools. I would feel comfortable advising an applicant to Penn in the upcoming cycle who was not an underrepresented minority that absent truly extraordinary circumstances, their chances of being admitted without either an LSAT of at least 169 or a GPA of at least 3.89 are quite low.

That aside, thank you for taking the time to answer questions.

Hi, there.

I appreciate your thoughts on my post and the information you provided. But we don't even need TLS sample data to illustrate the point. The actual data (medians) the schools themselves provide on their websites (and that the ABA subsequently publishes) clearly indicate that LSAT and GPA have a significant effect on one's admission chances: Yale 173/3.91; Harvard 173/3.87; Stanford 171/3.87; Columbia 172/3.71; Chicago 170/3.9; NYU 170/3.75; Penn 169/3.89. Looking at those numbers, no one can deny the impact of LSAT and GPA on the process. The point I was making in saying the admissions process is not based "solely on the numbers" was that, if your LSAT and GPA are high (i.e., above a school's medians), that does not necessarily mean you will gain admission, particularly to a top law school. I noted, one should not let the "it's all about the numbers misconception" encourage a cavalier approach even during a time when overall application numbers are down. The soft factors matter greatly at the top schools because they are often determining factors within the pool of candidates whose numbers are above both median LSAT and median GPA. Also, there are many "splitter" candidates (LSAT above median/GPA below median; GPA above median/LSAT below median) in the applicant pool. It is absolutely true that when one has a "lower" GPA, the strongest factor to overcome that weakness is a high LSAT score; conversely, when one has a "lower" LSAT, the strongest factor to overcome that weakness is a stellar academic record. But again, within this pool of candidates at the top schools, only a select number will be admitted. The soft factors often will be the differentiating factors (and, of course, the more selective the school can be given its yield, the more those non-numerical factors come into play) within this pool of applicants.

[DerekMeeker]

Thanks for taking questions!

I have a quick one regarding the admissions process--

If someone (aka me) was suspended for a semester during freshman year of college and has 4 expunged misdemeanors- what are the chances of getting into a T-25 law school?

*Keep in mind this information alone does not represent me entirely and I've cleaned up QUITE a bit since then.

Basically, what are the chances of someone with a criminal history such as mine being admitted? What is the weight on such a history?

Please PM me; it's a tough question to answer without additional information.

[ymmv]

Even that seems to underestimate the degree to which law school application is a numbers-driven buyer's (i.e. applicant's) market right now. You just don't see people with high numbers not getting offers throughout the T14s even with terrible softs, which is what you would expect if your analysis were accurate.

The truth is that law school admissions can't afford to be super selective about Aspberger's or sociopathy or terminal KJDism when they're desperately fighting to maintain their numbers and USNWR rankings as the number of applications start to plummet. TBF I think some schools probably have a slightly more holistic process than others, and maybe Penn is one of then, but you really can't talk around the facts of the stats here. If softs matter they seem only to matter for candidates on the margins.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

Even that seems to underestimate the degree to which law school application is a numbers-driven buyer's (i.e. applicant's) market right now. You just don't see people with high numbers not getting offers throughout the T14s even with terrible softs, which is what you would expect if your analysis were accurate.

The truth is that law school admissions can't afford to be super selective about Aspberger's or sociopathy or terminal KJDism when they're desperately fighting to maintain their numbers and USNWR rankings as the number of applications start to plummet. TBF I think some schools probably have a slightly more holistic process than others, and maybe Penn is one of then, but you really can't talk around the facts of the stats here. If softs matter they seem only to matter for candidates on the margins.

I have no doubt softs really do play a significant role for applicants at/above one median and below another.

As to the "numbers are necessary but not sufficient" narrative: Rejecting applicants below both medians would fall in line with that (e.g. when there are so many qualified applicants, it's the easy cut to make). But the narrative does nothing to explain why the acceptance rates for applicants above both medians are so high. I'm not buying that every HLS applicant who has a 3.9+/174+ also just happens to have an elite undergrad, a presidency in four campus organizations, a Fulbright Scholarship, and found the tomb of King Tut. With the exceptions of Yale, Stanford, and Berkeley, which have long been noted on TLS, numbers are, for the most part, both a necessary and sufficient condition for acceptance.

[Moneytrees]

The point I was making in saying the admissions process is not based "solely on the numbers" was that, if your LSAT and GPA are high (i.e., above a school's medians), that does not necessarily mean you will gain admission, particularly to a top law school. I

Very few people believe that the admissions process is based solely on numbers. But the data that Monochromatic Oeuvre provided confirms that if you have the right credentials (above both a school's medians), then you have an extremely high chance of getting.

I appreciate the advice you've given so far and don't outright disagree with anything you've said, but the data that we have access to supports the notion that LSAT and GPA are sufficient conditions for acceptance in the vast majority of cases.

[Long_Time_Lurker]

I hope I haven't missed out on questions!

Can you weigh in on how a non-academic letter of recommendation from a retail employer might look? I've seen some information about letters from employers, but they all tend to assume much more prestigious jobs. I have one academic letter, but I transferred undergrads so many times that I don't think I can get a good second one.

I really appreciate the help!

[DerekMeeker]

Hi, there. If your employer knows you well and can write a detailed letter with specific examples that show you have developed and exhibited skills/characteristics that are transferrable to law school and to success as a lawyer, the letter will add something of value to your application. That is certainly better than having a second academic letter from someone who doesn't know you well and would write a sparse letter. I don't know what your position is/was, but here is some information that could be helpful. The writer may not be able to talk about your analytical, critical reasoning, or writing skills (hopefully, your academic LOR will cover those skills), but he or she could potentially discuss your interpersonal and client service skills, oral communication skills, work ethic, ability to manage time, juggle multiple responsibilities, and exercise sound judgment, maturity, confidence, etc. Think about skills, qualities and characteristics - beyond the intellectual ones - that are necessary for one to do well in a rigorous academic setting and as a lawyer that you exercised in your job and ask your recommender to focus his or her discussion on those.

[lsatisevil7]

Hello. I have a question. If it's been answered already, I'll find it after I post. Anyway, can you talk about what effect isolated incidences of misconduct have on an application to top law schools? I'm mainly referring to misdemeanor crimes such as DUI, MIP, etc. And, are incidences such as these mitigated to any extent by rigor and excellence in school, volunteer, and work efforts? Thanks.

[Adrian Monk]

Hi, there. If your employer knows you well and can write a detailed letter with specific examples that show you have developed and exhibited skills/characteristics that are transferrable to law school and to success as a lawyer, the letter will add something of value to your application. That is certainly better than having a second academic letter from someone who doesn't know you well and would write a sparse letter. I don't know what your position is/was, but here is some information that could be helpful. The writer may not be able to talk about your analytical, critical reasoning, or writing skills (hopefully, your academic LOR will cover those skills), but he or she could potentially discuss your interpersonal and client service skills, oral communication skills, work ethic, ability to manage time, juggle multiple responsibilities, and exercise sound judgment, maturity, confidence, etc. Think about skills, qualities and characteristics - beyond the intellectual ones - that are necessary for one to do well in a rigorous academic setting and as a lawyer that you exercised in your job and ask your recommender to focus his or her discussion on those.

Hello Dean, i sent u a pm!

[DerekMeeker]

Hello. I have a question. If it's been answered already, I'll find it after I post. Anyway, can you talk about what effect isolated incidences of misconduct have on an application to top law schools? I'm mainly referring to misdemeanor crimes such as DUI, MIP, etc. And, are incidences such as these mitigated to any extent by rigor and excellence in school, volunteer, and work efforts? Thanks.

Hello. An isolated misdemeanor related to alcohol typically has little effect on the application as long as: you disclose the incident and provide an adequate explanation in an addendum. What is an "adequate" explanation? As I've emphasized in response to other questions regarding misconduct or a weak academic record, i.e., things that necessitate an addendum, taking responsibility is key. This morning, I read something that Apple CEO Tim Cook said in an interview with Charlie Rose regarding secrets to success - apologize when you mess up. He said, "Sometimes, when you’re running fast, you slip and you fall. And I think the best thing you can do is get back up and say, 'I’m sorry.' And you try to remedy the situation, and you work like hell to make the product right." This is excellent advice for your future legal career and it is spot on when it comes to writing the addendum to explain misconduct or academic mistakes. Explain the circumstances, OWN the mistake you made, express remorse, and then show how you've "remedied situation," how you've "worked like hell" since then. The amount of time that has passed since the incident and what you've done in that time - so, yes, an excellent academic record, volunteer and work efforts, and no further misconduct issues - will absolutely be mitigating factors.

[TLSuser2014]

Hello! I am registered to take the December 2014 LSAT by I am worried that I do not have enough time to study. I have been considering three different options in order for me to get accepted into my desired school (which is the University of Florida):

1. Take the December LSAT administration and apply for school with that score, which will allow me to have my application in by early January but I may not have received the best score due to my limited time to study.

2. Take the December LSAT, apply to schools but register for the February LSAT, which would cause my application to be held until I receive my February LSAT.

3. Take the February LSAT only and apply right before the deadline, March 15th, with the likelihood of a higher score.

Which option do you think is best? I would like to take the February test if it means that I can get a higher score but I am also worried that I will not have an opportunity to receive scholarships if I apply in March.

I am not sure which strategy would be the best in hopes of getting admitted for the Fall 2014-2015 cycle. UF is my top choice since Gainesville is my hometown and I plan to practice law in the state of Florida. I am applying to other schools in Florida but UF is the better option for me due to my situation.

Thank you for your help!

[DerekMeeker]

Hello. I would advise option 2: plan to take the December LSAT, do your best to prepare for it, submit your applications no later than mid-December, and register for the February LSAT. If you end up exceeding your expectations and receiving a satisfactory score on the December test, you can cancel your February test registration and inform the school that you will not be taking the Feb. LSAT so they can move forward with review of your application. If you are unsatisfied with your December LSAT score and are confident that you can score higher with additional preparation, then you can request that the school not review your application until they receive your February LSAT. While it is true you may not be in the most advantageous position at that point for merit scholarships, many schools do continue to award scholarships during the spring and sometimes even into summer. If you are a candidate they really want (or need to meet their admissions goals), they will do what they can to entice you to enroll. In the event they tell you they can offer you admission but not a scholarship, you could consider reapplying in the fall so that your file would be among the first to be considered for admission and scholarships. That, of course, would mean deferring your law school enrollment for a year, but waiting a year could be a wise decision if it means incurring less debt for your legal education. Feel free to PM me if you have follow-up questions. Good luck!

Hello! I am registered to take the December 2014 LSAT by I am worried that I do not have enough time to study. I have been considering three different options in order for me to get accepted into my desired school (which is the University of Florida):

1. Take the December LSAT administration and apply for school with that score, which will allow me to have my application in by early January but I may not have received the best score due to my limited time to study.

2. Take the December LSAT, apply to schools but register for the February LSAT, which would cause my application to be held until I receive my February LSAT.

3. Take the February LSAT only and apply right before the deadline, March 15th, with the likelihood of a higher score.

Which option do you think is best? I would like to take the February test if it means that I can get a higher score but I am also worried that I will not have an opportunity to receive scholarships if I apply in March.

I am not sure which strategy would be the best in hopes of getting admitted for the Fall 2014-2015 cycle. UF is my top choice since Gainesville is my hometown and I plan to practice law in the state of Florida. I am applying to other schools in Florida but UF is the better option for me due to my situation.

Thank you for your help!

[TLSuser2014]

Thank you so much for your advice!

[Gonoles6]

Dean Meeker,

Thank you for taking questions.

I have a couple questions regarding the transfer process to Penn and other top schools. How much does my undergrad gpa and LSAT factor in when applying as a transfer student to a T14 from a school ranked in the top 30? What is the most common percentile for students to be accepted into Penn as a transfer student, top 10%?

Thank you for your time and help!

[BillsFan9907]

Dean Meeker -

I've got a question that I suspect a lot of people have on their minds: how do admissions officers react to "diversity statements" written by those who are white, middle class, never oppressed, straight... (on and on, you get the picture). There is a pretty lively topic at the top of this forum.

Obviously, they will not be able to write about the time they were called the N-word in elementary school and how it opened their eyes to racial bias. The common wisdom around here is that if this sort of thing doesn't apply to you - you aren't diverse in the racial/religious/sexual preference/economic sense - then you are more or less wasting the admissions officer's time.

Agree or disagree?

If you do disagree, could you perhaps recall some of the examples that stand out from your time in admissions of those with (to put it bluntly) "privileged" upbringings that did a great job of demonstrating diversity in a diversity statement?

To put this another way - what would constitute grounds for a diversity statement from Chelsea Clinton or Paris Hilton. They've hired you, and really want to write a diversity statement. Where do you tell them to look?

[DerekMeeker]

Dean Meeker,

Thank you for taking questions.

I have a couple questions regarding the transfer process to Penn and other top schools. How much does my undergrad gpa and LSAT factor in when applying as a transfer student to a T14 from a school ranked in the top 30? What is the most common percentile for students to be accepted into Penn as a transfer student, top 10%?

Thank you for your time and help!

Hello. My apologies - I thought I had responded to this question awhile back when it was first posted. (I remember drafting the response, but perhaps I didn't hit submit!) First-year grades weigh much more heavily than LSAT and UGPA; that said, I always reviewed the LSAT and UGPA as supplemental evidence (i.e., part of the overall file) and many top schools take a similar approach. If either stands out because it is significantly lower than the school's enrollment standards, it could affect the decision. In my experience, that did not happen very often, i.e., the LSAT and UGPA (with more exceptions here, perhaps due to extenuating circumstances during college) generally did a good job of predicting the applicant's success at his or her law school. In other words, there were few outliers; transfer applicants who performed near the top of their 1L class typically had LSAT scores and UGPAs that "predicted" they would. Also, the LSAT and UGPA may be considered in close cases or when having to make choices between similarly competitive applicants. The transfer process is very competitive at the top schools (though, for awhile, some had significantly increased the number they were admitting; this trend is reversing at some schools - more on that further down), so all factors - strength of LORs, experience, Law Review, and, yes, LSAT/UGPA - will be considered in narrowing down the pool. But first-year performance is the predominant factor in this process. As far as the most common percentile for admission as a transfer to Penn - I really can't say with absolute certainty. For one thing, the reputation and competitiveness (admission standards) of the school is taken into consideration; also, many of the schools ranked in the top 30 do not rank their students and some do not provide definitive information as to grading. So, it does vary from school to school. The more selective the school (particularly ranked in the 11-15 range) the deeper they are likely to go into the pool, and the standards will tighten as you go down the line. But top 10% is probably a good guess for the 20-30 range.

All of that said, I have heard that some top schools ARE looking a bit more closely at LSAT score and UGPA because of the decline in lower-ranked schools' admission standards (due to the decline in applications overall). Some schools (Penn among them) are now interviewing transfer applicants. The increased competition in the legal market has led some schools to actually admit fewer transfer applicants (and/or to weigh other factors more heavily) to further ensure that the students they admit will not only do well academically, but also will fare well during OCI/in the legal market.

[HTBA15]

Hello Dean Meeker,

Again, thank you for your time to answer our questions.

I am current a graduate student and was wondering how law schools will look at my academic work, transcripts, GPA, etc. in combination with the rest of my application. The MA program I am currently enrolled in specifically deals with the law I am looking to enter, but I have received mixed opinions as to how law schools would look at my graduate work. I should note, additionally, although my UG GPA is somewhere in the 25-50% for the school I am interested in, my graduate GPA is much, much stronger and is a better demonstration of my academic work.

Thank you!

[jbagelboy]

Dean Meeker,

Thank you for taking questions. I have a series of related questions about an issue that comes up repeatedly on TLS.

1) In your role as Dean of Admissions (we safely assume in this role your goal is to attract the students you've admitted to attend), what would you tell a Levy Scholar offeree debating between Penn Law with the scholarship or Harvard Law (where they cannot receive merit aid)? Let's assume without the scholarship this student would be taking out significant student loans to finance their education. If possible, try to be as conclusive/nuanced as possible beyond, "it depends."

[1b) What about a student offered no aid at Penn debating between paying the sticker price and attending, say, UTexas with a steep discount?]

2) How would this contrast with your opinion on the candidate's decision from the perspective of your role in law firm hiring?

3) Lastly, drawing on your exposure to and work alongside legal academia, how would your answer to the premise of 1) change as member of a faculty hiring committee at an elite law school (say, Penn), where an overwhelmingly large number of the tenured faculty hail from a very select cadre of effectively two schools?

If there are differences between 1), 2) and 3), how do you reconcile them? (beyond the obvious agency distinctions)

Thanks again.

[DerekMeeker]

Hello Dean Meeker,

Again, thank you for your time to answer our questions.

I am current a graduate student and was wondering how law schools will look at my academic work, transcripts, GPA, etc. in combination with the rest of my application. The MA program I am currently enrolled in specifically deals with the law I am looking to enter, but I have received mixed opinions as to how law schools would look at my graduate work. I should note, additionally, although my UG GPA is somewhere in the 25-50% for the school I am interested in, my graduate GPA is much, much stronger and is a better demonstration of my academic work.

Thank you!

Hello. Basically, your graduate work/degree is something "extra" that you bring to the table. It is additional academic work, perspective, development of writing and critical thinking skills, etc. It will be considered a distinguishing factor among similarly competitive candidates (i.e., candidates with a similar LSAT score and UGPA). The UGPA will still carry more weight; there are a variety of reasons for this, which probably have been previously explained. But in short, the undergraduate program is 4 years in duration (more akin to law school duration, so a better indication of potential for continuous and sustained academic work), a broader curriculum, and a more comparable factor because all applicants have a 4-year bachelor's degree. Also, in general, graduate program grades tend to be higher, so admissions committees take that into account, too. So, a graduate GPA won't significantly compensate for a lower UGPA; a higher LSAT would compensate more for that. But, as I said, it does add some weight to your overall application and will certainly help at schools where you may be a "bubble" candidate. Also, in cases where several years have passed since college, it might be given more weight since it would be a more recent illustration of your academic potential. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss your application in more detail.

[DerekMeeker]

Hello Dean Meeker,

Again, thank you for your time to answer our questions.

I am current a graduate student and was wondering how law schools will look at my academic work, transcripts, GPA, etc. in combination with the rest of my application. The MA program I am currently enrolled in specifically deals with the law I am looking to enter, but I have received mixed opinions as to how law schools would look at my graduate work. I should note, additionally, although my UG GPA is somewhere in the 25-50% for the school I am interested in, my graduate GPA is much, much stronger and is a better demonstration of my academic work.

Thank you!

Hello. Basically, your graduate work/degree is something "extra" that you bring to the table. It is additional academic work, perspective, development of writing and critical thinking skills, etc. It will be considered a distinguishing factor among similarly competitive candidates (i.e., candidates with a similar LSAT score and UGPA). The UGPA will still carry more weight; there are a variety of reasons for this, which probably have been previously explained. But in short, the undergraduate program is 4 years in duration (more akin to law school duration, so a better indication of potential for continuous and sustained academic work), a broader curriculum, and a more comparable factor because all applicants have a 4-year bachelor's degree. Also, in general, graduate program grades tend to be higher, so admissions committees take that into account, too. So, a graduate GPA won't significantly compensate for a lower UGPA; a higher LSAT would compensate more for that. But, as I said, it does add some weight to your overall application and will certainly help at schools where you may be a "bubble" candidate. Also, in cases where several years have passed since college, it might be given more weight since it would be a more recent illustration of your academic potential. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss your application in more detail.

Also, just want to add that the fact that your graduate program is related to the field of law you want to enter, helps as well. It shows that you are focused and goal-oriented and perhaps more prepared for law school and legal practice; using your personal statement or a supplemental essay to discuss your graduate experience and how it contributes to your career goals would be a plus.

[WeeBey]

Hello Dean Meeker,

I have a question regarding the boost the under-represented minorities receive. Do you have to be a US-resident to receive the boost? I am a first generation Black-Canadian with parents born in Africa and I'm wondering if I would recieve a boost similar to black applicants that are US residents.

Thank you in advance!