Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016 Forum

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by NaeDeen » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:50 pm

Easy-E wrote:
bsktbll28082 wrote:They have me still watching lectures up to 7/12 (surety). I think I'm going to go through the outlines/lectures of the remaining topics on my own, not following their schedule. Hopefully will finish before 7/4 so I can review for most of July.
Yeah the fact I'm still watching lectures is kinda freaking me out
That's exactly why I took yesterday and today to finish up the remaining 8 topics I needed to watch. I have one left, adv sales. It's worth the brain torture because I don't have to worry about watching anymore substantive lectures (there are about 8 remaining workshop lectures). After I'm done with lectures today, I'll spend the remainder of today, tomorrow and Thursday creating flashcard outlines. That way, I've studied AND will have all the time I need to devote to all the MQ, MPT, and Essay Qs necessary. And I'll be able to use their suggested review time to go over my flashcards and outlines everyday in July. This is what works for me. I can't be bothered with creating outlines in July. Good luck! You can do it :)

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Fivedham » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:55 pm

Mixed PQ 3 lives up to the hype. I beat the goal, but just barely. I got all but one contracts question wrong too. It seriously felt like they were testing some obscure shit in there. Like that question about
[+] Spoiler
the dentist and products liability for the bad crown. I checked the long outline after... it's like one sentence that mentions this service provider exception, and specifically names medical doctors, not dentists. The explanation says some bullshit like, "Oh, it's likely that a dentist would be covered by this too."
Also, can anyone provide some insight on this one?
[+] Spoiler
The hearsay question about the jogger who drew a picture of her assailant, but died before trial. Question says the picture is hearsay. I said it wasn't hearsay, thinking that it's not a statement... it's a photo. I thought for hearsay to be hearsay, the thing had to be a statement.

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Welcome to TLS

Post by CaptainLeela » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:01 pm

Welcome to TLS

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by rambleon65 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:19 pm

Fivedham wrote:
Also, can anyone provide some insight on this one?
[+] Spoiler
The hearsay question about the jogger who drew a picture of her assailant, but died before trial. Question says the picture is hearsay. I said it wasn't hearsay, thinking that it's not a statement... it's a photo. I thought for hearsay to be hearsay, the thing had to be a statement.
[+] Spoiler
It is a statement: that the assailant looked like the picture. It'd be no different than the jogger SAYING, "The assailant was x feet tall with y colored hair." For me the best way to know when something is a statement is whether you'd have a basis for cross-examining the declarant about the accuracy of the statement. This is why hearsay, as a general rule, is prohibited. (My prof used to call it the "infirmities" of hearsay).

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Easy-E » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:24 pm

CaptainLeela wrote:
Easy-E wrote:I fucking hate Birdthistle. You can never tell when he's actually filling in the handout, I end up crossing out shit constantly. And why are his the only ones where I have to fill in a whole paragraph and not just a key phrase.
I endorse this opinion.
The corporations lectures are a big improvement wrt those complaints but he still goes off on tangents

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CaptainLeela

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Welcome to TLS

Post by CaptainLeela » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:29 pm

Welcome to TLS

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by NaeDeen » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:33 pm

rambleon65 wrote:
Fivedham wrote:
Also, can anyone provide some insight on this one?
[+] Spoiler
The hearsay question about the jogger who drew a picture of her assailant, but died before trial. Question says the picture is hearsay. I said it wasn't hearsay, thinking that it's not a statement... it's a photo. I thought for hearsay to be hearsay, the thing had to be a statement.
[+] Spoiler
It is a statement: that the assailant looked like the picture. It'd be no different than the jogger SAYING, "The assailant was x feet tall with y colored hair." For me the best way to know when something is a statement is whether you'd have a basis for cross-examining the declarant about the accuracy of the statement. This is why hearsay, as a general rule, is prohibited. (My prof used to call it the "infirmities" of hearsay).
From what I understand, hearsay is any out of court statement BUT not the statement that you and I are used to in the real world. It can include photos, Ks, and other things not usually deemed "statements."

Please double check cause when it comes to evidence, I'm as useful as a hammer with not head!!

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by NaeDeen » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:35 pm

I watch three topics in its entirety and they are worth .6% each?!!!! For heavens sake! I swear Themis is trying to kill us. In all fairness, now I understand why a majority of their students do pass. This is a lot of work. Not complaining just stating facts.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by PhillyLawGirl2015 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:37 pm

Is anyone on here taking PA/NJ?

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Easy-E

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Easy-E » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:52 pm

Holy shit, what happened to Birdthistle between lectures 6 and 7?

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Nebby » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:53 pm

Easy-E wrote:Holy shit, what happened to Birdthistle between lectures 6 and 7?
Right??? I think he had sex

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Easy-E » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:55 pm

Nebby wrote:
Easy-E wrote:Holy shit, what happened to Birdthistle between lectures 6 and 7?
Right??? I think he had sex
Shit he's also missing the vest. I think you're right.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by mu13ski » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:57 pm

Just got wrecked by Mixed MBE Session 5. Sucks. Worst part is that I felt like I got wrecked in Session 4, but scored 20+ percentage points higher. Moral of the story is I have no idea what I'm doing.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Fivedham » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:59 pm

PhillyLawGirl2015 wrote:Is anyone on here taking PA/NJ?
I am. I hate the PA essays so much.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by kay2016 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:03 pm

Nebby wrote:
Easy-E wrote:Holy shit, what happened to Birdthistle between lectures 6 and 7?
Right??? I think he had sex
That was my assumption

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by NaeDeen » Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:41 pm

I now understand why I got so many of the K MBE qs wrong--a lot of the questions were on topics I hadn't covered. Now that I'm working on advanced sales, I remember these qs. So I guess now I'll start getting more K questions right. This might be the case for all of us.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by NaeDeen » Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:42 pm

Nebby wrote:
Easy-E wrote:Holy shit, what happened to Birdthistle between lectures 6 and 7?
Right??? I think he had sex
:shock: :shock:
He wasn't a professor for either one of my lectures. Now I kind of wish he were!

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by PhillyLawGirl2015 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:47 pm

Fivedham wrote:
PhillyLawGirl2015 wrote:Is anyone on here taking PA/NJ?
I am. I hate the PA essays so much.
Really??? I'm the opposite. I HATE NJ essays

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by bsktbll28082 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:55 pm

8 more, brand new topics to go. <3 VA

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Virindi » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:26 pm

does anyone know why this adaptibar question doesn't have burglary or robbery merge into the felony murder rule, and instead thinks the D can be tried for burglary, robbery, and FMR?
At 11:00 p.m., a couple was accosted in the entrance to their apartment building by the defendant, who was armed as well as masked. The defendant ordered the couple to take him into their apartment. After they entered the apartment, the defendant forced the woman to bind and gag her husband and then to open a safe which contained a diamond necklace. The defendant then tied her up and fled with the necklace. He was apprehended by apartment building security guards. Before the guards could return to the apartment, but after the defendant was arrested, the husband, straining to free himself, suffered a massive heart attack and died.

The defendant is guilty of

A. burglary, robbery, and murder.

B. robbery and murder only.

C. burglary and robbery only.

D. robbery only.


EXPLANATION:

The correct answer is A. Robbery is defined at common law as the taking, by force or threat of force, of personal property of another with the intent to permanently deprive the owner of the property. Burglary is the breaking and entering into a dwelling with the intent to commit a felony or theft therein. Felony murder is the killing of a human being in the course of a violent felony. In this case, the defendant is guilty of burglary, robbery, and murder. The defendant forced, at weapon point, the couple to allow him to enter their dwelling, which is sufficient for breaking and entering. When this breaking and entering occurred, the defendant had the intent to commit a theft of their property, and he is guilty of burglary. In addition, the defendant used force by tying and binding the couple, and the threat of force by threatening them, to take the necklace from the couple, and he had the intent to permanently deprive them of the necklace. Therefore, the defendant is guilty of robbery. Finally, the husband died as a result of the commission of those two violent felonies, so the defendant is guilty of felony murder. During the commission of the robbery and burglary, the defendant had the husband bound and gagged. That the husband would die from these actions, and the stress of attempting to escape, is foreseeable from the commission of the crime, and the defendant is guilty of murder.

Answer B is incorrect because it ignores the forced entry with the intent to commit felony theft into the apartment. Answer C is incorrect because it ignores the defendant's guilt under felony murder. Answer D is incorrect because it ignores both the burglary and the murder.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by PhillyLawGirl2015 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:32 pm

Virindi wrote:does anyone know why this adaptibar question doesn't have burglary or robbery merge into the felony murder rule, and instead thinks the D can be tried for burglary, robbery, and FMR?
At 11:00 p.m., a couple was accosted in the entrance to their apartment building by the defendant, who was armed as well as masked. The defendant ordered the couple to take him into their apartment. After they entered the apartment, the defendant forced the woman to bind and gag her husband and then to open a safe which contained a diamond necklace. The defendant then tied her up and fled with the necklace. He was apprehended by apartment building security guards. Before the guards could return to the apartment, but after the defendant was arrested, the husband, straining to free himself, suffered a massive heart attack and died.

The defendant is guilty of

A. burglary, robbery, and murder.

B. robbery and murder only.

C. burglary and robbery only.

D. robbery only.


EXPLANATION:

The correct answer is A. Robbery is defined at common law as the taking, by force or threat of force, of personal property of another with the intent to permanently deprive the owner of the property. Burglary is the breaking and entering into a dwelling with the intent to commit a felony or theft therein. Felony murder is the killing of a human being in the course of a violent felony. In this case, the defendant is guilty of burglary, robbery, and murder. The defendant forced, at weapon point, the couple to allow him to enter their dwelling, which is sufficient for breaking and entering. When this breaking and entering occurred, the defendant had the intent to commit a theft of their property, and he is guilty of burglary. In addition, the defendant used force by tying and binding the couple, and the threat of force by threatening them, to take the necklace from the couple, and he had the intent to permanently deprive them of the necklace. Therefore, the defendant is guilty of robbery. Finally, the husband died as a result of the commission of those two violent felonies, so the defendant is guilty of felony murder. During the commission of the robbery and burglary, the defendant had the husband bound and gagged. That the husband would die from these actions, and the stress of attempting to escape, is foreseeable from the commission of the crime, and the defendant is guilty of murder.

Answer B is incorrect because it ignores the forced entry with the intent to commit felony theft into the apartment. Answer C is incorrect because it ignores the defendant's guilt under felony murder. Answer D is incorrect because it ignores both the burglary and the murder.
Burglary doesn't merge with robbery. Larceny merges with robbery. I think

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by 1down1togo » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:34 pm

Virindi wrote:does anyone know why this adaptibar question doesn't have burglary or robbery merge into the felony murder rule, and instead thinks the D can be tried for burglary, robbery, and FMR?
At 11:00 p.m., a couple was accosted in the entrance to their apartment building by the defendant, who was armed as well as masked. The defendant ordered the couple to take him into their apartment. After they entered the apartment, the defendant forced the woman to bind and gag her husband and then to open a safe which contained a diamond necklace. The defendant then tied her up and fled with the necklace. He was apprehended by apartment building security guards. Before the guards could return to the apartment, but after the defendant was arrested, the husband, straining to free himself, suffered a massive heart attack and died.

The defendant is guilty of

A. burglary, robbery, and murder.

B. robbery and murder only.

C. burglary and robbery only.

D. robbery only.


EXPLANATION:

The correct answer is A. Robbery is defined at common law as the taking, by force or threat of force, of personal property of another with the intent to permanently deprive the owner of the property. Burglary is the breaking and entering into a dwelling with the intent to commit a felony or theft therein. Felony murder is the killing of a human being in the course of a violent felony. In this case, the defendant is guilty of burglary, robbery, and murder. The defendant forced, at weapon point, the couple to allow him to enter their dwelling, which is sufficient for breaking and entering. When this breaking and entering occurred, the defendant had the intent to commit a theft of their property, and he is guilty of burglary. In addition, the defendant used force by tying and binding the couple, and the threat of force by threatening them, to take the necklace from the couple, and he had the intent to permanently deprive them of the necklace. Therefore, the defendant is guilty of robbery. Finally, the husband died as a result of the commission of those two violent felonies, so the defendant is guilty of felony murder. During the commission of the robbery and burglary, the defendant had the husband bound and gagged. That the husband would die from these actions, and the stress of attempting to escape, is foreseeable from the commission of the crime, and the defendant is guilty of murder.

Answer B is incorrect because it ignores the forced entry with the intent to commit felony theft into the apartment. Answer C is incorrect because it ignores the defendant's guilt under felony murder. Answer D is incorrect because it ignores both the burglary and the murder.
I *think* what is going on is- they didnt ask what is the most serious crime he could be convicted of (like themis does). It just asked- what crimes is he guilty of- aka what crimes has he committed. And he's commited those three. Now what crimes could he be FOUND guilty of- he could not be FOUND guilty of all 3. But perhaps- just which crimes did he commit- aka what are the crimes he is guilty of... all three. That's my best guess.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by 1down1togo » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:41 pm

bsktbll28082 wrote:8 more, brand new topics to go. <3 VA
Most testable essay topics of any state. Gotta love it :roll:

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Nebby » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:45 pm

Virindi wrote:does anyone know why this adaptibar question doesn't have burglary or robbery merge into the felony murder rule, and instead thinks the D can be tried for burglary, robbery, and FMR?
At 11:00 p.m., a couple was accosted in the entrance to their apartment building by the defendant, who was armed as well as masked. The defendant ordered the couple to take him into their apartment. After they entered the apartment, the defendant forced the woman to bind and gag her husband and then to open a safe which contained a diamond necklace. The defendant then tied her up and fled with the necklace. He was apprehended by apartment building security guards. Before the guards could return to the apartment, but after the defendant was arrested, the husband, straining to free himself, suffered a massive heart attack and died.

The defendant is guilty of

A. burglary, robbery, and murder.

B. robbery and murder only.

C. burglary and robbery only.

D. robbery only.


EXPLANATION:

The correct answer is A. Robbery is defined at common law as the taking, by force or threat of force, of personal property of another with the intent to permanently deprive the owner of the property. Burglary is the breaking and entering into a dwelling with the intent to commit a felony or theft therein. Felony murder is the killing of a human being in the course of a violent felony. In this case, the defendant is guilty of burglary, robbery, and murder. The defendant forced, at weapon point, the couple to allow him to enter their dwelling, which is sufficient for breaking and entering. When this breaking and entering occurred, the defendant had the intent to commit a theft of their property, and he is guilty of burglary. In addition, the defendant used force by tying and binding the couple, and the threat of force by threatening them, to take the necklace from the couple, and he had the intent to permanently deprive them of the necklace. Therefore, the defendant is guilty of robbery. Finally, the husband died as a result of the commission of those two violent felonies, so the defendant is guilty of felony murder. During the commission of the robbery and burglary, the defendant had the husband bound and gagged. That the husband would die from these actions, and the stress of attempting to escape, is foreseeable from the commission of the crime, and the defendant is guilty of murder.

Answer B is incorrect because it ignores the forced entry with the intent to commit felony theft into the apartment. Answer C is incorrect because it ignores the defendant's guilt under felony murder. Answer D is incorrect because it ignores both the burglary and the murder.
The underlying felony is independent of the felony murder. It doesn't merge.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016

Post by Virindi » Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:48 pm

Nebby wrote: The underlying felony is independent of the felony murder. It doesn't merge.
they merge. check page 14 of your criminal law MBE outline

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