Please indulge my post NY bar exam anxiety Forum

[dalilah]

I know it's been a month already and everyone keeps telling me I should relax and stop worrying about it until the results come out, but I am constantly worried about the bar. At this point I've exhausted the patience of my relatives and friends by obsessing over the questions I got wrong, and hearing that failing would not be the end of the world and that I could retake the bar in February does not help.

I did what Barbri told me to do and did okay on the practice essays during the two months leading to the exam, and yet I panicked on the NY day and got many issues wrong. I forgot everything about NY distinctions (talked about common law licensee/invitee in the torts essay...), completely bombed the admin question which was actually a con law question, misread one of the contracts essay questions, bombed the administrator question in the intestacy essay, lost all logical sense regarding the secured transactions issue, forgot about NYCPR article 16...

I think I did okay on the MPT (although weirdly switched to "Mr. X" instead of "you" in the analysis section of my letter but I hope that won't hurt me too bad). I have no idea how well I did on the NY MPC--I thought it was hard, but it sounds like the feeling is shared. As to the MBE, I thought it was way harder than expected. The morning section left me on my knees and I ended up guessing on so many questions. And I also missed very easy and straightforward questions! I did pretty poorly on the Barbri midterm (104/200) but I was scoring slightly above average at the end of bar prep.

I'm mad at myself, for both being so anxious on exam day and forgetting everything I knew, but also for not being able to leave the exam behind me.

I just wanted to know if anyone else feels that way and if people who took the bar the previous years would have any words of advice. I have a job lined up at a big law firm and I am also worried that I won't be able to study for the February session while working long hours.

[gabewatch]

Ya, I feel the same way. Sucks. Not much to do about it. Also starting at a firm this fall and can't get the bar exam anxieties out of my head.

[NYbarguy]

OP, you're going to have to learn to live with uncertainty. Assuming your description of your bar exam performance is accurate, you probably did poorly, but there is a chance that your MBE performance will be better than expected. Bottom line: The exam has been submitted, and the outcome is completely out of your control at this time.

Your concerns appear to be threefold: (1) whether you passed the bar exam; (2) how the firm will respond if you do not pass; and (3) whether you will have sufficient time to prepare for the Feb 2016 exam if you do not pass.

Find the threads on TLS in which people discuss the challenges they faced in studying for the bar exam while working. I'm also pretty sure that there is a thread on TLS that addresses how biglaw firms react to those who have failed the bar exam.

But the most important thing for you, in my opinion, is to learn how to manage your anxiety. All of this obsessing is not going to change anything, ultimately, and can even make things worse by further increasing your anxiety.

[John34]

Even people say that it is out of my control,
i feel the same way. Essays were very hard for me. The problem was with timing.

mod edit: do not discuss essay topics on TLS, thanks.

These are the issues i could remember


NYMC was really hard. I dont remember a question.

MBE was hard too.

Anyway. Even i want to practice at least 10-15 question a day to make
my mind fresh about the MBE, but i cannot focus.

I wish all you luck.

[encore1101]

Relax.

I scored mid 90s on the BarBri midterm. I'm pretty sure I only got one essay question correctly. I didn't finish the MPT and I'm pretty sure I didn't answer the question prompt. I passed the bar just fine.

At this point, what is stressing about the Bar going to do? Is it going to raise your score? Are the bar examiners going to sense you're stressing and give you a break? Nope. Whatever you get, you're going to get, whether you're stressing about it now or not. So you may as well not let it stress you out anymore.

[rcharter1978]

I know it's been a month already and everyone keeps telling me I should relax and stop worrying about it until the results come out, but I am constantly worried about the bar. At this point I've exhausted the patience of my relatives and friends by obsessing over the questions I got wrong, and hearing that failing would not be the end of the world and that I could retake the bar in February does not help.

I did what Barbri told me to do and did okay on the practice essays during the two months leading to the exam, and yet I panicked on the NY day and got many issues wrong. I forgot everything about NY distinctions (talked about common law licensee/invitee in the torts essay...), completely bombed the admin question which was actually a con law question, misread one of the contracts essay questions, bombed the administrator question in the intestacy essay, lost all logical sense regarding the secured transactions issue, forgot about NYCPR article 16...

I think I did okay on the MPT (although weirdly switched to "Mr. X" instead of "you" in the analysis section of my letter but I hope that won't hurt me too bad). I have no idea how well I did on the NY MPC--I thought it was hard, but it sounds like the feeling is shared. As to the MBE, I thought it was way harder than expected. The morning section left me on my knees and I ended up guessing on so many questions. And I also missed very easy and straightforward questions! I did pretty poorly on the Barbri midterm (104/200) but I was scoring slightly above average at the end of bar prep.

I'm mad at myself, for both being so anxious on exam day and forgetting everything I knew, but also for not being able to leave the exam behind me.

I just wanted to know if anyone else feels that way and if people who took the bar the previous years would have any words of advice. I have a job lined up at a big law firm and I am also worried that I won't be able to study for the February session while working long hours.

I think venting is important and I'm glad you're using the forum for that reason.

And while this falls right into the category of what you hate hearing I will say that the one thing that makes me feel better is having a plan for the worst case scenario. Once I have that plan and I become comfortable with it, it cuts down on my anxiety because in my mind I'm prepared for the absolute worst. Which in my case, is the truth.

Just remember, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar and he became POTUS, Hilary Clinton failed and she because SOS and unofficial ambassador for the pant suit.

Sorry if thats too cliche.

[shtolky]

It's completely normal to wonder if you passed during the time between taking the test and receiving the results. As it is out of your control now, just realize you (hopefully) did the best you could and in all likelihood, passed. I didn't know one person who felt great after the test. People feared the MBE was a terror, that certain issues were missed on essays, etc.

I took the July 2014 exam, and I, like many of my friends, had similar concerns, yet I passed seemingly with relative ease given the MBE score. The first essay question on Professional Responsibility I literally wrote an answer that was 100% incorrect. Another essay question mentioned LLCs and I had looked at LLCs from Barbri once. An entire family law essay, all parts, had only one question that was covered in Barbri. The NYMC section was a joke, I was confident on maybe 10 of the 50 questions. You tend to remember the bad parts, not the parts you probably destroyed. One or two kick ass essays can make up for almost any other mistake on that section.

The point being, everyone thinks they might fail because of a missed issue or question. Don't stress about MBE questions. You can miss tons and tons and still pass with flying colors. As far as the MPT, formatting is key there, don't sweat that one if your formatting was decent. Also, don't worry about February and your firm because you haven't gotten the results yet.

[NYKfanAIesq]

It's completely normal to wonder if you passed during the time between taking the test and receiving the results. As it is out of your control now, just realize you (hopefully) did the best you could and in all likelihood, passed. I didn't know one person who felt great after the test. People feared the MBE was a terror, that certain issues were missed on essays, etc.

I took the July 2014 exam, and I, like many of my friends, had similar concerns, yet I passed seemingly with relative ease given the MBE score. The first essay question on Professional Responsibility I literally wrote an answer that was 100% incorrect. Another essay question mentioned LLCs and I had looked at LLCs from Barbri once. An entire family law essay, all parts, had only one question that was covered in Barbri. The NYMC section was a joke, I was confident on maybe 10 of the 50 questions. You tend to remember the bad parts, not the parts you probably destroyed. One or two kick ass essays can make up for almost any other mistake on that section.

The point being, everyone thinks they might fail because of a missed issue or question. Don't stress about MBE questions. You can miss tons and tons and still pass with flying colors. As far as the MPT, formatting is key there, don't sweat that one if your formatting was decent. Also, don't worry about February and your firm because you haven't gotten the results yet.

^^^ like this answer.

[CanadianWolf]

Relax. You passed.

[derklink]

dalilah, if it helps you, think of my situation: I am a foreign lawyer from a civil law system country and english is not my native language. I had only 2 months to prepare for the Bar and took a shot. The MPT and essays went better than expected (if I am not totally delusional) but the MBE destroyed me. I am having trouble sleeping at night as the release date keeps getting closer. I drink too much and my skin is worse than it was during my age of puberty. Somebody recommended meditating to me, so I spontaneously decided to smoke a pork shoulder to give me something to do and to justify a couple of beers.

[rcharter1978]

dalilah, if it helps you, think of my situation: I am a foreign lawyer from a civil law system country and english is not my native language. I had only 2 months to prepare for the Bar and took a shot. The MPT and essays went better than expected (if I am not totally delusional) but the MBE destroyed me. I am having trouble sleeping at night as the release date keeps getting closer. I drink too much and my skin is worse than it was during my age of puberty. Somebody recommended meditating to me, so I spontaneously decided to smoke a pork shoulder to give me something to do and to justify a couple of beers.

That sounds about right.

[PJP]

I am still under the stress and anxiety wondering whether I will pass the bar or not. I'm already barred in one state but had to take the bar exam this past July for another state my wife and I are trying to move to. There is no reciprocity between the two so it sucks that I had to do this again after many years out of law school. I self-studied and worked hard just like how I did before and thought I prepared well for this exam. To my surprise, the MBE was completely different from before. Back then, the real MBE was more similar to all the prep questions. This time, it was vague, heavily nuanced, and all the things everyone talked about on this forum after the MBE was true. Not to mention I f**ked up on my essay because I had to hand write one of them due to my stupid computer issue. Hand writing really sucked. I missed a lot of important issues and my writing looked like sh*t. So I haven't been feeling good since the bar exam. Out of curiosity, I did look through 2014 July and 2015 Feb bar exam threads here and found that a big number of people who thought they definitely failed due to the difficulty of MBE passed and some did so comfortably. Also, NCBE no longer releases MBE raw scores since 2014 and coincidentally the MBE questions became more difficult last year. So there is a speculation that you can now miss more than you could have previously and still end up with a passing scaled score. National MBE median took a slight dip recently but I think this July MBE was a lot more difficult than the 3-4 point dip in the median. Five years ago, I knew I answered a good percentage of questions right on the MBE after leaving the exam. They were more obvious and similar to practice questions. This July, I think I was only certain about 20 questions I answered correctly out of the entire exam and the rest of it was just... wtf. Of course no one knows this theory is true and I might just be looking for a reason to help myself feel better. I will find out in three weeks.

[Triangular]

A comfort to cling on to which I wish I had realized post exam: you really can mess up a lot of stuff (or not realise that you screwed up a lot of points) and STILL pass. (I also scored a 90 on the Barbri midterm... and that was with only finishing 80% of the test during the alloted time and completing the remaining questions in my own time. Ouch.) The truth is, not-so-smart people pass this test all the time! (And as mentioned, lots of smart and successful people have failed it - you can't pin your identity to this stupid test).

While the jury is out, you still have every shot. You don't know what things other people messed up on. The curve will have made the same errors as you - and you'll be fine. In reality, often there is more than one valid way to answer a question, and the tricks on the MBE can also make it really ad hoc.

Think of how awful/silly you will feel when you DO pass and you wasted all this time and energy on stressing. Draw a line under it and go about life as if it didn't happen. Live!

I keep looking back and kick myself for the months of mental energy (and all the hair that fell out) wasted on post exam anxiety. My main regret is having squandered so much time believing I had failed and planning my life around what I thought was the inevitable, February retake. That's the extent that I went to not to jinx it in my mind and it was stupid and not worth it. Uhuh, I'm not the brightest crayon in the box. It is rotten how they make you wait so long for the results - but you have to focus on letting the time pass and finding distractions.

All this is easier said than done; I remember I read a lot of old threads on here and noticed a distinct trend of people passing regardless of mistakes.

I made a pact with myself and managed to get to October without going totally bananas/depressed with the waiting anxiety, and then I rewarded myself by allowing space for me to indulge and enjoy the stress a little those last few weeks of October. I guess it was cleansing. Then; bam, they released the results days early when I totally wasn't expecting it.

Hold tight and do your best, find a new addiction for the next few months, even if it's TLS.

[waxecstatic]

Some of the things I missed on the essays I simply never was able to memorize because I had two months and I am not Dustin Hoffman from Rain Man. I mean, honestly, I am a human being, I am not a genius, and I have limited time to think, and I have two months to memorize 8 MBE subjects along with about 5-7 other state subjects and I can only memorize so much. So I missed a state distinction that does not even have a federal counterpart. It's just a state law by itself. So sue me.

I do sometimes ask myself what having just an extra five minutes total on the essays would do for my score. Then I drink away such thoughts.

[sd5289]

Fellow July 2015 taker here. I felt "okay" after the NY day (I think part of that was because I'd guessed they were going to test Admin, so I studied it and reviewed my Admin outline that morning while drinking my morning coffee, so felt extremely relieved when I saw the essay prompt and questions). Also felt "okay" after the MBE.

I can say that I feel infinitely more uncertain now, and I think that's just because with the amount of time that's passed, I've forgotten a lot of questions and subsequently what my answers were to those questions. Your anxiety is normal, and as someone who felt like she "probably" passed and now feels like "I have no idea if I passed," try to remember that we all feel this way, so try not to let it eat you up too much. Not sure if you took a bar trip or some other kind of vacation afterward, but I highly suggest it if you haven't already. I somehow managed to completely forget about the bar for the 2 weeks I was away and it was fantastic. Probably had a positive impact on my mental health as well.

[nyny]

Fellow July 2015 taker here. I felt "okay" after the NY day (I think part of that was because I'd guessed they were going to test Admin, so I studied it and reviewed my Admin outline that morning while drinking my morning coffee, so felt extremely relieved when I saw the essay prompt and questions). Also felt "okay" after the MBE.

I can say that I feel infinitely more uncertain now, and I think that's just because with the amount of time that's passed, I've forgotten a lot of questions and subsequently what my answers were to those questions. Your anxiety is normal, and as someone who felt like she "probably" passed and now feels like "I have no idea if I passed," try to remember that we all feel this way, so try not to let it eat you up too much. Not sure if you took a bar trip or some other kind of vacation afterward, but I highly suggest it if you haven't already. I somehow managed to completely forget about the bar for the 2 weeks I was away and it was fantastic. Probably had a positive impact on my mental health as well.

I think that admin essay will make or break a lot of people on the NY Essay day. People either took it lightly or did not know what to expect because I'm not sure there has been an admin essay on the bar (yes I know they added the subject matter recently, but it could have been tested along with NY Civ in the past). Some people were lost and visibly upset at the admin essay!!! Not knowing the essentials on NY admin law kept you from correctly spotting half of the issues on essay 5. All in all, an average to stellar MBE can make up for a lot of mistakes on the NY day.

[sd5289]

Fellow July 2015 taker here. I felt "okay" after the NY day (I think part of that was because I'd guessed they were going to test Admin, so I studied it and reviewed my Admin outline that morning while drinking my morning coffee, so felt extremely relieved when I saw the essay prompt and questions). Also felt "okay" after the MBE.

I can say that I feel infinitely more uncertain now, and I think that's just because with the amount of time that's passed, I've forgotten a lot of questions and subsequently what my answers were to those questions. Your anxiety is normal, and as someone who felt like she "probably" passed and now feels like "I have no idea if I passed," try to remember that we all feel this way, so try not to let it eat you up too much. Not sure if you took a bar trip or some other kind of vacation afterward, but I highly suggest it if you haven't already. I somehow managed to completely forget about the bar for the 2 weeks I was away and it was fantastic. Probably had a positive impact on my mental health as well.

I think that admin essay will make or break a lot of people on the NY Essay day. People either took it lightly or did not know what to expect because I'm not sure there has been an admin essay on the bar (yes I know they added the subject matter recently, but it could have been tested along with NY Civ in the past). Some people were lost and visibly upset at the admin essay!!! Not knowing the essentials on NY admin law kept you from correctly spotting half of the issues on essay 5. All in all, an average to stellar MBE can make up for a lot of mistakes on the NY day.

Oh, no joke. I probably would've started crying if I didn't know any Admin and read that ridiculous prompt.

[trustmouse83]

Does anyone have any guesses as to how they might treat those of us who went down the Constitutional law analysis route in that question, rather than the admin side of things? I know i'm not the only one...

[gtz]

Does anyone have any guesses as to how they might treat those of us who went down the Constitutional law analysis route in that question, rather than the admin side of things? I know i'm not the only one...

I also did mostly con law but i wouldn't sweat it. I can only think of one subpart, question 3(a), could be totally wrong if you went all conlaw. My vague recollection on the other sub parts were: 1(SOL), 2 (clearly conlaw), 3(b) (FRE with admin) and 4 (Crim). So even if that subpart is completely wrong I felt pretty confident of my answers for the remainder of the question and answering those right should be enough to get a passing essay score.

Just remember we are only shooting to beat the bottom 17% of first time takers and if you are starting at a firm this fall you are most likely no where near the bottom 17%.

[sd5289]

In general, I think you're somewhat okay if you did straight Con Law as one of the more important areas of Admin is a Con Law analysis. There were a few subparts that were specific to Admin that weren't intuitive, but I think given the number of people who focused on Con Law, the scale on that particular question should be pretty generous.

[nyny]

Does anyone have any guesses as to how they might treat those of us who went down the Constitutional law analysis route in that question, rather than the admin side of things? I know i'm not the only one...

I also did mostly con law but i wouldn't sweat it. I can only think of one subpart, question 3(a), could be totally wrong if you went all conlaw. My vague recollection on the other sub parts were: 1(SOL), 2 (clearly conlaw), 3(b) (FRE with admin) and 4 (Crim). So even if that subpart is completely wrong I felt pretty confident of my answers for the remainder of the question and answering those right should be enough to get a passing essay score.

Just remember we are only shooting to beat the bottom 17% of first time takers and if you are starting at a firm this fall you are most likely no where near the bottom 17%.

Yes, that basically it. My comment was that if you was not familiar with NY admin you could have missed 1(SOL of article 78) and 3(b) (FRE with admin). Truth be told my essay 5 was kind of short if you ask me...

I hope we all pass this thing man, I would want nothing better!!

[trustmouse83]

Thanks for the heads up, guys.
Felling a little better now over here.

[Onetimebaby]

Anyone have NY bar outline books for rent or sell. I took UBE bar in July with Themis. I am not particular about the bar review that you may have to offer, but just looking for something published this year. I will post this in the various NY threads. Anyone interested please message me. Thanks.

[starryski]

some days i think i must have done pretty ok, other days im definitely sure i failed. right after the exam i was positive i failed. at work everyone tells me that they KNOW i passed. i don't know if im starting to believe it but some days i fell like maybe i did pass. but overall, i would bet money that i failed.

[robinhoodOO]

mod edit: do not discuss essay topics on TLS, thanks.

I thought we couldn't discuss MBE's and fact patterns. Most states have published, or will publish soon, the essays--unlike the MBE's.