Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2016 Forum

[salix]

I missed the very first question. It was a simple question - a simple, straightforward rule that I KNOW. But I doubted myself, and it fucked with my confidence for the rest of the test. I mean, if I can't confidently answer a question about the impact of intoxication on the formation of a contract, which I understand, how am I going to keep it together to try to remember the rules about something I'm learning in a vacuum just for this exam?

GRRRR and goddamn. I am mad at myself for this. But honestly, test anxiety is something I've struggled with all through law school. Shouldn't be surprised that it's still an issue. But I have got to lick this, because I want this to be the last law school exam I ever take.

[alicen]

I'm less than thrilled with my milestone 1 performance as well! I overthink things.

[+] Spoiler

ie the woman who aims the gun at her husband and sister. my first thought was correct, only assault against the sister b/c she didn't know it wasn't loaded, but then I think the woman had to go grab the gun, how does the husband know she didn't reload it? so then I picked the wrong answer.

And like another poster said, it was hard to concentrate for 45 questions. I do think being at the actual exam gives you an extra shot of panic/energy though!

[+] Spoiler

Yeah that question was crap, and I disagree with the bar examiners' explanation. I'd be fine with it if they included some fact that indicated that the husband KNEW 100% that it wasn't going to fire - like if he had removed the firing pin right before he went in to have sex with the sister. But instead, we have a giant time gap, and we're expected to assume that of course the husband knows the gun is still unloaded. Absolute crap. It's precisely th kind of question that, if you chose the "assault against only the sister" option, the examiners could easily turn around and say, "Well how did the husband KNOW it wasn't loaded?!"

[+] Spoiler

^ completely agree with your assessment. is there some sort of pattern with questions like this, i wonder? like, "in general, if a person takes an action, assume they're confident that the results of the action remain for a reasonable period of time," or something?

i HAVE to believe there are generalizations to make about the bar examiners' thoughts of what is reasonable care, what could cause reasonable apprehension, etc., or the MBE is going to wreck me.

[ultimolugar]

Copped a 51% on the Milestone exam. Ugh

Half of all my incorrect answers were in Contracts. Ugh, and half of those were formation questions. Formation is my most missed subject on the practice questions too.

ME TOO. LE SIGH. Not a bad showing on Torts or Property though, so positive spin?

[myrtlewinston]

Hello,
I have the Themis NY 2015 FROs. Does anyone know if the Civ Pro FRO has been significantly updated for the 2016 UBE? Thanks.

[Virindi]

I'm less than thrilled with my milestone 1 performance as well! I overthink things.

[+] Spoiler

ie the woman who aims the gun at her husband and sister. my first thought was correct, only assault against the sister b/c she didn't know it wasn't loaded, but then I think the woman had to go grab the gun, how does the husband know she didn't reload it? so then I picked the wrong answer.

And like another poster said, it was hard to concentrate for 45 questions. I do think being at the actual exam gives you an extra shot of panic/energy though!

[+] Spoiler

Yeah that question was crap, and I disagree with the bar examiners' explanation. I'd be fine with it if they included some fact that indicated that the husband KNEW 100% that it wasn't going to fire - like if he had removed the firing pin right before he went in to have sex with the sister. But instead, we have a giant time gap, and we're expected to assume that of course the husband knows the gun is still unloaded. Absolute crap. It's precisely th kind of question that, if you chose the "assault against only the sister" option, the examiners could easily turn around and say, "Well how did the husband KNOW it wasn't loaded?!"

[+] Spoiler

^ completely agree with your assessment. is there some sort of pattern with questions like this, i wonder? like, "in general, if a person takes an action, assume they're confident that the results of the action remain for a reasonable period of time," or something?

i HAVE to believe there are generalizations to make about the bar examiners' thoughts of what is reasonable care, what could cause reasonable apprehension, etc., or the MBE is going to wreck me.

[+] Spoiler

it's a dumb question. there's no facts that indicating that the husband remembers he emptied it out shooting at the squirrel that morning, and/or that the wife did not reload it.

[Nebby]

I'm less than thrilled with my milestone 1 performance as well! I overthink things.

[+] Spoiler

ie the woman who aims the gun at her husband and sister. my first thought was correct, only assault against the sister b/c she didn't know it wasn't loaded, but then I think the woman had to go grab the gun, how does the husband know she didn't reload it? so then I picked the wrong answer.

And like another poster said, it was hard to concentrate for 45 questions. I do think being at the actual exam gives you an extra shot of panic/energy though!

[+] Spoiler

Yeah that question was crap, and I disagree with the bar examiners' explanation. I'd be fine with it if they included some fact that indicated that the husband KNEW 100% that it wasn't going to fire - like if he had removed the firing pin right before he went in to have sex with the sister. But instead, we have a giant time gap, and we're expected to assume that of course the husband knows the gun is still unloaded. Absolute crap. It's precisely th kind of question that, if you chose the "assault against only the sister" option, the examiners could easily turn around and say, "Well how did the husband KNOW it wasn't loaded?!"

[+] Spoiler

^ completely agree with your assessment. is there some sort of pattern with questions like this, i wonder? like, "in general, if a person takes an action, assume they're confident that the results of the action remain for a reasonable period of time," or something?

i HAVE to believe there are generalizations to make about the bar examiners' thoughts of what is reasonable care, what could cause reasonable apprehension, etc., or the MBE is going to wreck me.

[+] Spoiler

it's a dumb question. there's no facts that indicating that the husband remembers he emptied it out shooting at the squirrel that morning, and/or that the wife did not reload it.

[+] Spoiler

I missed this question too. It was fucking stupid fact pattern.

[rambleon65]

I'm less than thrilled with my milestone 1 performance as well! I overthink things.

[+] Spoiler

ie the woman who aims the gun at her husband and sister. my first thought was correct, only assault against the sister b/c she didn't know it wasn't loaded, but then I think the woman had to go grab the gun, how does the husband know she didn't reload it? so then I picked the wrong answer.

And like another poster said, it was hard to concentrate for 45 questions. I do think being at the actual exam gives you an extra shot of panic/energy though!

[+] Spoiler

Yeah that question was crap, and I disagree with the bar examiners' explanation. I'd be fine with it if they included some fact that indicated that the husband KNEW 100% that it wasn't going to fire - like if he had removed the firing pin right before he went in to have sex with the sister. But instead, we have a giant time gap, and we're expected to assume that of course the husband knows the gun is still unloaded. Absolute crap. It's precisely th kind of question that, if you chose the "assault against only the sister" option, the examiners could easily turn around and say, "Well how did the husband KNOW it wasn't loaded?!"

[+] Spoiler

^ completely agree with your assessment. is there some sort of pattern with questions like this, i wonder? like, "in general, if a person takes an action, assume they're confident that the results of the action remain for a reasonable period of time," or something?

i HAVE to believe there are generalizations to make about the bar examiners' thoughts of what is reasonable care, what could cause reasonable apprehension, etc., or the MBE is going to wreck me.

[+] Spoiler

it's a dumb question. there's no facts that indicating that the husband remembers he emptied it out shooting at the squirrel that morning, and/or that the wife did not reload it.

[+] Spoiler

I missed this question too. It was fucking stupid fact pattern.

[+] Spoiler

I went back and forth between having the husband being successful or not but then went with not only because they used the words "shortly thereafter." It really was 50/50, but that was the ultimate reason i went with him not being successful. Definitely not the best question.

[blueapple]

Hello,
I have the Themis NY 2015 FROs. Does anyone know if the Civ Pro FRO has been significantly updated for the 2016 UBE? Thanks.

I'm guessing it's different because there's no NY law on the exam now

[Rahviveh]

I fell short on the milestone but I only used half the allotted time. Contracts was my worst section so I guess I better study that shit

[unidentifiable]

evidence is

[+] Spoiler

a bitch

[Easy-E]

property is

[+] Spoiler

<3

[FSK]

13/20 on first graded essay, which is OK b/c I got most of the BLL wrong.

[ultimolugar]

property is

[+] Spoiler

<3

Out and out lies.

[Easy-E]

This MPT outline seems like a fun read.

[ndp1234]

Does anyone else feel like the Crim Law & Procedure lady gets in twice the amoutn information in the 9 chapter segments than the other lecturers do in 20 chapters?

[luxxe]

Does anyone else feel like the Crim Law & Procedure lady gets in twice the amoutn information in the 9 chapter segments than the other lecturers do in 20 chapters?

For sure - but her lectures are also a lot longer than most others. I prefer the 20 12-15 minute lectures to her 9 28 minute ones.

Also appreciate her casually dropping that she argued a significant number of these cases in front of SCOTUS....

[Nebby]

My first graded essay was 12/24 and my second graded essay is 15/24. I do not like my grader. He deducts points when I don't include rules associated with a law even though those particular rules are not going to be applicable to the fact pattern. What is the fucking point of including "oh by the way, even though this isn't applicable, another aspect of this law is X, and I want you to know for your own personal fulfillment!"

Will I lose points on the actual bar essays if I don't include rule statements that are related to the general rule, but in the particular aspect have no applicability?

Only read below if you have taken the second graded essay concerning the second buyer of a house with a latent defect in the concrete foundation.

[+] Spoiler

Here is my first paragraph of my essay. The parts in red are my grader's recommended additions.

Whether the man is likely to prevail against the builder to recover the $80,000 depends on whether the jurisdiction recognizes a subsequent homeowner to bring a claim for breach of the implied warranty of fitness. The implied warranty of fitness is implied in a land sales contract for the purchase of a newly constructed residence. Under this warranty, the builders assert that they used adequate materials and good workmanship in the construction. Under this warranty, latent construction defects are covered and the buyer can bring a claim to recover the cost of repairing the house to correct a defect. Buyer has a duty to reasonably inspect the residence, but does not have to employ an expert. The majority of jurisdictions also allow subsequent purchasers who did not contract directly with the builder to recover these damages. A suit must be brought within a reasonable time upon discovery.

I don't understand the first addition. I state what the rule generally covers (latent defects), and I do not see the point in prefacing this with what the builder asserts unless the fact pattern did not indicate that the builder expressly disclaimed this warranty (it was a generally warranty deed so there was no warranty disclaimed!!!!).

The second addition I do not understand, because the fact pattern concerned a hidden defect that no inspection would have discovered anyway! And there was no fact to indicate that it was not inspected! What the fuck does the inspection requirement matter if it is not going to be applicable in this fact pattern.

I don't understand the final addition because the owner of the house immediately brought a suit upon discovery, therefore there's no fact to indicate any sort of unreasonable delay.

[BigZuck]

noob question-

Is there anywhere you can download PDFs or something of the outlines? I have them in a book, and I can access them online, but I'm looking for something that is more easily printable (or cut and pasteable)

[Chardee_MacDennis]

My first graded essay was 12/24 and my second graded essay is 15/24. I do not like my grader. He deducts points when I don't include rules associated with a law even though those particular rules are not going to be applicable to the fact pattern. What is the fucking point of including "oh by the way, even though this isn't applicable, another aspect of this law is X, and I want you to know for your own personal fulfillment!"

Will I lose points on the actual bar essays if I don't include rule statements that are related to the general rule, but in the particular aspect have no applicability?

Seems like it. My grader said I need to "show my work" w/r/t the entire rule even if my analysis assumes that part of the rule isn't really at issue.

[Nebby]

noob question-

Is there anywhere you can download PDFs or something of the outlines? I have them in a book, and I can access them online, but I'm looking for something that is more easily printable (or cut and pasteable)

Can probably just message Themis through the messaging portal

[ndp1234]

noob question-

Is there anywhere you can download PDFs or something of the outlines? I have them in a book, and I can access them online, but I'm looking for something that is more easily printable (or cut and pasteable)

This may be annoying, but you can go into outlines under Flex Study and Copy and paste it into word / save as PDF.

[BigZuck]

noob question-

Is there anywhere you can download PDFs or something of the outlines? I have them in a book, and I can access them online, but I'm looking for something that is more easily printable (or cut and pasteable)

This may be annoying, but you can go into outlines under Flex Study and Copy and paste it into word / save as PDF.

Yeah, the formatting is all messed up when I cut and paste from that though

It's weird to me that there isn't an easy way to just download every outline as either a PDF or word document. They want us to make our own outlines/attack outlines but they expect us to retype or reformat everything they offer us? Lol, come on Themis

[just_me]

noob question-

Is there anywhere you can download PDFs or something of the outlines? I have them in a book, and I can access them online, but I'm looking for something that is more easily printable (or cut and pasteable)

On a Mac you can go to File > Export as PDF, not sure if that's the same on Windows

[Easy-E]

1) How far along are you guys, in terms of overall progress %?

2) Can someone explain the suggested pace again?

[myrtlewinston]

Hello,
I have the Themis NY 2015 FROs. Does anyone know if the Civ Pro FRO has been significantly updated for the 2016 UBE? Thanks.

I'm guessing it's different because there's no NY law on the exam now

There were amendments to the FRCP in 2015.