Texas Bar Exam July 2014 Forum

[ebo]

Question- how does that equipercentile method that they use to scale MPT, P&E and essays work exactly?

I know they take scaled MBE scores and align them with raw scores for the others to get a conversion score. I'm thinking that if MBE scores are down this year, that could scale down the other sections as well, which would be no bueno. I have no idea what I'm talking about, though.

[TxBarTaker09]

Texas Bar is 10% MPT, 10% P&E, 40% MBE, 40% Essays, these sections are all independently scored and added together, if you get 675 you pass. Technically, everyone who takes the Texas Bar could pass, but that never happens, haha. You're essentially trying to get a 135 across the board on each section.

[OklahomasOK]

Texas Bar is 10% MPT, 10% P&E, 40% MBE, 40% Essays, these sections are all independently scored and added together, if you get 675 you pass. Technically, everyone who takes the Texas Bar could pass, but that never happens, haha. You're essentially trying to get a 135 across the board on each section.

So you're saying everyone could fail too?

[Leira7905]

Texas Bar is 10% MPT, 10% P&E, 40% MBE, 40% Essays, these sections are all independently scored and added together, if you get 675 you pass. Technically, everyone who takes the Texas Bar could pass, but that never happens, haha. You're essentially trying to get a 135 across the board on each section.

I think the other sections are scaled to the same curve as the MBE though. So a smaller number of people "passing" the MBE would mean a smaller number of people "passing" the other portions, and the exam overall. At least that's the way I understand it.

[ebo]

Texas Bar is 10% MPT, 10% P&E, 40% MBE, 40% Essays, these sections are all independently scored and added together, if you get 675 you pass. Technically, everyone who takes the Texas Bar could pass, but that never happens, haha. You're essentially trying to get a 135 across the board on each section.

Right, I was talking about how they scale the raw MPT, P&E, and essay scores to get a scaled score.

From this website: http://www.legaled.com/texasscoring.htm

EQUIPERCENTILE METHOD OF SCALING SCORES
The TBE is scaled using the equipercentile method. This method of scaling is accomplished by rank-ordering (high to low) the raw scores on the P&E, MPT, and Essay segments next to a high-to-low rank-ordering of the MBE scaled scores. For example, in rank-ordering the MPT scores, the highest MPT raw score is aligned with the highest MBE scaled score. Each MPT raw score is converted to a scaled score equal to the MBE scaled score with which it is aligned. When a “tie” of raw scores occurs, all are assigned an average of the corresponding MBE scaled scores. The process of rank ordering is repeated with the raw scores of the P&E and the Essay segments.


My thinking is, if MBE scores are down this year, this could also negatively affect the scale of the essays, P&E, and MPT.

[TxBarTaker09]

Hmm, I have no idea.

[akili]

Texas Bar is 10% MPT, 10% P&E, 40% MBE, 40% Essays, these sections are all independently scored and added together, if you get 675 you pass. Technically, everyone who takes the Texas Bar could pass, but that never happens, haha. You're essentially trying to get a 135 across the board on each section.

Right, I was talking about how they scale the raw MPT, P&E, and essay scores to get a scaled score.

From this website: http://www.legaled.com/texasscoring.htm

EQUIPERCENTILE METHOD OF SCALING SCORES
The TBE is scaled using the equipercentile method. This method of scaling is accomplished by rank-ordering (high to low) the raw scores on the P&E, MPT, and Essay segments next to a high-to-low rank-ordering of the MBE scaled scores. For example, in rank-ordering the MPT scores, the highest MPT raw score is aligned with the highest MBE scaled score. Each MPT raw score is converted to a scaled score equal to the MBE scaled score with which it is aligned. When a “tie” of raw scores occurs, all are assigned an average of the corresponding MBE scaled scores. The process of rank ordering is repeated with the raw scores of the P&E and the Essay segments.


My thinking is, if MBE scores are down this year, this could also negatively affect the scale of the essays, P&E, and MPT.

Interesting! Do other states do this too? Because it would explain why pass rates seem to be down nationwide.

I won't be surprised if the pass rate drops a bit this year in TX. Last July's 85% first-time taker rate was pretty high, I believe.

[Leira7905]

Interesting! Do other states do this too? Because it would explain why pass rates seem to be down nationwide.

I won't be surprised if the pass rate drops a bit this year in TX. Last July's 85% first-time taker rate was pretty high, I believe.

Yes, other states do this, and it is one of the theories some are spewing as to why pass rates are down overall.

[arkhamhorror]

That method of scaling is extremely unfortunate.

[ebo]

That method of scaling is extremely unfortunate.

Well, it's unfortunate in a year when the average MBE score appears to be down several points nationwide -- since those several points may in fact carry over to negatively impact your P&E, MPT, and essay scores as well.

It's supposed to ensure that all sections are scaled equally, I think. It just sucks that we got a really crappy MBE this time around

[ebo]

What really sucks is that it fails to account for how much raw MBE scores were curved to get their scaled scores. And since the NCBE mysteriously decided to not release raw MBE scores this year, I'd have to think it was more than in previous years

[logdog]

But if you scored above average on the other sections, then really it shouldn't be that big of a deal, right? (Really banking on my P&E, MPT, and essays)

[arkhamhorror]

Yep. Glad I didn't know about that beforehand, would have been worrying a lot more over the past several months.

I'm past the point of caring at this point. I'll just take it again. Maybe for once all my blind guesses will turn out to be right.

[ebo]

But if you scored above average on the other sections, then really it shouldn't be that big of a deal, right? (Really banking on my P&E, MPT, and essays)

Not sure, but I think even if you scored above average on the other parts your scaled score on those parts might not go as high as it may have in previous years since MBE scaled scores are down pretty much across the board

[TxBarTaker09]

I'll put it this way, my first test I scored in the top 3% of the state on the MPT, top 13% the second time. I failed both times because my MBE scores were 115 and 120.

[logdog]

I'll put it this way, my first test I scored in the top 3% of the state on the MPT, top 13% the second time. I failed both times because my MBE scores were 115 and 120.

Dang, that is not encouraging.

[akili]

I'll put it this way, my first test I scored in the top 3% of the state on the MPT, top 13% the second time. I failed both times because my MBE scores were 115 and 120.

Dang, that is not encouraging.

Well the MPT is only worth 10% of your score, so max 100 points, correct?

[ebo]

What did top 3% and top 13% in the state scale to as a score?

[txadv11]

I'll put it this way, my first test I scored in the top 3% of the state on the MPT, top 13% the second time. I failed both times because my MBE scores were 115 and 120.

How were your essay scores?

[TxBarTaker09]

Correct, my first time it was a 180, so max it could count as 100 towards your total score. My point is that the MPT might be good for helping you bridge the gap if you're fairly close, but without at least a solid score on the MBE, perhaps a 130, it makes it much more difficult to pass.

[TxBarTaker09]

I don't remember my first scores, second time I think 145.

[ebo]

I don't remember my first scores, second time I think 145.

If top 13% in the state on MPT only netted you a 145/200, that seems low. I believe the average score on essays for Texas takers is somewhere around 143 IIRC

[Leira7905]

I don't remember my first scores, second time I think 145.

Really? That sounds discouraging...

145 * 2 = 290; 120 * 2 = 240 = 530

You would have only needed 145 combined on the MPT and P&E to pass.... Or am I doing it wrong?

[arkhamhorror]

I don't remember my first scores, second time I think 145.

Really? That sounds discouraging...

145 * 2 = 290; 120 * 2 = 240 = 530

You would have only needed 145 combined on the MPT and P&E to pass.... Or am I doing it wrong?

That's still an average of 72.5 each though. And even if you do well on the MPT, if you drop the ball on P&E you could easily miss the mark by a few points.

[Leira7905]

I don't remember my first scores, second time I think 145.

Really? That sounds discouraging...

145 * 2 = 290; 120 * 2 = 240 = 530

You would have only needed 145 combined on the MPT and P&E to pass.... Or am I doing it wrong?

That's still an average of 72.5 each though. And even if you do well on the MPT, if you drop the ball on P&E you could easily miss the mark by a few points.

Just when I was starting to convince myself I passed..... Now the dread sets in once again. I wish they would hurry up post those results. Tired of this emotional roller coaster.