Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2014 Exam Forum

[Tanicius]

so under select circumstances, police records can be either a business record or public record?

also, how are you guys memorizing the rules for the essays? did you guys make your own outlines or are you memorizing off of the summary outlines?

The select circumstances really don't exist. A police report may be used for non-hearsay purposes, like impeaching a witness, or if you're suing the police department and using police records to show an admission of negligent police conduct, but that's pretty much it. But you won't be getting it in for the truth of the matter asserted because of the truthfulness concern unless it was a pre-investigatory report, like a 911 call log.

[FlanAl]

I know this was talked about, but I cant find a specific answer to my question.

How long should I expect to sink into watching the explanation videos from the simulated MBE

Took me about a day. There are about 4 or 5 20 minute videos for each subject. I found it really helpful but it might be better to just use your time reviewing the ones you got wrong. Personally i thought it was a good way to force myself to review the ones I got right, no matter how hard I try I usually have a problem doing this.

[ABB]

Hi everyone, I've been reading this threat since May but haven't posted anything yet. Can someone please explain to me why B isn't the right answer? I thought risk of loss remained with the seller for FOB contracts until the buyer received the goods...Is there such a thing as an "FOB Shipment contract"? (I chose B)

"In a written contract, a craftsman agreed to deliver to a buyer 500 described chairs at $20 each F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business. The contract provided that "neither party will assign this contract without the written consent of the other." The craftsman placed the chairs onboard a carrier on January 30 and properly notified the buyer of the shipment. On February 1 the craftsman said in a signed writing, "I hereby assign to [a friend] all my rights under the [craftsman-buyer] contract." The craftsman did not request and did not get the buyer's consent to this transaction. On February 2 the chairs, while in transit, were destroyed in a derailment of the carrier's railroad car.

In an action by the buyer against the craftsman for breach of contract, the buyer probably will
A. succeed, because the carrier will be deemed to be the craftsman's agent.
B. succeed, because the risk of loss was on the craftsman.
C. not succeed, because of impracticability of performance.
D. not succeed, because the risk of loss was on the buyer.
Incorrect: Answer choice D is correct. The buyer's suit for breach will be unsuccessful, not because of assignment, but because of lack of tender. Answer choice B is incorrect because, under the UCC, an F.O.B. shipment contract provision like this one, (i.e., which specifies "F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business"), shifts the risk of loss to the buyer the moment the seller gives the goods to the carrier.

[jigglypuffdreams]

Hi everyone, I've been reading this threat since May but haven't posted anything yet. Can someone please explain to me why B isn't the right answer? I thought risk of loss remained with the seller for FOB contracts until the buyer received the goods...Is there such a thing as an "FOB Shipment contract"? (I chose B)

"In a written contract, a craftsman agreed to deliver to a buyer 500 described chairs at $20 each F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business. The contract provided that "neither party will assign this contract without the written consent of the other." The craftsman placed the chairs onboard a carrier on January 30 and properly notified the buyer of the shipment. On February 1 the craftsman said in a signed writing, "I hereby assign to [a friend] all my rights under the [craftsman-buyer] contract." The craftsman did not request and did not get the buyer's consent to this transaction. On February 2 the chairs, while in transit, were destroyed in a derailment of the carrier's railroad car.

In an action by the buyer against the craftsman for breach of contract, the buyer probably will
A. succeed, because the carrier will be deemed to be the craftsman's agent.
B. succeed, because the risk of loss was on the craftsman.
C. not succeed, because of impracticability of performance.
D. not succeed, because the risk of loss was on the buyer.
Incorrect: Answer choice D is correct. The buyer's suit for breach will be unsuccessful, not because of assignment, but because of lack of tender. Answer choice B is incorrect because, under the UCC, an F.O.B. shipment contract provision like this one, (i.e., which specifies "F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business"), shifts the risk of loss to the buyer the moment the seller gives the goods to the carrier.

The way my sales and leases professor described it is to not worry about the shipment terms as much as where the contract says it's going to be delivered. Since it says "FOB Seller's place of business" that basically just means the seller has to get it to the seller's place of business and that's it, from then on it's the buyer's fault. If it said "FOB Buyer's place of business" it means it has to be delivered all the way to the buyer's place of business and the risk of loss would be on the seller. But they only contracted for it to get to the seller's place of business, so that's the place of tender.

[drs36]

Hi everyone, I've been reading this threat since May but haven't posted anything yet. Can someone please explain to me why B isn't the right answer? I thought risk of loss remained with the seller for FOB contracts until the buyer received the goods...Is there such a thing as an "FOB Shipment contract"? (I chose B)

"In a written contract, a craftsman agreed to deliver to a buyer 500 described chairs at $20 each F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business. The contract provided that "neither party will assign this contract without the written consent of the other." The craftsman placed the chairs onboard a carrier on January 30 and properly notified the buyer of the shipment. On February 1 the craftsman said in a signed writing, "I hereby assign to [a friend] all my rights under the [craftsman-buyer] contract." The craftsman did not request and did not get the buyer's consent to this transaction. On February 2 the chairs, while in transit, were destroyed in a derailment of the carrier's railroad car.

In an action by the buyer against the craftsman for breach of contract, the buyer probably will
A. succeed, because the carrier will be deemed to be the craftsman's agent.
B. succeed, because the risk of loss was on the craftsman.
C. not succeed, because of impracticability of performance.
D. not succeed, because the risk of loss was on the buyer.
Incorrect: Answer choice D is correct. The buyer's suit for breach will be unsuccessful, not because of assignment, but because of lack of tender. Answer choice B is incorrect because, under the UCC, an F.O.B. shipment contract provision like this one, (i.e., which specifies "F.O.B. the craftsman's place of business"), shifts the risk of loss to the buyer the moment the seller gives the goods to the carrier.

The way my sales and leases professor described it is to not worry about the shipment terms as much as where the contract says it's going to be delivered. Since it says "FOB Seller's place of business" that basically just means the seller has to get it to the seller's place of business and that's it, from then on it's the buyer's fault. If it said "FOB Buyer's place of business" it means it has to be delivered all the way to the buyer's place of business and the risk of loss would be on the seller. But they only contracted for it to get to the seller's place of business, so that's the place of tender.

Exactly what jigglypuff said. FOB Buyer's place = risk on seller. FOB seller's place = risk on buyer

[ABB]

Thank you! Makes perfect sense.

[bport hopeful]

I know this was talked about, but I cant find a specific answer to my question.

How long should I expect to sink into watching the explanation videos from the simulated MBE

Took me about a day. There are about 4 or 5 20 minute videos for each subject. I found it really helpful but it might be better to just use your time reviewing the ones you got wrong. Personally i thought it was a good way to force myself to review the ones I got right, no matter how hard I try I usually have a problem doing this.

Thank you for the answer. I dont think I can justify that.

[Apple Tree]

I'm pretty sure there's gonna be a contract essay on the CA test. I might fail because of it. I just did a Themis practice essay and I just want to cry...

[094320]

..

[jd20132013]

Can you post the link to the California conversion scale?

[TooManyLoans]

Can you post the link to the California conversion scale?

https://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Portal ... 201107.pdf

There is a newer one I believe, can't find it though.

[Kiwi917]

I know this was talked about, but I cant find a specific answer to my question.

How long should I expect to sink into watching the explanation videos from the simulated MBE

Took me about a day. There are about 4 or 5 20 minute videos for each subject. I found it really helpful but it might be better to just use your time reviewing the ones you got wrong. Personally i thought it was a good way to force myself to review the ones I got right, no matter how hard I try I usually have a problem doing this.

You could also just watch the 5-minute intro part of each subject, where he outlines some general tips and tricks, and then review the individual questions using the packet at your own pace. Some of his suggestions are too generic to be useful ("read the question carefully" sort of stuff), but I picked up a few little things here and there, especially about how to avoid the tempting distraction answers. The other thing is that since he takes the questions in order, you can skip past the stuff you already understand, or go back and pinpoint the discussion of any questions you still don't get after reading the explanations. I think it was a waste of time to listen to the whole thing, and if I could do it again, I'd skip over certain parts.

[Kiwi917]

Can you post the link to the California conversion scale?

https://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Portal ... 201107.pdf

There is a newer one I believe, can't find it though.

Here is the one from July 2013. The info sheet from this February doesn't have a table in it, so I think July is the most recent one out there.

http://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Portals ... 201307.pdf

[jumpingjack]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

[DavidB]

Sorry if this topic has been previously discussed.

Can we make any assumptions from the the displayed MBE national averages?

A straight average of all subjects is approximately 64%. Can we assume that a performance near the Themis national average should correlate with a median score on the actual MBE?

[jigglypuffdreams]

Sorry if this topic has been previously discussed.

Can we make any assumptions from the the displayed MBE national averages?

A straight average of all subjects is approximately 64%. Can we assume that a performance near the Themis national average should correlate with a median score on the actual MBE?

I don't think it would necessarily, my Themis state director sends the occasional email out to people taking it in my state and on the CC list I only see 63 people or so. Even in February of last year 722 people took the bar exam in Michigan. Not to mention that Themis isn't available in all jurisdictions.

[lawyerwannabe]

Two embarrassing questions:

Does equity matter (there was not lecture or short online provided)? And what larger topic is commercial paper included within? Thanks!

[iLoveFruits&Veggies]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

75% of the MBE questions on Themis are actually NCBE licensed MBE questions, and Themis creates about 25% themselves, but I don't know which ones are which. However, I've been doing NCBE MBE exams that have been released on Adaptibar (exams from 2013, 2011 & 2008) and to me they seem pretty short, with the exception of a few really long Real Property ones. Sometimes I just give up on them because they're so crazy long and complicated - but on the "real" thing, I'll try to stick em' out. I have no trouble finishing within the allotted time, if that's what you're concerned about. I usually have about a half hour left over...

And now back to the essays... my doom and gloom

[TooManyLoans]

Sorry if this topic has been previously discussed.

Can we make any assumptions from the the displayed MBE national averages?

A straight average of all subjects is approximately 64%. Can we assume that a performance near the Themis national average should correlate with a median score on the actual MBE?

I don't think it would necessarily, my Themis state director sends the occasional email out to people taking it in my state and on the CC list I only see 63 people or so. Even in February of last year 722 people took the bar exam in Michigan. Not to mention that Themis isn't available in all jurisdictions.

I don't think it would be a bad assumption. Yea, its def. not a representative sample of everyone who takes the bar, but if anything it would be over-inclusive of those better prepared.

Edit: I forgot to account that those averages would be lower, given our first MBE sets are pulling that average down. Now that we finished all the lectures and have done more practice questions our means should be much higher. Anyway, below is a better way to predict the Mean score.

You can find the average MBE mean for a given exam on PA Bar Exam statistics. Since I posted the July 2011 MBE Conversion chart earlier, I'll use the July 2011 Mean MBE score which was 143.8. That's a 126/190 which is 66%.

Also, here are some more helpful statistics. http://www.ncbex.org/assets/media_files ... istics.pdf

[Kiwi917]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

The NCBE info packet about the MBE has a short set of sample questions: --LinkRemoved-- Who knows if these are truly representative of the 200 we'll get, but the question length seems roughly on par with what Themis is giving us. Maybe a little shorter on average, but #10 and #17 show that they do have some really long ones thrown in.

Has anyone purchased any of the 4 practice exams from NCBE? I'm sort of tempted to get one just to compare. Probably says more about how much I hate CA essays, that I would rather do a few hundred extra MBEs than study the stuff I should really be focusing on...

[iLoveFruits&Veggies]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

The NCBE info packet about the MBE has a short set of sample questions: --LinkRemoved-- Who knows if these are truly representative of the 200 we'll get, but the question length seems roughly on par with what Themis is giving us. Maybe a little shorter on average, but #10 and #17 show that they do have some really long ones thrown in.

Has anyone purchased any of the 4 practice exams from NCBE? I'm sort of tempted to get one just to compare. Probably says more about how much I hate CA essays, that I would rather do a few hundred extra MBEs than study the stuff I should really be focusing on...

I didn't buy them directly from the NCBE, but I did them on Adaptibar, and they're the same. Super useful, although at this point, I don't know if it would be worth it to spend so much money on adaptibar. Buying them straight from the NCBE might be cheaper. Not sure how much they are... And I'm like you... always happy to do MBE questions instead of essays! Any day!

[Kiwi917]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

The NCBE info packet about the MBE has a short set of sample questions: --LinkRemoved-- Who knows if these are truly representative of the 200 we'll get, but the question length seems roughly on par with what Themis is giving us. Maybe a little shorter on average, but #10 and #17 show that they do have some really long ones thrown in.

Has anyone purchased any of the 4 practice exams from NCBE? I'm sort of tempted to get one just to compare. Probably says more about how much I hate CA essays, that I would rather do a few hundred extra MBEs than study the stuff I should really be focusing on...

I didn't buy them directly from the NCBE, but I did them on Adaptibar, and they're the same. Super useful, although at this point, I don't know if it would be worth it to spend so much money on adaptibar. Buying them straight from the NCBE might be cheaper. Not sure how much they are... And I'm like you... always happy to do MBE questions instead of essays! Any day!

They're $50 for each set of 100, 4 sets available. I looked at Adaptibar but couldn't justify spending $400, but obviously it's a better deal overall since you get 1,500 questions. I'm doing well enough on the Themis mixed sets that I really shouldn't bother. We'll see, if I run out of Themis questions early, I might buy a set of 100.

It's hard to know what to even focus on for MBE at this point. All of my scores are pretty similar across the subjects, with contracts being a few percent lower, but I believe Duffy's advice that it will be hard to make any gains there and probably not worth the time. I guess maybe stamina and timing are what I should be practicing at this point.

[jigglypuffdreams]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

The NCBE info packet about the MBE has a short set of sample questions: --LinkRemoved-- Who knows if these are truly representative of the 200 we'll get, but the question length seems roughly on par with what Themis is giving us. Maybe a little shorter on average, but #10 and #17 show that they do have some really long ones thrown in.

Has anyone purchased any of the 4 practice exams from NCBE? I'm sort of tempted to get one just to compare. Probably says more about how much I hate CA essays, that I would rather do a few hundred extra MBEs than study the stuff I should really be focusing on...

I didn't buy them directly from the NCBE, but I did them on Adaptibar, and they're the same. Super useful, although at this point, I don't know if it would be worth it to spend so much money on adaptibar. Buying them straight from the NCBE might be cheaper. Not sure how much they are... And I'm like you... always happy to do MBE questions instead of essays! Any day!

They're $50 for each set of 100, 4 sets available. I looked at Adaptibar but couldn't justify spending $400, but obviously it's a better deal overall since you get 1,500 questions. I'm doing well enough on the Themis mixed sets that I really shouldn't bother. We'll see, if I run out of Themis questions early, I might buy a set of 100.

It's hard to know what to even focus on for MBE at this point. All of my scores are pretty similar across the subjects, with contracts being a few percent lower, but I believe Duffy's advice that it will be hard to make any gains there and probably not worth the time. I guess maybe stamina and timing are what I should be practicing at this point.

If you want a lot of raw cheap NCBE questions and happen to have an ios device, Barmax's MBE bank is only $99. I bought it recently and I feel like I'm getting a good bang for my buck.

[iLoveFruits&Veggies]

I know most of us here haven't taken the bar before, but does anyone have a clue on how long the MBE questions will be on the bar compared to the practice questions? The Themis questions seem to be anywhere from a few sentences to 2 or 3 paragraphs.

The NCBE info packet about the MBE has a short set of sample questions: --LinkRemoved-- Who knows if these are truly representative of the 200 we'll get, but the question length seems roughly on par with what Themis is giving us. Maybe a little shorter on average, but #10 and #17 show that they do have some really long ones thrown in.

Has anyone purchased any of the 4 practice exams from NCBE? I'm sort of tempted to get one just to compare. Probably says more about how much I hate CA essays, that I would rather do a few hundred extra MBEs than study the stuff I should really be focusing on...

I didn't buy them directly from the NCBE, but I did them on Adaptibar, and they're the same. Super useful, although at this point, I don't know if it would be worth it to spend so much money on adaptibar. Buying them straight from the NCBE might be cheaper. Not sure how much they are... And I'm like you... always happy to do MBE questions instead of essays! Any day!

They're $50 for each set of 100, 4 sets available. I looked at Adaptibar but couldn't justify spending $400, but obviously it's a better deal overall since you get 1,500 questions. I'm doing well enough on the Themis mixed sets that I really shouldn't bother. We'll see, if I run out of Themis questions early, I might buy a set of 100.

It's hard to know what to even focus on for MBE at this point. All of my scores are pretty similar across the subjects, with contracts being a few percent lower, but I believe Duffy's advice that it will be hard to make any gains there and probably not worth the time. I guess maybe stamina and timing are what I should be practicing at this point.

I trust Duffy.. I think he used to be at Barbri... he has tons of experience

[Kiwi917]

If you want a lot of raw cheap NCBE questions and happen to have an ios device, Barmax's MBE bank is only $99. I bought it recently and I feel like I'm getting a good bang for my buck.

Thanks! That seems like a good compromise between the NCBE website and Adaptibar. I don't need a huge set, since I just want to get an idea of whether my scores are roughly comparable on 100% real questions. I'm also starting to get more repeat questions from Themis and am worried that might be skewing my results a little.