February 2016 California Bar Exam Forum

[Zaizei]

WOW. I just realized that the MBEs and essays go by slightly different variations of the elements on the same rules. no wonder i have been having trouble passing this thing I thought that the law was the same in the essays and mbes.

What are you talking about? The rules are exactly the same, or am I missing something as well?

There are some subjects in the essay portion of the exam that have federal and California law (and you have to apply one or the other depending on the facts). In the MBE there's only federal law (and sometimes you need to know when to apply the majority and minority views of the law). Guess that's the difference? LOL

[FinallyPassedTheBar]

I just realized my comment has caused a huge uproar so I should explain myself.

I noticed an mbe explanation (from a real question from the NBCE) said "an easment by implication arises from 1- necessity OR 2- previous use by a common owner."

i also read a model essay answer written by former CA bar graders that said:
easment by implication
"where 1- an easment was previously used on the servient estate by an earlier owner, the court may find the parties intended the easment to continue if 2- prior use was continuous, apparent (open and obvious), and 3- reasonably necessary to the dominant land's use and enjoyment.

here, bla bla bla. thus, bla bla bla."

so... you do the math.

Hmmm...I don't think the two explanations conflict with one another. If anything, the essay explanation looks more detailed. It is the numbering system that the essay explanation uses that might be throwing you off imho. The part I highlighted red above should not be numbered imho. Rather, the numbering should start after the red highlight...thereby matching more closely to the MBE explanation.

[InTheWideLand I Walk]

I just realized my comment has caused a huge uproar so I should explain myself.

I noticed an mbe explanation (from a real question from the NBCE) said "an easment by implication arises from 1- necessity OR 2- previous use by a common owner."

i also read a model essay answer written by former CA bar graders that said:
easment by implication
"where 1- an easment was previously used on the servient estate by an earlier owner, the court may find the parties intended the easment to continue if 2- prior use was continuous, apparent (open and obvious), and 3- reasonably necessary to the dominant land's use and enjoyment.

here, bla bla bla. thus, bla bla bla."

so... you do the math.

Hmmm...I don't think the two explanations conflict with one another. If anything, the essay explanation looks more detailed. It is the numbering system that the essay explanation uses that might be throwing you off imho. The part I highlighted red above should not be numbered imho. Rather, the numbering should start after the red highlight...thereby matching more closely to the MBE explanation.

there seems to be a philosophical split on the internet as to whether an implied easement includes easements by necessity, or whether the implied easement is a separate type of easement from necessity. It seems as though the MBE has taken the position that necessity is a sub-type of implied easements, while the essay has taken the latter position.

[BrokenMouse]

I just realized my comment has caused a huge uproar so I should explain myself.

I noticed an mbe explanation (from a real question from the NBCE) said "an easment by implication arises from 1- necessity OR 2- previous use by a common owner."

i also read a model essay answer written by former CA bar graders that said:
easment by implication
"where 1- an easment was previously used on the servient estate by an earlier owner, the court may find the parties intended the easment to continue if 2- prior use was continuous, apparent (open and obvious), and 3- reasonably necessary to the dominant land's use and enjoyment.

here, bla bla bla. thus, bla bla bla."

so... you do the math.

Hmmm...I don't think the two explanations conflict with one another. If anything, the essay explanation looks more detailed. It is the numbering system that the essay explanation uses that might be throwing you off imho. The part I highlighted red above should not be numbered imho. Rather, the numbering should start after the red highlight...thereby matching more closely to the MBE explanation.

there seems to be a philosophical split on the internet as to whether an implied easement includes easements by necessity, or whether the implied easement is a separate type of easement from necessity. It seems as though the MBE has taken the position that necessity is a sub-type of implied easements, while the essay has taken the latter position.

1) No the MBE rule isn't "different" from essay rules. There are state vs federal distinctions but this one is not it
2) There are generally 4 ways to establish easement. 1) prescription 2) implication 3) necessity 4) grant... there is no philosophical split. Easement by implication and necessity have very distinct definitions.

Seriously though, if the same issue had different rules for MBE and Essay other than state/federal distinctions then I quit but I don't think this is the case.

[a male human]

My input on rule statement on the MBE vs. essay. I am of the opinion that a rule statement is NOT an exact template that you must regurgitate for full points on the essays. There is no one right way to say it.

Understanding the concepts is one effective way I found for "memorization" of the law.

As long as you convey the right concept—which often includes the right elements of a rule but not necessarily numbered lists like formulaic black-letter law—it should not affect the application of the rule statement embodying the concept.

That is one reason why I advocate for understanding the rules rather than solely rote memorizing them. Just because you know a physics formula does not mean you can apply it!!! You're not a bio or psych sorority girl who merely needs to memorize and know in theory to regurgitate back at the grader.

1. Know and understand the issues
2. Know and understand how to raise the issues (you don't just throw in a bunch of issues in nonsensical order)
3. Know and understand the rules (which often involves a lot of memorizing but NOT the other way around)

You can probably get by knowing like 80% of the issues and rules and still wing it and hope for some ancient piece of memory to unconsciously carry you through.

However, you can become enlightened through practice. Practice will help you achieve all three of the above. (Use model answers or sample answers or a BarEssays subscription to compare to real answers that are below and above (and if possible, at) a score of 65 (PM me for $20 off).) Even if you don't know the law yet. You probably won't know all the law anyway. You'll forget or panic or have never seen it in your life (like the one paragraph in the CMB about variance that was a significant issue in 2014...wtf?).

On actual bar day, you may be able to recite the rule perfectly. You might have to modify it a bit depending on what the facts focus on. You might have to make it up. Most likely it won't be exactly the way you've read it in your outline.

So should you study the MBE law or the sample essay? Neither and both: There's no need to worry about which "version" of the law is right, as long as it's in the same jurisdiction (general MBE law may differ from CA-oriented law).

Learn and read outlines if you want. Just don't stop practicing. Creep on that shit like a poorly raised man trying to escalate kino and never stop ogling and fiddling with essays.

[Zaizei]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

[BrokenMouse]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

Other locations are probably full. Id think Feb exam isnt as crowded but i may be wrong.

[Zaizei]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

Other locations are probably full. Id think Feb exam isnt as crowded but i may be wrong.

I had to choose those two and one that was marked as writting only. Hopefully they'll give me the first or second choice. If not, I'm screwed!

[rcharter1978]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

Other locations are probably full. Id think Feb exam isnt as crowded but i may be wrong.

I had to choose those two and one that was marked as writting only. Hopefully they'll give me the first or second choice. If not, I'm screwed!

You're probably going to end up at Ontario since that place is massive. See you there!

[Zaizei]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

Other locations are probably full. Id think Feb exam isnt as crowded but i may be wrong.

I had to choose those two and one that was marked as writting only. Hopefully they'll give me the first or second choice. If not, I'm screwed!

You're probably going to end up at Ontario since that place is massive. See you there!

Cool! Thanks for the info! Now at least I'm not that stressed about the test center When you say that's massive, is it like Century Plaza in July? That's the only experience I have with the exam.

[storge]

July 2015 selected answers posted for anyone who's interested.

http://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Portals ... s1-6_R.pdf

[rcharter1978]

Is it normal that there are only two test center choices for people taking the exam with their laptop (sacramento or ontario)?

Other locations are probably full. Id think Feb exam isnt as crowded but i may be wrong.

I had to choose those two and one that was marked as writting only. Hopefully they'll give me the first or second choice. If not, I'm screwed!

You're probably going to end up at Ontario since that place is massive. See you there!

Cool! Thanks for the info! Now at least I'm not that stressed about the test center When you say that's massive, is it like Century Plaza in July? That's the only experience I have with the exam.

If the Century Plaza is the hotel, and they had it in a few of the ballrooms, Ontario is probably that big or potentially bigger.

It was the coldest ever in there so this time I'm going to try dressing in layers. I think Ontario is a nice site too because there are quite a few hotels within walking distance within different price ranges. There is a Residence Inn, a Country Inn by Ayres, a Doubletree, a Radisson, a Best Western, and a motel 6 too.

And there are even more hotels a few miles out like a Hilton, a Fairfield Inn, a Holiday Inn Express and a few others

[InTheWideLand I Walk]

My input on rule statement on the MBE vs. essay. I am of the opinion that a rule statement is NOT an exact template that you must regurgitate for full points on the essays. There is no one right way to say it.

Understanding the concepts is one effective way I found for "memorization" of the law.

As long as you convey the right concept—which often includes the right elements of a rule but not necessarily numbered lists like formulaic black-letter law—it should not affect the application of the rule statement embodying the concept.

That is one reason why I advocate for understanding the rules rather than solely rote memorizing them. Just because you know a physics formula does not mean you can apply it!!! You're not a bio or psych sorority girl who merely needs to memorize and know in theory to regurgitate back at the grader.

1. Know and understand the issues
2. Know and understand how to raise the issues (you don't just throw in a bunch of issues in nonsensical order)
3. Know and understand the rules (which often involves a lot of memorizing but NOT the other way around)

You can probably get by knowing like 80% of the issues and rules and still wing it and hope for some ancient piece of memory to unconsciously carry you through.

However, you can become enlightened through practice. Practice will help you achieve all three of the above. (Use model answers or sample answers or a BarEssays subscription to compare to real answers that are below and above (and if possible, at) a score of 65 (PM me for $20 off).) Even if you don't know the law yet. You probably won't know all the law anyway. You'll forget or panic or have never seen it in your life (like the one paragraph in the CMB about variance that was a significant issue in 2014...wtf?).

On actual bar day, you may be able to recite the rule perfectly. You might have to modify it a bit depending on what the facts focus on. You might have to make it up. Most likely it won't be exactly the way you've read it in your outline.

So should you study the MBE law or the sample essay? Neither and both: There's no need to worry about which "version" of the law is right, as long as it's in the same jurisdiction (general MBE law may differ from CA-oriented law).

Learn and read outlines if you want. Just don't stop practicing. Creep on that shit like a poorly raised man trying to escalate kino and never stop ogling and fiddling with essays.

respectfully disagree based on my experience with my graders constantly docking me for citing the elements wrong, but especially for the MBE- the answer choices are often the elements of a rule, so if you dont know the EXACT elements you probably wont get it right. and they ALWAYS make up fake elements as answer choices that closely resemble what they see as the "correct" elements, so if you get one word of an element wrong ur done for.

[a male human]

My input on rule statement on the MBE vs. essay. I am of the opinion that a rule statement is NOT an exact template that you must regurgitate for full points on the essays. There is no one right way to say it.

Understanding the concepts is one effective way I found for "memorization" of the law.

As long as you convey the right concept—which often includes the right elements of a rule but not necessarily numbered lists like formulaic black-letter law—it should not affect the application of the rule statement embodying the concept.

That is one reason why I advocate for understanding the rules rather than solely rote memorizing them. Just because you know a physics formula does not mean you can apply it!!! You're not a bio or psych sorority girl who merely needs to memorize and know in theory to regurgitate back at the grader.

1. Know and understand the issues
2. Know and understand how to raise the issues (you don't just throw in a bunch of issues in nonsensical order)
3. Know and understand the rules (which often involves a lot of memorizing but NOT the other way around)

You can probably get by knowing like 80% of the issues and rules and still wing it and hope for some ancient piece of memory to unconsciously carry you through.

However, you can become enlightened through practice. Practice will help you achieve all three of the above. (Use model answers or sample answers or a BarEssays subscription to compare to real answers that are below and above (and if possible, at) a score of 65 (PM me for $20 off).) Even if you don't know the law yet. You probably won't know all the law anyway. You'll forget or panic or have never seen it in your life (like the one paragraph in the CMB about variance that was a significant issue in 2014...wtf?).

On actual bar day, you may be able to recite the rule perfectly. You might have to modify it a bit depending on what the facts focus on. You might have to make it up. Most likely it won't be exactly the way you've read it in your outline.

So should you study the MBE law or the sample essay? Neither and both: There's no need to worry about which "version" of the law is right, as long as it's in the same jurisdiction (general MBE law may differ from CA-oriented law).

Learn and read outlines if you want. Just don't stop practicing. Creep on that shit like a poorly raised man trying to escalate kino and never stop ogling and fiddling with essays.

respectfully disagree based on my experience with my graders constantly docking me for citing the elements wrong, but especially for the MBE- the answer choices are often the elements of a rule, so if you dont know the EXACT elements you probably wont get it right. and they ALWAYS make up fake elements as answer choices that closely resemble what they see as the "correct" elements, so if you get one word of an element wrong ur done for.

I agree there are elements of a rule you should know, but I'm proposing that the exact wording isn't necessary or important when you write them out. Of course, an eloquent rule statement is always better.

I agree the MBE might be more picky since it does test the rules, thanks for bringing that up. But even then, as long as you understand the concept, the exact wording given by Barbri or whatever is still not necessary to answer correctly. Each bar outline having different wording (including different numbers of elements for a particular rule) is testament to this.

Regarding the graders docking you, if they are from Barbri/Kaplan/whatever, I wouldn't put much stock in their feedback because they're merely following a rubric, and they will be more literal than actual graders (from what I've seen). I would check out some essays on BarEssays if you have an account to see what I mean.

[Raiden]

Happy New Years yall, hope you accomplish all your resolutions. Mine is to start studying more than 2-3 hours a day...

[lcsung]

Happy New Years yall, hope you accomplish all your resolutions. Mine is to start studying more than 2-3 hours a day...

Same!!!

[BuenAbogado]

What's the worst state bar released sample answer you've seen?

[Zaizei]

Good news!! I was assigned to the Ontario center but I was able to change it for the Pasadena Center!!! Yay!

Do you guys know how crowded is this location? Is it a good location?

BTW there are still some seats available.

[BrokenMouse]

I personally think covering all the issues is more important than anything else. If you covered the issue then by extension you know some rules on it.

Spotting the issue itself wont give you points. (i.e., heading containing "A Has the Property by Adverse Possession" You have to at least jot down 1 rule to get 1 point.

[AMCD]

Just posted a methodology on memorizing rules on the July 2015 thread.

The best of luck, guys.

[FinallyPassedTheBar]

For the MBE, consequential damages is still based upon the knowledge of the breaching party (Hadley v Baxendale)...right???

But I just read an MBE answer explanation that says: modernly, consequential damages is based on lost profits that the plaintiff can reasonably establish.

WHat gives?!?!?!

[Raiden]

In regards to PT's, should one merely outline for 90 mins and then read the model answer, or should one sit down and take the full 3 hours of the test?

[a male human]

In regards to PT's, should one merely outline for 90 mins and then read the model answer, or should one sit down and take the full 3 hours of the test?

I would personally do the whole thing because PTs are about actually synthesizing all the material and the stamina and focus to do it within the allotted time.

Essays, not as important (as long as you know how to answer the calls in a particular subject).

[Raiden]

Thanks a male human, I agree, you just have to grind the three hours.

Also, does anyone have Essay issue checklists that they use? I imagine those are just skeletal versions of your outlines, would be helpful when tackling essays.

[just_lila]

Thanks a male human, I agree, you just have to grind the three hours.

Also, does anyone have Essay issue checklists that they use? I imagine those are just skeletal versions of your outlines, would be helpful when tackling essays.

I like essay checklists from this book: http://www.amazon.com/Essay-Exam-Writin ... 073550993X