BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam Forum

[Ludacrispat26]

So real talk: in a 40% MBE state, what raw % of questions right do you think you need to get to pass (assuming you get let's say 40th percentile on the essays and everything else)

In IL (which is a 50% MBE state), a 40 percentile on essay is a scale score of 140. If you are at a 40% MBE state, and assuming you need a 266 to pass (I am using IL and adjusting it to a 40% MBE weight), all you need is a 122.5 on MBE, i.e. around a 10 percentile., i.e. probably a 110 raw.

140 * 1.2 + x * .8 = 266
x = 122.5

In New York you need a 665 to pass. That seems far off from a 266...wtf

[kyle010723]

So real talk: in a 40% MBE state, what raw % of questions right do you think you need to get to pass (assuming you get let's say 40th percentile on the essays and everything else)

In IL (which is a 50% MBE state), a 40 percentile on essay is a scale score of 140. If you are at a 40% MBE state, and assuming you need a 266 to pass (I am using IL and adjusting it to a 40% MBE weight), all you need is a 122.5 on MBE, i.e. around a 10 percentile., i.e. probably a 110 raw.

140 * 1.2 + x * .8 = 266
x = 122.5

In New York you need a 665 to pass. That seems far off from a 266...wtf

It's all scaled. IL is out of 400. NY is out of 1000. It just so happened that 266/400 = 665 / 1000. So the math remains the same. Take it or leave it with a grain of salt.

[Ludacrispat26]

So real talk: in a 40% MBE state, what raw % of questions right do you think you need to get to pass (assuming you get let's say 40th percentile on the essays and everything else)

In IL (which is a 50% MBE state), a 40 percentile on essay is a scale score of 140. If you are at a 40% MBE state, and assuming you need a 266 to pass (I am using IL and adjusting it to a 40% MBE weight), all you need is a 122.5 on MBE, i.e. around a 10 percentile., i.e. probably a 110 raw.

140 * 1.2 + x * .8 = 266
x = 122.5

In New York you need a 665 to pass. That seems far off from a 266...wtf

It's all scaled. IL is out of 400. NY is out of 1000. It just so happened that 266/400 = 665 / 1000. So the math remains the same. Take it or leave it with a grain of salt.

And that works in reverse too? A 40th percentile MBE will probably get you a pass with around a 10th percentile essays?

[Learned Throw Hands]

The MEE questions in Feb 2015 were:

Agency/Torts
Con Law
Secured Transactions
Real Property
Civ Pro
Descendent's Estates

I wonder how often they repeat subjects on back to back exams.

[kyle010723]

And that works in reverse too? A 40th percentile MBE will probably get you a pass with around a 10th percentile essays?

No because you're at a 40% MBE state, so essays are weighed more. It translates to a 15~17 percentile.

141 * .8 + x * 1.2 = 266
x = 127.667

Here is a NY Calculator you can play around with http://www.seperac.com/calc-bar-j14.php

I am not taking the NY bar, so I am just giving you my best estimates.

[Ludacrispat26]

And that works in reverse too? A 40th percentile MBE will probably get you a pass with around a 10th percentile essays?

No because you're at a 40% MBE state, so essays are weighed more. It translates to a 15~17 percentile.

141 * .8 + x * 1.2 = 266
x = 127.667

Here is a NY Calculator you can play around with http://www.seperac.com/calc-bar-j14.php

I am not taking the NY bar, so I am just giving you my best estimates.

Cool, thanks so much

[Barbro]

Does anyone know if Barbri's "75% completion = 100% pass rate" applies to all barbri students or only specific schools?

[kyle010723]

Does anyone know if Barbri's "75% completion = 100% pass rate" applies to all barbri students or only specific schools?

I think 75% is the threshold where the money back guarantee applies if you failed, not that you are guaranteed to pass.

[Barbro]

Does anyone know if Barbri's "75% completion = 100% pass rate" applies to all barbri students or only specific schools?

I think 75% is the threshold where the money back guarantee applies if you failed, not that you are guaranteed to pass.

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

[musicfor18]

Does anyone know if Barbri's "75% completion = 100% pass rate" applies to all barbri students or only specific schools?

I think 75% is the threshold where the money back guarantee applies if you failed, not that you are guaranteed to pass.

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

I don't think BarBri has any money back guarantee. Also, the 75% stat surely includes all students, or it would be explicitly misleading. But I still don't know how meaningful the stat is. Causation vs. correlation and all that.

[kyle010723]

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

Correction, you don't even get your money back... the guarantee was if you failed, you get to take the next course for free (why would I want to take it again if I failed...). I think they said something like the majority of people passed if they completed 75% or more. But you can strike the later part because it would still be true if they simply say "the majority of people passed."

[kyle010723]

So here's something I've been thinking about. Is a dismissal based on the statute of limitations a ruling on the merits? The Freer handout in the preclusion section says that a car ends in a valid final judgment on the merits unless it was based on jurisdiction, venue, or indispensable parties -- so based on that I would say it is on the merits. But then question 158 on the simulated MBE (a con law FFC question) says that a dismissal based on the statute of limitations running is not a dismissal on the merits. I feel like I'm missing something but I'm not totally sure what.

I think the definition of "on the merits" varies a bit depending on context.

It is not a dismissal on the merits. However, it is a dismissal with prejudice, so it can't be brought again.

So I just encountered this from reviewing Conflict of Law. Dismissal based on SoL is not on the merit.

I think this would explain why Barbri said if your case was dismissed on SoL, you can file the same suit in another state with a longer SoL (provided jurisdiction is proper of course).

[N.P.H.]

This is probably a joke but it made me feel better.

http://witnesseth.typepad.com/blog/2013 ... e-bar.html

[mr.hands]

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

Correction, you don't even get your money back... the guarantee was if you failed, you get to take the next course for free (why would I want to take it again if I failed...). I think they said something like the majority of people passed if they completed 75% or more. But you can strike the later part because it would still be true if they simply say "the majority of people passed."

A couple things here:

You're right there is no money back guarantee, you can retake the course (and I'm almost certain that you don't have to complete 75% of the course to do it)

Also, the opening day video definitely said that their pass rate was 100% for students who completed 75%+ of the course. (It wasn't just that a majority passed)

[kyle010723]

A couple things here:

You're right there is no money back guarantee, you can retake the course (and I'm almost certain that you don't have to complete 75% of the course to do it)

Also, the opening day video definitely said that their pass rate was 100% for students who completed 75%+ of the course. (It wasn't just that a majority passed)

haha, ok then. I guess we better keep working toward that 75%!

[charlesxavier]

Does anyone know if Barbri's "75% completion = 100% pass rate" applies to all barbri students or only specific schools?

I think 75% is the threshold where the money back guarantee applies if you failed, not that you are guaranteed to pass.

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

I don't think BarBri has any money back guarantee. Also, the 75% stat surely includes all students, or it would be explicitly misleading. But I still don't know how meaningful the stat is. Causation vs. correlation and all that.

A couple months ago I looked up the 75% completion and pass rate and saw a few results. My school said everyone who hit 75% passed last year and University of Colorado said everyone passed as well. This was posted by barbri on twitter in January: "Our pass rate at USC is 95.5% for 75% completion. We'd be honored to have you as our student. "

[diowad]

Does anyone know if the civ pro questions are like Barbri's. I know Barbri's are easy, I'm sitting at a solid 75% including the simulated MBE. On Adaptibar I'm sitting at like 40%. They are hard af, and test esoteric shit that we actually were tested on 1L year. My 1L civ pro teacher was all multiple choice and 50% correct on his test was a good grade. Has anyone heard from previous takers as in last February?

Haven't heard from Feb takers but I will say there are pretty different styles of questions between BarBri and Emanuel. BarBri's have a pretty steady amount of difficulty to them and are fairly easy compared to the other subjects, while Emanuel's are generally longer and either very easy or very hard. No one really knows what to think it appears.

[musicfor18]

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

Correction, you don't even get your money back... the guarantee was if you failed, you get to take the next course for free (why would I want to take it again if I failed...). I think they said something like the majority of people passed if they completed 75% or more. But you can strike the later part because it would still be true if they simply say "the majority of people passed."

A couple things here:

You're right there is no money back guarantee, you can retake the course (and I'm almost certain that you don't have to complete 75% of the course to do it)

Also, the opening day video definitely said that their pass rate was 100% for students who completed 75%+ of the course. (It wasn't just that a majority passed)

I don't think BarBri even offers the free retake anymore.

[BVest]

They do. At least for us anyway (as in the 2015 agreement included it). You can retake once for the same state free online, though if you want to show up at the location there's a charge. They also offer "Alumni Pricing" if you need to retake more than once or if you want to take an additional state.

[ArmyOfficer]

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

Correction, you don't even get your money back... the guarantee was if you failed, you get to take the next course for free (why would I want to take it again if I failed...). I think they said something like the majority of people passed if they completed 75% or more. But you can strike the later part because it would still be true if they simply say "the majority of people passed."

A couple things here:

You're right there is no money back guarantee, you can retake the course (and I'm almost certain that you don't have to complete 75% of the course to do it)

Also, the opening day video definitely said that their pass rate was 100% for students who completed 75%+ of the course. (It wasn't just that a majority passed)

I don't think BarBri even offers the free retake anymore.

"BARBRI GUARANTEE If you take a BARBRI bar review course for the first time for a particular state and you do not pass that state’s bar exam or do not sit for that state’s bar exam, you may repeat the same course once for the same state the next time a course is offered without paying additional tuition.Your repeat course is only available for the next exam offered and does not include any upgrades, including supplemental workshops or a second set of books. All guarantee students are entitled to new lecture handouts with their repeat course. If a new edition of books has been released, you must pay a $250 refundable book deposit and shipping and handling fees to enroll in the repeat course and be shipped a new set of books. If the edition of books is the same as those used in your original course but you wish to receive another set of books, you must pay another $250 refundable book deposit and shipping fees before books can be shipped to you. Alumni tuition will apply on all subsequent courses for up to 5 years."

http://www.barbri.com/states/indiana/pricing/

[musicfor18]

They do. At least for us anyway (as in the 2015 agreement included it). You can retake once for the same state free online, though if you want to show up at the location there's a charge. They also offer "Alumni Pricing" if you need to retake more than once or if you want to take an additional state.

Good to know. Although seriously, if I fail, I'll blame it completely on BarBri and won't take their course again!

[dwyf]

I have 145 overdue items in 'my assignments' and 52 outstanding homework assignments

[kmp127]

I have 145 overdue items in 'my assignments' and 52 outstanding homework assignments

Ditto (just about). feels spectacular

[Barbro]

Ahh.. I thought in the intro/ launch day thing they said that people who completed 75% all passed, but I didn't know if that was the world's tiniest sample size.

Correction, you don't even get your money back... the guarantee was if you failed, you get to take the next course for free (why would I want to take it again if I failed...). I think they said something like the majority of people passed if they completed 75% or more. But you can strike the later part because it would still be true if they simply say "the majority of people passed."

A couple things here:

You're right there is no money back guarantee, you can retake the course (and I'm almost certain that you don't have to complete 75% of the course to do it)

Also, the opening day video definitely said that their pass rate was 100% for students who completed 75%+ of the course. (It wasn't just that a majority passed)

So the bold move would be to stop studying now and roll the dice

[rickgrimes69]

Can anyone explain the practical difference between an Assignment, a Delegation, and a Novation? I understand the legal effects of each, but I can't seem to distinguish them on fact patterns. NY if it matters.