Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2014 Exam Forum

[Genuine4ps]

Thoughts for the day:

1. Echoing above, the Bar Exam is complete rubbish - who the eff needs to recall 5 element rule statements, their exemptions, and the exceptions to those exemptions....spanning 19 areas of law?! Jesus Christ, I feel like Will Hunting is the only person truly qualified to be an attorney. Perhaps the exam's purpose is to ensure that the law survives a some bizarre apocalyptic event that takes out the internet and our ability to retrieve this info in seconds.

2. My memorization skills are total dogshit (tossing a bucket of kerosene onto #1).

3. Themis should really provide the a hard-copy of lecture handouts and/or allow us to manipulate the PDF's. It seems to be a total waste of time to draft outlines from scratch.

Yeah, I'm not looking forward to picking out what's important from the lectures/handouts and comprehensive outline to create my own outline. I don't think I've made my own outline since 1L. I've always just found one for each class and reviewed it.

[Lasers]

i don't even fill out the handouts. waste of time, imo. i listen to the lectures at 1.5x or 2x speed. i use the long outline as reference.

[JoeFish]

My method so far:

Skim the big outline
Watch videos at 2x speed, while filling in the handouts (in PDF)
Create my own small outline of barebones black letter law (rules, elements, occasionally factors)
Answer questions/essays
Meticulously record every single point of law I messed up on, stating correct rule (no matter how specific)
Revisit small outline+"wrong answer record" every few days.

Obviously, as I keep adding subjects, I'll be unable to do as much revisiting. But this seems like it's working for me or now.

[Lasers]

i find the summary outlines pretty sufficient in providing a barebones reference.

[JoeFish]

i find the summary outlines pretty sufficient in providing a barebones reference.

Yeah, but it really helps me re: retention to physically write them out, pen on paper.

[themis513]

Professor Zachary Kramer for real property - hiiiiilarious. I was not looking forward to how long the real property section of lectures was going to be, but this guy is actually making it fun!!

[puttycake]

Professor Zachary Kramer for real property - hiiiiilarious. I was not looking forward to how long the real property section of lectures was going to be, but this guy is actually making it fun!!

He definitely made me laugh. The property lectures go on forever, but at least he kept the sections short.

[dtl]

Checking in. Using themis for the July CA bar.

Just started a couple days ago. Going to be a long couple of months!

[Bigbub75]

About to abandon making flash cards already. Too time consuming!

[Genuine4ps]

About to abandon making flash cards already. Too time consuming!

Seems like it would take the same amount of time as it would to outline, no?

[Tanicius]

About to abandon making flash cards already. Too time consuming!

I think it's helpful for tort elements that involve different standards than just duty/breach/cause/damage, or for ConLaw tests that aren't the normal strict/intermediate/rational basis tests, like the idiotic First Amendment tests that fuck around with the buzzwords and have shit like "Narrowly tailored important government interest," or "rationally related overriding interest." I can never keep those straight and I can see myself making a few dozen flashcards for all the difficult element tests throughout the subjects when I'm done with the course.

[dtl]

I would imagine that somewhere out there there are flash cards pre made for a test like the CA bar.

Unless you are in the "Making the cards/outline is part of the studying" camp.

[Genuine4ps]

Quick question for you guys.

I listened to the intro videos yesterday, and there was quite a bit of information there (e.g., how long to spend on tests, review strategies, etc.). Did you all take quite a bit of notes on this stuff, or will the directed study approach explain this stuff again?

[dtl]

Quick question for you guys.

I listened to the intro videos yesterday, and there was quite a bit of information there (e.g., how long to spend on tests, review strategies, etc.). Did you all take quite a bit of notes on this stuff, or will the directed study approach explain this stuff again?

I am not sure if I am the right guy to answer this, since I did not take notes at all throughout law school, but I think that much of the same stuff is covered in the "Workshop" videos that are interspersed throughout the directed study schedule.

The really general strategy stuff is not, though. But to be honest, I am not sure it is the sort of thing that needs note taking.

[puttycake]

Quick question for you guys.

I listened to the intro videos yesterday, and there was quite a bit of information there (e.g., how long to spend on tests, review strategies, etc.). Did you all take quite a bit of notes on this stuff, or will the directed study approach explain this stuff again?

I think I listened with half an ear. If there was a handout (I don't even remember) then I filled it out, but I definitely didn't do more than that.

[themis513]

Just finished the first section of property lectures.

I understood everything but am sort of overwhelmed on how to go about remembering things (definitions, elements) as I proceed onto the next property section, as it all relates.

Anyone have any suggestions, tips?

[jumpingjack]

So I made a "condensed" outline for ConLaw based on the summary outline. Themis said this one should be 1-2 pages, and mine is a little over 5 pages. What's the story here? What are you ladies and gents leaving out?

[Kiwi917]

Quick question for you guys.

I listened to the intro videos yesterday, and there was quite a bit of information there (e.g., how long to spend on tests, review strategies, etc.). Did you all take quite a bit of notes on this stuff, or will the directed study approach explain this stuff again?

From what I can tell so far, the directed study plan doesn't add much in the way of extra instructions or strategy - it mainly just organizes your schedule. I found it somewhat helpful to go back and listen to the two intro videos after doing a few days of assignments. Some of the things they said made more sense once I had a better feel for the process and materials, and it was sort of reassuring to know I was roughly on track with their advice. Each one is only 10-15 minutes if you play it back 1.5 or 2x, so it's not a huge waste of time to review it if you feel like you missed something. A lot of the info is also in the "Enrolled Student Manual" part of the outline, so I have gone back to that a couple times - I don't think it is necessary to take notes.

[puttycake]

If you have Sherman Clark for torts, like Jeffries for ConLaw, be sure to train yourself to speed it up to 2x. Otherwise, you will cry at the slow talkin' man.

[Tanicius]

If you have Sherman Clark for torts, like Jeffries for ConLaw, be sure to train yourself to speed it up to 2x. Otherwise, you will cry at the slow talkin' man.

His fucking review lectures... how they're REQUIRED to complete for the task scheduler...

At least with Jeffries the subject matter was harder to understand when talking about various powers and legal tests, so I appreciated his slower pace. With torts it's all intuitive "reasonable" shit. Probably half the handout is redundant material.

[puttycake]

If you have Sherman Clark for torts, like Jeffries for ConLaw, be sure to train yourself to speed it up to 2x. Otherwise, you will cry at the slow talkin' man.

His fucking review lectures... how they're REQUIRED to complete for the task scheduler...

Well, as soon as you click on the review lectures, because they don't have assessment questions, the green check mark appears. So I think you can skip them.

I don't mind the reviews. I just sort've dash through them. But I get why they would annoy normal people.

[071816]

I'm not even really paying attention to those huge outlines. The FL Wills one was 62 pgs and they wanted me to read it in 30 min? That's absurd. I have outlines I got from prep classes I took this past Spring that are doing just fine and are no more than 10 pages. Half the stuff they throw in those massive outlines isn't even tested. They just put it in there to cover their asses in the 1 in a million chance that it is tested.

Good call. I think I'm just gonna start scanning the huge outlines before I watch the lectures, especially for subjects I already feel decent about. That 80 page con law one was a huge time sink and seemed to be way too in depth.

[Evaly]

Got my first graded essay back. I am perplexed by the grader. She gave some good advice and told me my strengths and weaknesses, but she also seems to be using a different issues checklist than the one Themis gave out in the Con Law graded essay review lecture.

For one big issue I spotted she flatly said it is not an issue, yet Themis's review lecture and handout specifically call it out as an issue that should not be missed. For another issue, she said I missed it or otherwise I could've gotten 5 more points, but it is the second major item in my essay and I even had a bolded and underlined title for that issue.

I guess I will rely less on the grader to provide pointers on substantive law and rely on her more to tell me whether my organization and analysis are on track.

Have you guys gotten your first graded essay back yet? What do you guys think of your grader?

[Tanicius]

Got my first graded essay back. I am perplexed by the grader. She gave some good advice and told me my strengths and weaknesses, but she also seems to be using a different issues checklist than the one Themis gave out in the Con Law graded essay review lecture.

For one big issue I spotted she flatly said it is not an issue, yet Themis's review lecture and handout specifically call it out as an issue that should not be missed. For another issue, she said I missed it or otherwise I could've gotten 5 more points, but it is the second major item in my essay and I even had a bolded and underlined title for that issue.

I guess I will rely less on the grader to provide pointers on substantive law and rely on her more to tell me whether my organization and analysis are on track.

Have you guys gotten your first graded essay back yet? What do you guys think of your grader?

Now you think that's terrifying until you realize the bar exam grader could be even more lazy and there's nothing you'll be able to do about it.

[Evaly]

Now you think that's terrifying until you realize the bar exam grader could be even more lazy and there's nothing you'll be able to do about it.

I wasn't thinking that, but now you have me scared.