California Bar Exam (July 2014) thread Forum

[jarofsoup]

What is everybody's status so far for prepping for the exam?

Did Barbri's torts mbe today and got 68%

Did the diagnostic and got 50%. Just doing the pace program. Why are you ahead?

Barbri started last week for us. Today's hw was MBE Workshop Torts Questions in MPQ (1-25)

Ic. I don't start till the 27th. Thats my HW for next friday. Are you in live lectures?

[rburgundy]

How are the lean sheets? Are they good enough for nailing the MBEs?

[hiima3L]

Barwinners, CA Bar Style, Barpassers Tutorial (Bob Hull)

Which one do you recommend? Personally I like Themis or Barmax outlines. But people say any outline is OK. I got 1556 in mbe so I guess the raw is 140. I give up typing and will handwrite. I got 2 50s in PTs. So I need 65 for each PT so that I can make up 100 deficit. PtPtPt. From the viewpoint of how to increase pt score dramatically, reasonably or humanly possibly, which course would be the best course for me? I took John Holtz and it was above my ability or time constraints. Dunno. Can you say it something is expensive, generally it will be good? Maybe I need to increase my mbe to 160 so that it can compensate deficit in pt/writing. PtPtPt.

If you want to improve on PTs (which is a must, given that if you get both your PTs to 65 from 50, that's like an extra 10 points for each of your essays), you don't need a course or outline. Practice old ones released on the Bar's website: admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Examinations/PastExams.aspx

BarEssays.com ($99) has actually graded answers you can compare yours to.

If you want that extra edge, consider getting a "pay as you go" tutor who can review your work, but it would be significantly more expensive than BarEssays.

July 2013 has the hardest PTs in my opinion. If you can do well on those (save them for later in your prep), you're set. Feb 2013 PTs are also interesting. PT-B of Feb 2008 (Snyder v. Regents) is very striaghtforward. Start with that to see where you are.

Looks like your MBE is solid. Keep it up.

I don't know how you can practice or prep for PTs. They're all so completely different and generally just test your writing and organization and attn to detail.

Writing: Read Plain English for Lawyers by Wydick or recall your legal writing activities like law journal, legal writing and research class, research papers, etc.
Organization: Two ways.
1. If PT has specific call(s) that tell you what to analyze. Those calls are the major headings/issues.
2. If PT has general call(s). Use the rules you pull out of the case as a guidepost. For example, one rule might have 8 elements. Is that rule relevant? Make the 8 elements a heading.
Attention to detail: Focus, read slowly, and mark important parts with your pen, pencil, highlighter. Or note it on your outline. Collecting relevant nuggets of fact across the dozens of pages is important.

Exactly. I don't know how these things can be improved much. If you didn't learn how to write and organize an essay in law school, then you're not going to do it on top of learning everything else in the span of ~2 months of bar studying.

[a male human]

Exactly. I don't know how these things can be improved much. If you didn't learn how to write and organize an essay in law school, then you're not going to do it on top of learning everything else in the span of ~2 months of bar studying.

I graduated in the bottom half, probably bottom quarter, and I still passed the second time. I'm pretty sure all the other high achievers can do it.

If writing answers is still a struggle, one would have to spend more time on studying past answers and trying to emulate them. Available from sources like CalBar, BE, and commercial prep courses. Hell, I'd be happy to send over my practice PT answers if anyone wants them.

I'm convinced writing can be improved. Maybe it will take a couple tries to pass if for some reason legal writing didn't click in the past 3 years. Maybe you'll decide law isn't right for you and give up on the bar altogether. But everyone will eventually pass if they keep putting in the effort and evolving.

[zeth006]

Exactly. I don't know how these things can be improved much. If you didn't learn how to write and organize an essay in law school, then you're not going to do it on top of learning everything else in the span of ~2 months of bar studying.

I graduated in the bottom half, probably bottom quarter, and I still passed the second time. I'm pretty sure all the other high achievers can do it.

If writing answers is still a struggle, one would have to spend more time on studying past answers and trying to emulate them. Available from sources like CalBar, BE, and commercial prep courses. Hell, I'd be happy to send over my practice PT answers if anyone wants them.

I'm convinced writing can be improved. Maybe it will take a couple tries to pass if for some reason legal writing didn't click in the past 3 years. Maybe you'll decide law isn't right for you and give up on the bar altogether. But everyone will eventually pass if they keep putting in the effort and evolving.

Congrats, man. Here's to hoping 3's a charm on my end.

Question about the baressays.com sub. Are the essays all downloadable? Were the essay answers more representative of the style and format that 2807's been recommending?

[hyc9598]

Do you use cases in case and footnotes in PT?

I will ignore them because those are beyond my ability (too complicated) and my goal is just to get 60.

[FutureInLaw]

This Barbri thing is a joke. I'm trying to be diligent to start off and then weed out unnecessary stuff as I go along. So, I did the first essay (Torts 5), did the self-assessment, and watched the relevant video for that essay.

The self-assessment says there's no abnormally dangerous activity, while the video says there is an abnormally dangerous activity.

Uh...what?? Maybe this is meant to show you can come out either way as long as your analysis is somewhat reasonable?

[zeth006]

This Barbri thing is a joke. I'm trying to be diligent to start off and then weed out unnecessary stuff as I go along. So, I did the first essay (Torts 5), did the self-assessment, and watched the relevant video for that essay.

The self-assessment says there's no abnormally dangerous activity, while the video says there is an abnormally dangerous activity.

Uh...what?? Maybe this is meant to show you can come out either way as long as your analysis is somewhat reasonable?

You're probably not going to finish everything. Most people quit doing AMP after the first couple of weeks. All the core BLL you need to know is in your CMR. Lectures are obviously completely optional and the lecture outlines may sometimes be missing important details or distinctions (I felt the con law one may have been a bit skimpy on some areas).

[adonai]

Anyone know how many issues you can reasonably miss in order to pass an essay?

[LSATNightmares]

Anyone know how many issues you can reasonably miss in order to pass an essay?

Did you try looking at the checklist at the end of any essay you did (at least with Barbri)? You check off boxes and it gives you a sense of whether you get a passing score. Today, I missed an issue, but still got a passing score.

[jarofsoup]

Has the CA bar received your degree certifications yet?

[adonai]

Anyone know how many issues you can reasonably miss in order to pass an essay?

Did you try looking at the checklist at the end of any essay you did (at least with Barbri)? You check off boxes and it gives you a sense of whether you get a passing score. Today, I missed an issue, but still got a passing score.

Just checked for one essay and I passed. According to the scale for that essay, you could miss more than half the issues/analysis and still pass (24/59 boxes minimum required). Wow....really? I mean, I know its much more difficult in practice since it's impossible to memorize all the law and hit all the issues in such a short time, but this seems like a big cushion if true.

[Girl86]

I don't know how these things can be improved much. If you didn't learn how to write and organize an essay in law school, then you're not going to do it on top of learning everything else in the span of ~2 months of bar studying.

Ehn, I'd say there's a difference between writing for the bar and writing for law school. In law school and real life, you can, and should, write fully formed essays with perfect grammar, spelling, and citations, as well as a nice, logical flow from one part to the next.

The bar is a bare bones checklist, where EVERYTHING has to be broken up to the point of where it seems like you're just cutting and pasting random sentences from an outline. As I said in the Feb. 2014 bar thread and my tutor told me, the graders just aren't paid enough to spend time reading essays and PTs like a normal person would. They are looking for the buzzwords and then they're onto the next. You could literally write the most random shit in between the buzzwords, but so long as you have the buzzwords they want in the order they want (second part is key), they'll give you a good grade. How else could I get a 60 AND a 70 on the same exact PT (pre-tutor grade), other than the difference in the time/care that the graders took to read it? It's like IRAC-ing on steroids (where each element is broken up into ton of sub-elements, each with their own IRAC).

This different style of writing can be learned so long as you have the basic concepts of legal writing, issue spotting, and IRAC-ing down.

[duskfall]

everyone taking the July Bar should watch "A Lawyer Walks into a Bar." It gives a great perspective of what it's like to take the Cal Bar. I actually watched it right after I took the bar in Feb 2014. It's on youtube.

[LSATNightmares]

Is there a good way to memorize all the material for the Cal bar, besides doing lots of problems and essays? Like making flashcards?

[a male human]

Is there a good way to memorize all the material for the Cal bar, besides doing lots of problems and essays? Like making flashcards?

I'm not a flashcard person, but I know people who passed who relied on flashcards. I suppose they help with rote memorization of the rules.

I personally prefer outlines where I can have a bird's eye view of all the issues, and I can see which rule relates to which rule in the bigger scheme.

Either way, there's a crapton of things to know, not just be familiar with.

[hiima3L]

Is there a good way to memorize all the material for the Cal bar, besides doing lots of problems and essays? Like making flashcards?

I would just type out rule statements over and over until I had them all memorized. I only did that with the big ones you really should be able to spew out without thinking, e.g., what is consideration, California is a community property jurisdiction..., etc.

[TIMEATELL]

Hi everyone, if you're like me, you are beginning to realize that bar prep can be a lonely and tiresome process. With that in mind, I created the following bar prep motivation and support community: https://plus.google.com/communities/103 ... 9906432868. When you need some motivation (or feel like sharing some), feel free to visit the community. Good luck with the July 2014 CA Bar Exam. You got this! - Wortham

[greg737]

Does anyone know what the essay topics were for the Feb. 2014 test? Thanks.

[2807]

Does anyone know what the essay topics were for the Feb. 2014 test? Thanks.

Read'm and weep....

http://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Examina ... Exams.aspx

[adonai]

Would it be safe to assume that the "true" score of a barbri essay/PT is 5-10 points higher?

[Mick Haller]

Are people booking hotels already? I know that you can register for the bar on like March 1, so I was waiting until then. Now I am wondering if I should book a hotel already. What do they cost?

i didn't exactly do an exhaustive search i just noticed the century city hyatt is like $350/night lol

yeah the hotel in oakland where the testing is $309/night right now. There seem to be tons of options within a mile tho for less, but on the other hand I kind of want to stay somewhere where I can 100% get breakfast room service every morning before the test and be in peace. A lot of the reviews for other nearby hotels for me say they can get really noisy because of the location.

I live right across the street from the Oakland convention center. Will rent my room for $200 per night

[bk1]

I booked about 3-4 weeks ago b/c I assumed that shit was gonna be nuts. They have special rates for bar takers at some hotels nearby (a list is on the CA bar website) but I ended up getting something that was a half mile further away that was 50-100/night less than the special rate.

[a male human]

I booked about 3-4 weeks ago b/c I assumed that shit was gonna be nuts. They have special rates for bar takers at some hotels nearby (a list is on the CA bar website) but I ended up getting something that was a half mile further away that was 50-100/night less than the special rate.

Yeah, Oakland is a total ripoff. I stayed in Sacramento for $70/night (+ negotiated a flat $40 for half day b/c I wanted to check out after the test around 5:30). No complaints except the garbage truck banging on metal for 2 hours after 3 am...

[GitRDone]

Does anyone know what a good score is on the MBE questions in Emanuel's "Strategies and Tactics" book?

There are no suggested scores/"goals" that I am aware of in the book. In the alternative, is anyone willing to post what they're getting so all of us have an idea if we're in the ballpark of where we should be at this point?

I just did the 58 Torts question on pages 350-364 and got 38/58= 65%. Previously i did the 41 Contracts questions on pages 86 - 97 and got 25/41 =60%. Am i anywhere close to where I should be at this point?

Thanks for everyone's help!