Iowa Law Student Taking Questions Forum

[Copp&Barn]

Hi everyone,

I used this forum a few years ago when making my decision about law school. It was a very challenging period because of all the different risks and opportunities (plus the various magnitudes) that I had to consider. I found a lot of the information on TLS to be really helpful; however, there was a serious lack of information about Iowa Law. While everyone has their own decision making process, needs, and constraints, I am very happy with my decision. I think Iowa Law is a great place to be for me.

If you're considering Iowa law or have questions, shoot me a message (or reply here) and let's chat. I'll be candid and honest because I know that this is tough for you all and that's what I would have wanted at the time.

[Uncreative123]

1) What were your stats upon being admitted?- GPA/LSAT
2) Do you think your personal statement/diversity statement/various addenda had any bearing on your acceptance and/or scholarships?
3) Do you know what area of law you're going to pursue?
4) IA city is party-town USA; What would you guess is the average age for law students there?
5) Anything else you think would be relevant? Scholarship conditions, coursework load, etc.

[Copp&Barn]

Hi Uncreative 123,

Good questions. I should have mentioned some of that beforehand.

1) 166 LSAT, 3.7 GPA, K-JD. Acceptances and modest scholarships generally between T15-T25 schools.
2) Full tuition in-state scholarship. In-state tuition is very nice; however, I have lots of friends from out-of-state. You pay in-state for the first year, get an RA position (there are plenty), and then get in-state tuition for the last two years. The scholarship is adjusted only if it goes over the new in-state rate. In short, Iowa is very good at financial aid (https://www.wsj.com/articles/new-lawyer ... 1574890294) (talking about how Iowa law is an only public law school where first-year earnings exceed debt).
3) Corporate work. Mid-market size firm (think 60-100 attorneys in a Midwestern regional market). I have friends that went Big Law and did a fair amount of interviewing at Big Law firms myself. I chose the mid-market firm but can talk about Iowa --> BL too.
4) The average age is probably 25-26. The law students are a very social bunch. Iowa City has the classic undergrad bars (if that's your thing) which you hear a lot about, but it also has a lot of cool restaurants, young adult breweries/social clubs, and a good entertainment scene for graduate students (theatres, Pedestrian Mall, parks, etc.).
5) The environment at Iowa is much less "cut-throat" than what I've heard from my friends at other schools. People here are generally agreeable and authentic (think Iowa Nice stereotype).

[Copp&Barn]

Also, I received this PM, but TLS won't let me compose messages since I'm a new user so I'm going to respond here (it also probably won't hurt in case other people may have like-questions).

The message (I cut out the salutations, but I appreciate them nonetheless):
"I have some questions, would appreciate if you can share your experience: I noticed that a good chunk of the class doesn't stay in Iowa, but the numbers aren't that high in the other states listed on the ABA employment report. Is there an actual network? Or is it just people going home/hustling on their own?"

So, the general saying is that 1/3 stays in Iowa, 1/3 in the Midwest, and 1/3 to the coast. There is a national network, and Iowa does have a good reputation. I know mostly about law firm hiring so most of my advice will be about that. Iowa also is involved in job fairs in NYC, Chicago, LA, and Houston which helps connect students with BL firms outside of the Midwest. That is generally limited to higher performing students (top 1/3). I know people with grades below 1/3 who hustled and found jobs in other markets. I've found older students, professors, and the career services staff to be very open to helping, but you will have to initiate the conversation and network. One nice thing about Iowa Law is how helpful and friendly people are. Also, just a general note, everyone should be hustling (sending out emails, doing phone calls, getting coffee, other activities to connect with alum, etc.). I was worried about it before law school, but its a very normal practice.

"Did you ever heard of someone who needed to get a research assistant position to obtain resident status that didn't get it? Does everyone who looks for this kind of position really gets it? Was there an alternative to establish residency?"
I think everyone who wants an RA position and isn't a bum can find a way to get one. The key is to apply, reach out to older students, reach out to professors, etc. Most of my friends are RA's

"Also, based on recent employment numbers, it seems the school's been doing pretty well in the legal market. Based on your experience, how do you feel about the future of the Iowa legal market? Do firms go recruit on campus?"
So, in addition to the job fairs that I mentioned (NYC, HOU, LA, CHI), Iowa does have firms come to their OCIs (2) on campus. Most firms are from Chicago, Saint Louis, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, Des Moines, Omaha, etc. There is also a second OCI for small to medium-sized Iowa firms (which is an underrated option if you're fine living in Iowa and like a nice lifestyle). Like any legal hiring, BL firm hiring is competitive. I'd say for BL, top 1/3 grades, a little hustle, and a normal personality will make you competitive.

IMPORTANT NOTE: If you're interested in doing larger firm work, Iowa isn't going to guarantee you a job. But you get a relatively fair shot for a much lower than average cost (compared to other law schools with similar BL %) in an environment that is less miserable than what I've heard from friends at other schools.

[Tacitean]

Hi Copp&Barn,

Thanks for doing this! It has been somewhat difficult to find personal testimony on the web about Iowa, and I really appreciate that you're offering your experiences.

I'm an admitted student and I'm giving Iowa serious consideration, mostly because I love the Midwest and I don't have a strong desire to crack Big Law. I've visited Iowa City before and I'm a sucker for smallish Midwest college towns, so all I'm really worried about in my decision making is the prospects for finding work and the amount of debt I'll have to take on.

On the latter point, since you've spoken on the former in your previous posts, do you have any insight into Iowa's willingness to negotiate scholarships? They've already offered me a fairly generous package (about 4/5 tuition with an RAship during the second and third years), but I do have a few competing offers from schools roughly in the same range as Iowa. Do you have a feel on this?

Also, this feels like putting the cart before the horse because it seems that most people change their minds about what they want to do after a year or two in law school, but how is the program on Public Interest law there? I've heard some impressive stories of people coming out of Iowa and working in public interest in cities throughout the Midwest, but I'm wondering whether those are exceptions. Do you have any experience in this area you can share?

Again, thank you very much!

[Copp&Barn]

Hi Tacitean,

I loved reading the part about smallish Midwest college towns. Iowa City (and the surrounding area) is a really cool place to be, and I agree wholeheartedly.

Your first question was on negotiating scholarships. Unfortunately, I don't have first hand experience or know of anyone who has negotiated with Iowa. I can offer two pieces of unsolicited advice . First, in my experience negotiating with other schools, I have only had success with the school's similar competition (in Iowa's case, I would guess Wisconsin and Minnesota) where the offer's in-state/out-of-state status is the same (you can't ask compare an in-state scholarship to an out-of-state scholarship). Second, it never hurts to try. A well-written email to financial aid with the attached offer letters and calculated COA's could be persuasive, if anything, to equalize a COA from a similar school.

Second, the program on Public Interest. Don't worry about the cart and the horse part. I commend anyone for putting serious thought and research into what they might want to do one day. It is a very important thing to put time into. Of course, some people change their mind, but they learned something in the process. I chose Iowa because I wanted to go to a school where I could change my mind and not drown in debt. So I know a little about their Public Interest work, and I would highly encourage reaching out to Admissions asking to talk with Professors in that area to learn more. They should connect you.

In particular, the Federal Defense Clinic is an amazing (and rare among other law schools) opportunity at Iowa, regardless if you want to go prosecution/defense. You will get to work a real case in the 8th Circuit. If you're interested in this, I highly recommend asking Admissions to talk with the person who leads this clinic. My friends have spoken highly of it, and it looks great on a resume.

Next, if you're interested in immigration law, there is an immigration clinic at Iowa. I know of people who have went to large markets to practice immigration law who were involved in the clinic.

Iowa has environmental law programs. While a professor who specializes in this is retiring, I would be shocked if it wasn't a focus in the future. This is because there is a lot of environmental disputes in Iowa between Big Ag and Protectionists in Iowa. The DNR, EPA, and AG commonly hires law students for summer internships. There is also an environmental law club which can help you (I know the people who lead it and they did those internships).

I don't know of anyone who has saved the whales yet.

Next, Iowa has a program in Health Law. If you want , you can get a joint MPH (masters in public health). There is an externship each semester at the hospital where you work primarily with health law. I have heard really great things on this externship. We also have two fantastic health law professors, although one is nearing retirement as well.

Finally, as you know, Iowa places well in clerkships. I think this is partly to do with our writing program and our location.

Just a final note. I remember when I was an undergrad and I asked a law professor here why the Big Law % was lower than similarly ranked schools. Take this or leave it, but he mentioned that the BL % at Iowa is partially self-selected. Iowa's financial aid brings in a fair number of public interest motivated people which would support the idea of a stronger than average PI program.

[Tacitean]

Wow, that was a fantastically thorough response, thank you!