Former Student From Bottom of Class Now An Attorney Taking Questions Forum

[f.glenn]

I've always been a fan of the "taking questions" type threads on this page. Since I've got some time to kill the next several days, I thought I would contribute something.

My experience is a little unique. I didn't have the greatest grades and law school. I wasn't on the top half of my class and I wasn't on law review. I had solid work experience through internships though. I also struggled on the bar exam and took it twice. I also didn't go to a top 50 law school either.

Those stats are a lot different than most people who contribute to these threads, but I know there are probably many others like me out there, whether they are current students, recent grads, or just someone curious. That is why I would like to do this "ask me anything" type thread. So go ahead, ask me anything. I don't really want to give too many personal details on here though, but I will do my best to answer your questions.

As I said, I had poor grades in law school. I failed the bar exam. I kept at it though because I knew I could do the work, I enjoyed the work, and always felt like I had a better grasp than I could demonstrate on a timed exam. Currently, I work as in house counsel for a large company. Honestly, I think I got pretty lucky during the hiring process considering I failed the bar exam and they actually kept me around. I really enjoy my work and I feel as if I am progressing extremely well.

If you have any questions about my journey or want advice or are curious about anything let me know and I will try to answer here.

If you are in the top 10% of your class and have a big law job lined up, that is awesome and I am extremely happy for you. However, not everyone can be the same. By the very nature of ranking a class, someone has to be at the top and someone has to be at the bottom. I firmly believe just because you are at the bottom does not mean you won't be successful as an attorney.

Ask away.

[zot1]

Hey dude.

First, congrats!

Second, I have a friend who graduated middle of the class and she's been struggling to find a job. Top 30 school. No law review. Passed the CA bar. I know she's been looking at in-house counsel opportunities but can't really find much out there. Would you be willing to share how you did? I would love to help her find a job.

[f.glenn]

Hey dude.

First, congrats!

Second, I have a friend who graduated middle of the class and she's been struggling to find a job. Top 30 school. No law review. Passed the CA bar. I know she's been looking at in-house counsel opportunities but can't really find much out there. Would you be willing to share how you did? I would love to help her find a job.

Thanks zot1. Your friend sounds like she is in a better place than I was when I first started searching for a job after graduation. I'll explain how I got hired, but as I mentioned, I mostly got lucky over anything, so I will also give list a what I think are some helpful pointers that I've observed since working in house.

I got my job through networking. Not the kind of networking you hear about from career services. As graduation neared and I didn't have a job lined up, I started brainstorming long and hard about where I could work and what I could do. I didn't want to work in a firm. I liked government criminal work or in house work. I started trying to network my ass off through other lawyers, law functions, alumni, ect and it wasn't really getting me anywhere. I started networking with non-attorneys thinking I may end up working in a non-legal job. While doing that, a non-lawyer had a connection with a non-lawyer inside the company that I worked for. He told the non-lawyer about me. While discussing me, my connection mentioned some work I had done during an internship in law school that was semi-related to the company's industry. I ended up meeting the non-lawyer, I flat out told him I would love to work for the company and would consider a non-legal role. He pushed my name and contact info up the chain, I met with a de other people in the company. I showed a lot of interest and next thing I knew I was offered a job. Taking the job required me to relocate to an area I had never actually visited before, but I think it is very important be open to move to help land your first gig. Also, when I failed the bar exam, I was put into a non-legal role until I passed. I honestly think working in a non-legal role helped me better learn the company, meet people, and get the respect of a lot of people within the company.

Here are some other tips I have noticed work for others trying to go in house who aren't lateral from a firm:
If financially possible, start doing unpaid work such as an internship or low paying work or whatever. GET YOUR FOOT IN THE DOOR.
Take a non-legal job with the company to get your foot in the door. Do good work. Bust your ass and make sure everyone knows you goal is
To work as in house counsel.
Start as a paralegal. I know a female attorney who passed the bar right after graduation, signed on with a company as a paralegal. Grinded it out for two years, and is now in house counsel with the company she started with. While not a glamorous beginning, she didn't exactly go to a top 30 school, but in the end, se ended up with the gig she wanted.
Network, network, network. Think outside the box and network with business people not just attorneys. Business people know and work with a lot of lawyers. Plus, I've found business people have a lot better connections than most lawyers.
Hopefully your state bar has a section or group for "Corporate Counsel" "In House Counsel" or whatever they may call it. This group will typically be a group of in house attorneys who are lower on the totem pole or just starting out, although, sometimes the top dogs are there too. Meet these people. They work in the field you want to be in. They know people and can give advice. They are typically very helpful and nice.
If you have passed the bar, you need CLE credits, so find a CLE in your area geared toward in house counsel. These things do exist. I've been to them. Network there! This summer
I saw a young attorney networking at a corporate counsel CLE and I watched him exchange phone numbers with 3 different attorneys who were going to contact him.
Finally, there is a group called the Association of Corporate Counsel (ACC) check out their
Website. See if you can join the group or just browse the website and find helpful info there or find contacts. They have national and local chapters. Get in touch with those people. I've met a few and they are great people.


Hope some of this helpsor at least sparks some interest in trying something in the job search rather than most blindly mass mailing.

Next question, anyone else?

[zot1]

Thanks! I'll pass the message along.

[f.glenn]

Thanks! I'll pass the message along.

No problem.