University of Kansas School of Law Dean of Admissions Forum

[bjsesq]

We have students who are... Muslims, Jews, atheists and all other religious beliefs. We have...gay students....

would they feel welcome on the basketball team?

"Assistant coach Ronnie Chalmers...and others praised [Jayhawks coach Bill] Self not for his bold, verbal witness, but for setting a moral and Christian standard for the team."

http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?id=27779

What exactly is the point of this shit? And what does it have to do with the admissions officer from KU Law?

[pertristis]

We have students who are... Muslims, Jews, atheists and all other religious beliefs. We have...gay students....

would they feel welcome on the basketball team?

"Assistant coach Ronnie Chalmers...and others praised [Jayhawks coach Bill] Self not for his bold, verbal witness, but for setting a moral and Christian standard for the team."

http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?id=27779

What exactly is the point of this shit? And what does it have to do with the admissions officer from KU Law?

It has nothing to do with it. He's just being a cantankerous old man.

[Nightrunner]

That's enough of this, now.

[jared6180]

From what I understand the UG at KU offers fixed pricing if you complete your degree in 4 or in some cases 5 years. You know to the penny on day 1 what you will pay for your entire college education. I like this approach and I was wondering if KU Law offers a similar program?

Will the Chick-Fil-A on campus be shutting it's doors? I am not yet sold on going to school in a city with no Chick-Fil-A.

[jtc2012]

From what I understand the UG at KU offers fixed pricing if you complete your degree in 4 or in some cases 5 years. You know to the penny on day 1 what you will pay for your entire college education. I like this approach and I was wondering if KU Law offers a similar program?

Will the Chick-Fil-A on campus be shutting it's doors? I am not yet sold on going to school in a city with no Chick-Fil-A.

^ Jared, it probably isn't too wise to voice your support for a company that gives money to groups who want to criminalize homosexuality just after another potential applicant expressed a concern for the LGBT climate at the law school. It's rude to Madison and disrespectful to the faculty & administrators trying to tell her that KU Law is a welcoming place.

[jtc2012]

I was born and raised in Kansas (as were the last five generations of my family). It goes without saying that I am a Jayhawk through-and-through. However, my life experiences have made me vastly different than my many Kansan ancestors. I am gay, and growing up in a Kansas molded by Fred Phelps has been incredibly difficult. My passion for justice and equality is parallel in strength solely to my thirst for education.

I would love to have the opportunity to both follow my educational aspirations and live and study in the state that I call home. Largely due to the immense discrimination I have experienced as a homosexual in the Midwest, I am terrified to come-out in my application. It is a significant factor in what makes me who I am and gives me the perspective I have on political philosophy and the justice system. I want to be open about my identity but worry that my orientation could overshadow my strong academic standing and passion.

Is it possible that in coming-out I could be forfeiting scholarship opportunity or even acceptance?

Sincerely,
Madison

Madison,

Here are just a few links that I found in about 10 seconds through google. It should also be noted that KU just created a Women's, Gender, and Sexuality Studies PhD program (one of only a handful in the nation). Pretty slick if you ask me. Finally, I don't think that the LSAC Law School LGBT Survey is 100% updated in regards to KU Law. There is at least one LGBT faculty member on staff, and while there aren't any courses with "LGBT" expressly stated in the course title, there are a decent handful of classes in which LGBT issues will surely show up. Anyhow, peruse these links at your leisure.

Being LGBT At KU - From the LGBT Resource Center
http://www.silc.ku.edu/lgbt/Pdf%20Docum ... TFAQ's.pdf

KU WGSS Program
http://www.womenandgender.ku.edu/gradua ... ndex.shtml

Campus Pride LGBT Climate Index for KU (Note that LGBT persons have recently been included in anti-discrimination, so the score will be even higher next year)
http://www.campusclimateindex.org/detai ... spx?ID=347

And finally, my personal favorite: Douglas County extends employment benefits to same-sex county employees - the first county in Kansas to do so. Pretty stinking impressive if you ask me. Mike Gaughan is an awesome guy.
--LinkRemoved--

I am clearly biased, but I definitely think that Lawrence is a great place to live and KU Law is an incredible value, especially for Kansas residents.

I'll stop inundating the thread, I promise!

-Jake

The Ph.D program is excellent. The faculty are outstanding!

[jared6180]

My love for their chicken does not imply support for their political views...or does it? By your logic a conservative leaning individual should never go to law school as it is common knowledge the majority of law programs are more left leaning. The left has made not having health insurance a crime. A liberal leaning individual shouldn't go to church as it is common knowledge the majority of churches are more right leaning. Chick-Fil-A has the obligation to be upfront and honest with their customers, and the LGBT community has the ability to disapprove and stage kiss-ins. As long as we maintain the freedom of speech and the openness of both sides we might be able to someday move PAST this and begin to better understand each other. Never shut the door on communication, any attorney, and some pre-law students know that.

KU is a good place to go, in the end if she wants to go she will go, if she doesn't she won't. I recommend she does what is best for her.

[Nightrunner]

Just stay on topic. How hard is this?

If your question or comment is not directly related to the KU School of Law or law school admissions, then kindly shut up.

[jared6180]

Just stay on topic. How hard is this?

If your question or comment is not directly related to the KU School of Law or law school admissions, then kindly shut up.

Agreed! Go KU!

[Colonel Angus]

@ taxman

re citation to article about Christian KU basketball player - KU and KU Law welcome folks from all walks of life. Just on the edge of campus, the Chabad House and the Islamic Center are across the street from each other. We have a strong Mormon community. We have students who are Christians, Muslims, Jews, atheists and all other religious beliefs. We have straight and gay students, Jayhawk and Wildcat fanatics, young and old students. We pride ourselves on the fact that our doors have always been open to all and that our community is not only tolerant of diversity, but thrives on it.

As a proud graduate of a school a few miles to the west, the bolded made me smile. Do applications from Mizzou grads go straight in the trash, or do you place a voodoo curse on them first?

[jtc2012]

My love for their chicken does not imply support for their political views...or does it? By your logic a conservative leaning individual should never go to law school as it is common knowledge the majority of law programs are more left leaning. The left has made not having health insurance a crime. A liberal leaning individual shouldn't go to church as it is common knowledge the majority of churches are more right leaning. Chick-Fil-A has the obligation to be upfront and honest with their customers, and the LGBT community has the ability to disapprove and stage kiss-ins. As long as we maintain the freedom of speech and the openness of both sides we might be able to someday move PAST this and begin to better understand each other. Never shut the door on communication, any attorney, and some pre-law students know that.

KU is a good place to go, in the end if she wants to go she will go, if she doesn't she won't. I recommend she does what is best for her.

I hate to do this on the Dean's forum, but I'll try to be succinct.

Chick-Fil-A gives millions DIRECTLY to, not a particular politician, but to organizations (actual hate groups -- literally) that seek to criminalize and "repair" homosexuality and maintain existing death penalties in other countries for being LGBT, among other things. When you spend your money at Chick-Fil-A, you are indeed supporting their cause.

There cannot be a mutual understanding for extremists who want to kill people like me.

I have no idea how those examples are related to your mentioning Chick-Fil-A.

This also isn't a "Freedom of Speech" issue. Freedom of Speech is a LEGAL right, under the First Amendment to the federal Constitution, a LEGAL document, meaning protection from GOVERNMENT censorship. This has nothing to do with government censorship/abridgment.

Also, who the heck chooses a law school based on a Chick-Fil-A??

Anyway, you missed my point that this was an inappropriate place and time to post about Chick-Fil-A given the topic just covered and because their actions have been very salient in the media these past couple of weeks. Just be respectful.

[Nightrunner]

Just stay on topic. How hard is this?

If your question or comment is not directly related to the KU School of Law or law school admissions, then kindly shut up.

Apparently that was hard. Someone just took a week off of TLS. Subsequent bull will result in substantially longer bans.

Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

[jared6180]

From what I understand the UG at KU offers fixed pricing if you complete your degree in 4 or in some cases 5 years. You know to the penny on day 1 what you will pay for your entire college education. I like this approach and I was wondering if KU Law offers a similar program?

Reposting my question without the controversial portion.

[lawguyjake]

This may be a question better directed towards Career Services, but I thought I'd give it a shot:

How successful are KU students/grads at landing summer jobs/permanent jobs with the DOJ (for instance, the DOJ Summer Law Internship Program)? How about with national advocacy groups like the HRC, ACLU, etc.? Maybe a more broad question might be asking about federal goverment and public interest placement. I looked at the US and World employer page and noticed that KU does pretty well in D.C.

[JayhawkLaw]

Sorry folks, I was gone for a week. Thanks to all who are keeping this thread on the topic of KU Law and KU Law Admissions. And thanks to Nightrunner for serving as hall monitor

@ jared

Offering a fixed rate three year tuition is an idea that's on the radar, but we don't have any near future plans to implement it. Although we think students would react positively to it, there are a lot of technical/budgeting issues that would need to be resolved.

[McQueen]

In trying to get a handle on KU employment opportunities. How many firms will be on campus during OCI this month? Or for students reading this, how many interviews do you already have lined up?

[JayhawkLaw]

@ McQueen. As of today, we have twenty seven law firms participating in OCI, of which six are resume collection. We will likely add a few firms as the weeks go by. Government and non-profit OCI takes place later, I don't have a number for that one yet. Please keep in mind that most of our students obtain jobs outside of the OCI process.

[jared6180]

@ McQueen. As of today, we have twenty seven law firms participating in OCI, of which six are resume collection. We will likely add a few firms as the weeks go by. Government and non-profit OCI takes place later, I don't have a number for that one yet. Please keep in mind that most of our students obtain jobs outside of the OCI process.

Is this the general rule for most students nationwide or a KU phenomena. I am not familiar with the job search portion of law school but I guess I assumed the majority of students were hired through OCI.

[Danteshek]

@ McQueen. As of today, we have twenty seven law firms participating in OCI, of which six are resume collection. We will likely add a few firms as the weeks go by. Government and non-profit OCI takes place later, I don't have a number for that one yet. Please keep in mind that most of our students obtain jobs outside of the OCI process.

Is this the general rule for most students nationwide or a KU phenomena. I am not familiar with the job search portion of law school but I guess I assumed the majority of students were hired through OCI.

LOL. Try 5% (at most schools).

[lawguyjake]

@ McQueen. As of today, we have twenty seven law firms participating in OCI, of which six are resume collection. We will likely add a few firms as the weeks go by. Government and non-profit OCI takes place later, I don't have a number for that one yet. Please keep in mind that most of our students obtain jobs outside of the OCI process.

Is this the general rule for most students nationwide or a KU phenomena. I am not familiar with the job search portion of law school but I guess I assumed the majority of students were hired through OCI.

LOL. Try 5% (at most schools).

I am also inclined to believe that this is true of many (if not most) law schools as of late. I think that it is important to remember that while a school (particularly one in a big city with many local firms) might attract a large number of participants in OCI, that does not mean that all (or even many) of those firms will ultimately hire any OCI applicants at said school.

OCI participation is certainly germane to any discussion about employment prospects at any given school. But I would suggest that law school applicants take a look at ABA reported employment data for the fullest picture of employment possibilities at a prospective school. There you can see the kind of employment that is being found and guage a better median income level for the latest graduating class. I have posted a link below.

I would also like to mention that applicants should be wary of schools whose websites present scant employment information or barely-possible median income numbers. These should be big red flags. KU's website is the most transparent (and easily navigable) that I have encountered.

http://employmentsummary.abaquestionnaire.org/

[JayhawkLaw]

@ lawguyjake

re: federal jobs

I contacted the Career Services Office and they provided me with a list of 58 KU Law alumni working for the federal government in the Washington D.C. area. This is out of approximately 250 KU Law alumni working in the D.C. metropolitan area. That's pretty good.

re: OCI employment

Last year 17 students found employment through OCI, slightly more than 10% of graduating students. That was a large graduating class (168), we're expecting our reduced class size (140) will help our students find more opportunities both in OCI and everywhere else.

[JayhawkLaw]

FYI - I've started a new thread called "University of Kansas School of Law Dean of Admissions - 2012". Please submit your questions there.

Steve