Boalt 1Ls taking questions Forum

[wert3813]

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[haveahat]

Anyone on here a Cal undergrad who stayed at/returned to Berkeley for law school? Berkeley has been an amazing place the live for the last four years, but part of me feels like I need a new experience and that it would be weird to be on the same campus for 7 years straight. But, again, Berkeley is amazing and I feel like if I want to work in CA it is the place to be.

[twinkletoes16]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

[wert3813]

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[Hattori Hanzo]

shallow question- how cute are the guysirls at boalt?

VERY. I visited last semester and it was so much better than HLS. I regret not having put in an application for HLS-Boalt exchange program.

[azgirl514]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

lol DON'T date a fellow law student!! It may be different at HLS/Georgetown/some other school with a huge class, but at smaller schools like Boalt it can get really incestuous. You want to avoid drama at all costs, especially since school is so stressful. The guys here are actually really great, but I don't think any law school atmosphere is exactly conducive to a relationship. A couple of weeks into the semester you're going to want to get away from your classmates (even though they are truly awesome people, and I mean that!) It's just healthier that way, especially since the majority of your friends are going to be Boalties. I'm dating a guy who works in San Francisco right now and my favorite thing about him is the fact that he is not remotely involved with anything law school related. There are a few couples who got together from our 1L class this semester -- and it seems to have worked so far for them -- but in general I would urge you to keep that part of your life separate.

[Tanicius]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

lol DON'T date a fellow law student!! It may be different at HLS/Georgetown/some other school with a huge class, but at smaller schools like Boalt it can get really incestuous. You want to avoid drama at all costs, especially since school is so stressful. The guys here are actually really great, but I don't think any law school atmosphere is exactly conducive to a relationship. A couple of weeks into the semester you're going to want to get away from your classmates (even though they are truly awesome people, and I mean that!) It's just healthier that way, especially since the majority of your friends are going to be Boalties. I'm dating a guy who works in San Francisco right now and my favorite thing about him is the fact that he is not remotely involved with anything law school related. There are a few couples who got together from our 1L class this semester -- and it seems to have worked so far for them -- but in general I would urge you to keep that part of your life separate.

Nonsense. Silly law school mythology. For the most part I'm a B-type personality, and maybe that makes me more tolerant of high-strung people, but either way I find myself getting along with most people here. Date whoever you fancy, whether it's law school or from elsewhere.

[wert3813]

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[pkt63]

I read back a few pages and couldn't find anything so apologies if this has been dealt with.

How are job prospects? The first five or so pages or so seem pretty negative but that was two years ago. What percentage get OCI? What percentage get an SA their L1 summer? What percentage graduate and are really hurting? I understand these will be estimates.

Seems like students at the other schools without traditional grades feels like it helps with employers because they don't really know how to relate the grades. Course it probably has something to do with those school being H, Y, and S. I don't necessarily get that vibe with Cal. Thoughts on the grade system in general and whether it really changes anything?

Any chance I could get this question about slightly more ugh substantive thing answered?

We don't get a report out on percentage employed in what type of summer job. I think CDO doesn't even know the complete picture, because they only find out what people voluntarily tell them. They make more of an effort to find out how 2Ls are doing, or at least 2Ls that went through OCI, by sending out a surveymonkey. I don't know if CDO gives out any of their results. So everything I know is anecdotal. Everyone I know has a job for the summer that they are happy about. People that I talk to that went through OCI all got jobs through OCI. Although, I would say, I am a little cautious about asking people because there is so much talk out there (and I mean the internet, not at Boalt) about how bad things are, so I don't want to accidentally ask someone that doesn't have a job. So I have mostly talked about it with people I had some kind of idea were doing ok or mentioned it themselves, or something like that. The upshot being, I have no idea, although people seem happy. My OCI was great.

As for the grading system...You are required to copy your transcript front and back, and the back has an extensive discussion of interpreting our grading system, so it's not like we're tricking them and they are clueless. And the recruiters that come here might be Boalt alums (and Boalt has had this grading system for a very long time) or they come regularly, so they are already familiar. I think the point is, the grade system doesn't stump them at all and I'm sure all recruiters and firms come up with their own shorthand for what looks like a good transcript from what school.

My opinion on the grading system is that it doesn't really matter. Maybe I would care more if there were Ds and Cs to hand out, given that I have never in my life gotten a D or C (and probably very few of my classmates have either). So I would rather have a P and not know whether it was like B or B- level or more C or D level work. And I guess from an employers' point of view, they really want to know who is at the very top, and everyone below the top...25%? 33%? might as well all be lumped in together anyway. Therefore there's no real reason to distinguish between Cs and Ds, so why bother. Just my conjecture. FWIW, you have to get a B in a non-Boalt class to pass (P) it (i.e. at Haas or Goldman, or another law school, I guess), so perhaps C or D level work gets a sub-pass or an actual failure (no credit). The talk is that even sub-passes are pretty rare, but I often wonder how little effort I could get away with in a class, and then quickly dismiss the idea, because it would be devastating to sub-pass while you are thinking you are doing a sacrificial P.

Oh on the subject of SAs for 1L summer...I knew a few who did SAs, although I also know that without a tech background it takes a lot of work to get it. My impression was that most people didn't even attempt an SA for 1L summer because they wanted to use that summer to do something totally different. That's what I did, and I loved it.

[bigtexmex]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

lol DON'T date a fellow law student!! It may be different at HLS/Georgetown/some other school with a huge class, but at smaller schools like Boalt it can get really incestuous. You want to avoid drama at all costs, especially since school is so stressful. The guys here are actually really great, but I don't think any law school atmosphere is exactly conducive to a relationship. A couple of weeks into the semester you're going to want to get away from your classmates (even though they are truly awesome people, and I mean that!) It's just healthier that way, especially since the majority of your friends are going to be Boalties. I'm dating a guy who works in San Francisco right now and my favorite thing about him is the fact that he is not remotely involved with anything law school related. There are a few couples who got together from our 1L class this semester -- and it seems to have worked so far for them -- but in general I would urge you to keep that part of your life separate.

Nonsense. Silly law school mythology. For the most part I'm a B-type personality, and maybe that makes me more tolerant of high-strung people, but either way I find myself getting along with most people here. Date whoever you fancy, whether it's law school or from elsewhere.

I would second that. To each their own.

[worldtraveler]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

lol DON'T date a fellow law student!! It may be different at HLS/Georgetown/some other school with a huge class, but at smaller schools like Boalt it can get really incestuous. You want to avoid drama at all costs, especially since school is so stressful. The guys here are actually really great, but I don't think any law school atmosphere is exactly conducive to a relationship. A couple of weeks into the semester you're going to want to get away from your classmates (even though they are truly awesome people, and I mean that!) It's just healthier that way, especially since the majority of your friends are going to be Boalties. I'm dating a guy who works in San Francisco right now and my favorite thing about him is the fact that he is not remotely involved with anything law school related. There are a few couples who got together from our 1L class this semester -- and it seems to have worked so far for them -- but in general I would urge you to keep that part of your life separate.

Nonsense. Silly law school mythology. For the most part I'm a B-type personality, and maybe that makes me more tolerant of high-strung people, but either way I find myself getting along with most people here. Date whoever you fancy, whether it's law school or from elsewhere.

I would second that. To each their own.

I think some caution is necessary when dating a fellow student. I've seen a few relationships crash and burn in spectacular fashion and then later when the two people have to work together in a clinic or journal or have a class together there is always drama. But, there are also quite a few happy couples who end up marrying.

[wert3813]

.

[pkt63]

I read back a few pages and couldn't find anything so apologies if this has been dealt with.

How are job prospects? The first five or so pages or so seem pretty negative but that was two years ago. What percentage get OCI? What percentage get an SA their L1 summer? What percentage graduate and are really hurting? I understand these will be estimates.

Seems like students at the other schools without traditional grades feels like it helps with employers because they don't really know how to relate the grades. Course it probably has something to do with those school being H, Y, and S. I don't necessarily get that vibe with Cal. Thoughts on the grade system in general and whether it really changes anything?

Any chance I could get this question about slightly more ugh substantive thing answered?

We don't get a report out on percentage employed in what type of summer job. I think CDO doesn't even know the complete picture, because they only find out what people voluntarily tell them. They make more of an effort to find out how 2Ls are doing, or at least 2Ls that went through OCI, by sending out a surveymonkey. I don't know if CDO gives out any of their results. So everything I know is anecdotal. Everyone I know has a job for the summer that they are happy about. People that I talk to that went through OCI all got jobs through OCI. Although, I would say, I am a little cautious about asking people because there is so much talk out there (and I mean the internet, not at Boalt) about how bad things are, so I don't want to accidentally ask someone that doesn't have a job. So I have mostly talked about it with people I had some kind of idea were doing ok or mentioned it themselves, or something like that. The upshot being, I have no idea, although people seem happy. My OCI was great.

As for the grading system...You are required to copy your transcript front and back, and the back has an extensive discussion of interpreting our grading system, so it's not like we're tricking them and they are clueless. And the recruiters that come here might be Boalt alums (and Boalt has had this grading system for a very long time) or they come regularly, so they are already familiar. I think the point is, the grade system doesn't stump them at all and I'm sure all recruiters and firms come up with their own shorthand for what looks like a good transcript from what school.

My opinion on the grading system is that it doesn't really matter. Maybe I would care more if there were Ds and Cs to hand out, given that I have never in my life gotten a D or C (and probably very few of my classmates have either). So I would rather have a P and not know whether it was like B or B- level or more C or D level work. And I guess from an employers' point of view, they really want to know who is at the very top, and everyone below the top...25%? 33%? might as well all be lumped in together anyway. Therefore there's no real reason to distinguish between Cs and Ds, so why bother. Just my conjecture. FWIW, you have to get a B in a non-Boalt class to pass (P) it (i.e. at Haas or Goldman, or another law school, I guess), so perhaps C or D level work gets a sub-pass or an actual failure (no credit). The talk is that even sub-passes are pretty rare, but I often wonder how little effort I could get away with in a class, and then quickly dismiss the idea, because it would be devastating to sub-pass while you are thinking you are doing a sacrificial P.

Oh on the subject of SAs for 1L summer...I knew a few who did SAs, although I also know that without a tech background it takes a lot of work to get it. My impression was that most people didn't even attempt an SA for 1L summer because they wanted to use that summer to do something totally different. That's what I did, and I loved it.

Whad you do that you enjoyed so much?

a non-profit that I'm passionate about, but where I don't ever see myself working full-time/permanent.

[Mdenis1]

I haven't red the thread so I apologize if my question has been answered before (I'm currently travelling so trying not to spend too much time online!)

I got into Berkeley and if I choose to attend, would be highly interested in this opportunity: http://www.law.berkeley.edu/155.htm

I was wondering if it was very hard to be selected for that program. It says on the website that they take up to 5 students, but how many Berk students do apply? 10? 20? 40??

If someone has more information about this, I'd greatly appreciate.

[Ling520]

shallow question- how cute are the guys at boalt?

3 years is a long time to be single. i know people say not to date in your law school but blah blah whatever humor me

On this topic, I noticed that the percentage of female students in the class of 2015 is only 51%. I'm suprised by this because I thought Berkeley was unique among the T14 for having a much greater proportion of females in the class (over 60% in some previous classes). Was there an overt effort by Berkeley to even out this ratio?

[tyler.durden]

Tag. Thanks for doing this!

[20130804]

What are the study abroad opportunities like at Berkeley? I know Berkeley itself doesn't have any programs, and the website states that you're welcome to pursue any program on your own. I'm just wondering what percentage of students do this/how easy it is to get your program approved.

Thanks!

[Kronk]

What are the study abroad opportunities like at Berkeley? I know Berkeley itself doesn't have any programs, and the website states that you're welcome to pursue any program on your own. I'm just wondering what percentage of students do this/how easy it is to get your program approved.

Thanks!

Not too many do them (outside of the official UCDC program and stuff like that), but it is very easy to get approved.

[Facebook]

Hi, sorry if the question doesn't fit well here, but this forum is the closest I can find in terms of appropriateness.

I'm a 1L from your beloved rival school across the bay, and this quarter I'm taking a class taught by a visiting professor from Boalt. Is anybody willing to help me find previous outlines and past exams for this professor's class? If so, PM me. I would greatly appreciate it. And needless to say, I will gladly reciprocate the favor in the future should such a chance arise.

[sokomofo]

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[tyler.durden]

hey guys, i'm heavily debating berkeley vs nyu right now, and i would love some of your input!

right now i'm leaning a bit more toward berkeley, mainly because i really want to live/practice in california. i went to nyu for undergrad and i didnt like the city as much as i thought i would. and there's a lot to be said about attending a law school in the area where you want to practice, especially if you dont have ties (i dont - im international)

what keeps me considering nyu is its employment statistics - it seems a lot better than berkeley's. my question is, do you know of anyone at berkeley who were shooting for any firm job (big or small) that didn't get anything?

right now my preferences are: CA big law > CA mid/small law > NY big law > NY mid/small law

i've always been a hard worker, but with everyone being so smart, im not sure how well i will perform in law school. im worried that i might end up with mediocre grades and strike out at OCI. while i do want to end up in california, i would rather be a lawyer in new york than a bum in sf

In the exact same boat!

[Kronk]

It's not like you guys can't get New York from Berkeley. In fact, California jobs are so much fewer than those in NY that I think even Boalt students are probably more likely to get a job in NYC than SF.

But yes, there are certainly people who wanted firm jobs and didn't get anything. I don't know if it's worse than @ NYU. I thought the employment stats were pretty similar. I would say that most of those people probably didn't bid NYC, and most people that did bid NYC got at least something. But there are a lot of people that wanted CA and struck out in CA and a lot of people that struck out totally. IDK, it's just the state of things these days. I am guessing there are a handful of people at both schools that struck out.

[Kiwi917]

hey guys, i'm heavily debating berkeley vs nyu right now, and i would love some of your input!

right now i'm leaning a bit more toward berkeley, mainly because i really want to live/practice in california. i went to nyu for undergrad and i didnt like the city as much as i thought i would. and there's a lot to be said about attending a law school in the area where you want to practice, especially if you dont have ties (i dont - im international)

what keeps me considering nyu is its employment statistics - it seems a lot better than berkeley's. my question is, do you know of anyone at berkeley who were shooting for any firm job (big or small) that didn't get anything?

right now my preferences are: CA big law > CA mid/small law > NY big law > NY mid/small law

i've always been a hard worker, but with everyone being so smart, im not sure how well i will perform in law school. im worried that i might end up with mediocre grades and strike out at OCI. while i do want to end up in california, i would rather be a lawyer in new york than a bum in sf

In the exact same boat!

2L at Boalt here. I considered NYU as well. At this point in the game, my advice would be to attend both admitted student weekends and also wait to see if you get financial aid. Both schools have good enough employment stats that if you get a much better deal at one, it should be a serious factor to consider. The ASW was also a big factor for me; something about NYU just didn't click. I've written about this a bit before, but my two cents is that going to a place where you think you will be happier or less stressed - due to location, friends, debt load, the weather, or just your gut feeling - has a bigger impact on your grades than you might expect.

As for this year's OCI, I don't personally know of anyone who struck out, but I only discussed jobs with a small handful of people. I certainly believe Kronk that there are people who didn't get the CA market or firm jobs at all. For CA biglaw, you might be better off even with mediocre grades from Boalt over NYU. Networking can sometimes overcome mediocre grades, and it might be easier to network in CA if you are here. Ultimately, I don't think the difference in employment stats between NYU and Boalt should outweigh the other factors in your decision.

[sokomofo]

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[DreamShake]

wow there is "a lot of people"? i knew that the market was in the shitter but damn.. do you know roughly what percentage of your class struck out completely?

Another 2L jumping in. I've also talked to only a relatively small portion of the class, but I haven't encountered many who genuinely wanted biglaw yet struck out at OCI. I know a couple who went through the process halfheartedly with straight P's and ended up empty handed. I know a couple more with below median/median-ish grades who genuinely wanted biglaw at least temporarily but struck out. This includes one person who bid heavily on NYC. On the other hand, I know many more who ended up getting multiple offers in a number of markets. Frankly, I think the results generally would've been the same at either NYU or Boalt--your grades at wherever you end up will matter significantly more than where you actually end up, with one notable exception. The exception, as it happens, is the California market, which is very insular and very demanding in terms of having ties to the region. I'd rather be half H/half P at Boalt than a 3.75 at NYU trying to break into CA with no other strong ties.

Oh yeah--w/r/t grades...it can generate some frustration/uncertainty if you're looking into markets that aren't traditionally populated by Boalties, but I think a lot of that ends up being unfounded. All the CA/NYC employers know our grading system and basically determine their cutoffs by counting H's on your transcript (FWIW, I think this benefits students--e.g., I know a couple firms that think their cutoffs are top 10% but actually fall somewhat below that mark). Most of the big, national firms in secondary markets (e.g., Fulbright in TX) will also have a grasp of the grading system. Undoubtedly, though, some of the more regional/second-tier firms probably don't understand it so well. I doubt this is ultimately much of a problem. If your grades are high, you aren't looking at the second tier anyways; if your grades are mediocre/bad, the system probably helps cover that a little bit by making that less obvious.

FWIW, have a classmate who transferred from Boalt to NYU for personal/family reasons and can't wait to get back to the bay