If one of the greater problems of the legal market are some law schools, why don't we just find a way to shut them down! Forum

[totesTheGoat]

If law schools used the example of a certificate system and charged, say, $20,000 for the certificate, I bet many more people would be willing to work serving the poor in low-income legal clinics, supplemented in part by city and state funds, in addition to the clients paying what they could.

If anybody needs a reason to dislike the ABA, this is the perfect one. Law schools are so hamstrung that they can't even offer a proper online course, let alone an alternative certificate program.

I think your idea is a good one, but I think it's orders of magnitude more likely that concerned lawyers literally bulldoze all of the "bad law schools" than the ABA letting somebody practice law without the $200k+ education.

[seashell.economy]

The idea would most definitely require many years to implement and a huge number of "what-ifs" would need to be addressed...I just felt like throwing another idea onto the pile (but an issue that I personally have experience with) : D

[Big Dog]

I bet many more people would be willing to work serving the poor in low-income legal clinics, supplemented in part by city and state funds, in addition to the clients paying what they could.

By putting public monies into the equation, you just revised the pov. Regardless, "I bet" you are incorrect. PI is just not that big of an interest to many jd wannabes. (not suggesting that there is not a need -- there definitely is -- but that lowering LS tuition won't make a bunch of new PI lawyers willing to work for government/clinic wages.)

The 'build-it-they-will-come' logic only works well in movies.

[seashell.economy]

I do believe that most low-income legal clinics are already supplemented by city, state or federal funds. That said, you could very well be right. Many people might not hold an interest in working within a low-income legal clinic setting, even with drastically reduced tuition and reduced time spent in law school. My opinion could be skewed because I personally would love that opportunity.

At the last pre-law event I went to, all three student panelists said that an interest in PI was why they first applied to law school - but after a year or two the prospect of paying off those huge loans became more real and all three were now opting for private sector jobs.

[totesTheGoat]

At the last pre-law event I went to, all three student panelists said that an interest in PI was why they first applied to law school - but after a year or two the prospect of paying off those huge loans became more real and all three were now opting for private sector jobs.

I wonder how much of that is naivete, and how much is legitimate PI candidates being priced out of PI jobs based on their massive debt load. Obviously, the 0Ls looking for "dat $160k PI job" are just naive, and will change their tune when they understand the reality of the law market. However, I'm sure there are some that truly feel called to PI, but can't because they have a $200k boat anchor hanging around their neck.

[AReasonableMan]

Restricting which schools can receive funds will 100% lead to a discrimination lawsuit the government will lose. They should treat it like business loans, and make each prospective student fill out a plan on how they'll make enough to service the loan, and just grant every not completely asinine application. This way they aren't telling the 140 LSAT they can't go to law school, and at the same time are forcing the 140 kid to actually sit down and put their dreams into logical sentences. This in and of itself would take out a significant percentage of the kids who go to law school because they're too lazy to be in the real world.

[pleadthafif]

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[Big Dog]

At the last pre-law event I went to, all three student panelists said that an interest in PI was why they first applied to law school..

I have no doubt that it true. But, dealing with the indigent, is really HARD work, and folks will burn out at government-approved pay rates, even if they have low debt. (And when you thnk about it, most could have low debt since they could easily forgo a higher ranked school to attend a lower-ranked school on scholly. Yet, many choose not to.)

[n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t]

Law's bifurcated salaries hugely disincentivize PI. If you want to support PI causes, it's a lot easier to just do biglaw and donate 100K/year if you want to save the world. A socially inept monkey can get hired into biglaw if they go to a good enough school. For certain PI jobs, like PD for example (the PI about which I'm partially knowledgeable), hiring is much less predictable (the when and where), based less on merit (connections *cough*) and there are far fewer pre-bar openings.

[seashell.economy]

At the last pre-law event I went to, all three student panelists said that an interest in PI was why they first applied to law school..

I have no doubt that it true. But, dealing with the indigent, is really HARD work, and folks will burn out at government-approved pay rates, even if they have low debt. (And when you thnk about it, most could have low debt since they could easily forgo a higher ranked school to attend a lower-ranked school on scholly. Yet, many choose not to.)

Many poor people are very frustrated, uneducated on the way the system works, and can be difficult to work with. I get that. But you also have many experiences with people who are very, very grateful for your help. Those moments are gold. But overall, I agree, the work is tough.