WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions Forum

[LET'S GET IT]

^

It's tough, even with grades. If you are sure you want Chicago, you'd be better off going to UIUC imo.

[hoos89]

I'm not sure how easy Chicago is from UIUC, either. I'd be wary of going there (or here, for that matter) without significant $$. Chicago is a tough market.

[chuckbass]

Anecdotally I heard of a top 10% kid this year that only bid Chicago and struck out, so it seems like there would be no GPA here that would make Chicago a lock. If you'd get substantial money here, then you probably only need a few more points on the LSAT to get into NU and that will give you substantially better prospects in Chicago and overall.

[LET'S GET IT]

Oh I agree. Not saying it's easy from UIUC, but their biglaw numbers are similar to ours, and a majority of their biglaw placement is chi whereas ours is a little more spread out. That's all I was saying. Obviously, if retaking for NU or UCHi is feasible, that would be better, but I was just sticking to the questions s/he asked.

[pamphleteer]

Thanks everyone. I applied ED to NU, was rolled over to RD, still waiting to hear back. Have a 172 so I'm not sure how much good retaking will do (although I'm retaking in February anyway out of desperation to do anything I can to improve my NU odds). If I get into Northwestern though it'll probably be at sticker or close to it given my terrible GPA and lack of significant WE. So significant scholarships at WUSTL or Illinois look enticing.

[chuckbass]

Oh well it sounds like you have a good shot at NU then, and were only rolled to RD since you'd need a better GPA to get the full scholly.

[LET'S GET IT]

Yeah I kind of figured you had a GPA issue. I can relate. I'm sure you've done your due diligence, but I would take a full ride at UIUC over sticker at NU, and I wouldn't have to think twice about it. Just my opinion.

[DoveBodyWash]

Hey guys. Still waiting to hear back on $$ from WUSTL and still waiting to hear back on a decision, period, from UIUC so I know this is a bit premature but I'm thinking I'll get substantial schollies at both schools. I have a strong preference for the Chicago market, so would you advise me to attend Illinois over WUSTL (assuming similar COA) despite the difference in preftige/national recognition/rank/etc.? In general how difficult is it for WUSTL students to crack the Chicago market? Do more students who land a firm gig end up there than NYC or is it the other way around? Thanks!

Way more BigLaw placement in nyc. From what I know only five 2Ls will be summering with Chicago BigLaw. At least one other kid had offer but chose another market. And one more is going to firm there but it's not BigLaw. Chicago is a tough market from most schools. More Chicago firms will attend UIUC OCI, but they won't be hiring a ton of them. Personally I think you're better off going to UIUC if Chicago is such a priority for you

[valen]

How dangerous is Forest Park really? I've heard conflicting things.

[chuckbass]

How dangerous is Forest Park really? I've heard conflicting things.

Oh, I've never heard that it was dangerous. It's always seemed fine to me.

[LET'S GET IT]

How dangerous is Forest Park really? I've heard conflicting things.

Oh, I've never heard that it was dangerous. It's always seemed fine to me.

Yeah that's weird, I've never heard that either. Pretty much all the area around school is nice. Forest Park is actually really great imo.

Edit: the whole "STL is super dangerous" narrative is way overblown. It's just like any other city in that there are bad areas, and you just avoid them if possible. Frankly, I feel much safer here than where I moved from.

[chuckbass]

How dangerous is Forest Park really? I've heard conflicting things.

Oh, I've never heard that it was dangerous. It's always seemed fine to me.

Yeah that's weird, I've never heard that either. Pretty much all the area around school is nice. Forest Park is actually really great imo.

I'm now terrified of the park wtf.

[valen]

I've just heard that muggings have occurred there, maybe just in more secluded parts? I don't know. The park looks awesome but I don't want to go running through there if I'm going to be jumped.

[georgej]

I've just heard that muggings have occurred there, maybe just in more secluded parts? I don't know. The park looks awesome but I don't want to go running through there if I'm going to be jumped.

The scariest thing I've seen in Forest Park was a family of ducks watching a yoga class and trying to do the poses. They seemed inflexible. Whether or not that could drive them to mug you in the park is debatable, though. I wouldn't worry.

[notedgarfigaro]

I've just heard that muggings have occurred there, maybe just in more secluded parts? I don't know. The park looks awesome but I don't want to go running through there if I'm going to be jumped.

I've never heard of anyone getting mugged in the park. Now, the parking garage is a different story...

[dietcoke0]

Park is super safe. I run in the park probably 3 times a week, for almost 3 years, all times of the day (day break and dusk) although I am a guy, I just don't see where you could mug someone if you were running/walking/biking. On decent days, you are dodging a shit ton of people just on the paths. I guess if you are venturing in the wooded areas there might be some seedy underbelly, but if you are looking to run or bike, I don't think there would be any issue if the sun is around.

At night, I dunno. I move out to Lindell when the sun sets, but park of it is because the gravel paths already suck, and I cut through some of the less known paths, that don't have lights, to get back to CWE.

BTW, I was trying to find actual news stories of muggings in Forest Park, and Google was only bringing up Forest Park in Queens, NY.

Only one I saw in St. Louis was: http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crim ... 18e53.html

There has been two murders in the last week, one in a hotel in a decent area, and one outside a movie theater in a nice area. Shit is random in this city, and I wouldn't be worried about the Park.

[valen]

Great, that makes me feel much better about running there. I'll be coming from out of state so I'm really looking forward to checking out the park on ASW. Do you recommend any areas in particular for running? I'm a fan of wooded trails but open to checking out other types of areas.

[PeanutsNJam]

Anecdotally I heard of a top 10% kid this year that only bid Chicago and struck out, so it seems like there would be no GPA here that would make Chicago a lock. If you'd get substantial money here, then you probably only need a few more points on the LSAT to get into NU and that will give you substantially better prospects in Chicago and overall.

Any reason he didn't xfer to chicago/nu if he's top 10%?

[LET'S GET IT]

Anecdotally I heard of a top 10% kid this year that only bid Chicago and struck out, so it seems like there would be no GPA here that would make Chicago a lock. If you'd get substantial money here, then you probably only need a few more points on the LSAT to get into NU and that will give you substantially better prospects in Chicago and overall.

Any reason he didn't xfer to chicago/nu if he's top 10%?

A lot of people here have the belief (and it makes sense), that it only makes sense to transfer if you are in the 10%-33% range. If you are below top third, you don't really have the option to transfer. If you are top 10%, people think that you are somewhat "safe" for a biglaw gig since you will get a ton of interviews, and if you are here on a full ride, why transfer to NU and take on the extra debt for the same likely outcome? So it basically negates the advantages of transferring. Obviously there are exceptions, but I think this is the general logic. Elders, feel free to tell me I'm off my rocker.

Edit: Also, you are probably assuming as I did, that everyone has done their due diligence and is aware of job prospects, importance of grades, transferring options and requirements, etc. Spoiler alert: you'd be shocked how many people here don't know much about this stuff. Some people really think that the CSO will take care of all the job stuff for you.

[JCougar]

Hey guys. Still waiting to hear back on $$ from WUSTL and still waiting to hear back on a decision, period, from UIUC so I know this is a bit premature but I'm thinking I'll get substantial schollies at both schools. I have a strong preference for the Chicago market, so would you advise me to attend Illinois over WUSTL (assuming similar COA) despite the difference in preftige/national recognition/rank/etc.? In general how difficult is it for WUSTL students to crack the Chicago market? Do more students who land a firm gig end up there than NYC or is it the other way around? Thanks!

It's difficult for anyone to crack the Chicago market. It's just a mess right now. There's too many schools in the Midwest all trying to place into Chicago. There's like 6 Tier 1 Big-10 schools trying to place their top 10% (although at this point, probably top 5%) into the market. Then there's private regionals like WUSTL and ND. Most of the good jobs go to Chicago/Northwestern grads, but even those schools are not safe bets for Chicago. After I graduated, I volunteered for a year with graduates of UChi that couldn't get interviews in Chicago. Even Chicago students will tell you that it's possible to get boned at OCI unless you put some focus on New York. Then there's the occasional DePaul/Loyola/IIT-Kent law review editors taking up further spots.

To coincide with that, Illinois lost more population than any other state this last year. That's not exactly conducive to creating more demand for lawyers.

The only other market out there that might be harder to crack than Chicago at this point is probably DC. No matter what school you go to, you have to broaden your job search strategy.

[JCougar]

How dangerous is Forest Park really? I've heard conflicting things.

Not dangerous at all.

[JCougar]

Would you recommend GW over WUSTL in terms of job prospects? (I am hopelessly non-preferred waitlisted by GULC)

There is no reason to think GW would give you a better shot in terms of job prospects than WUSTL. Given the fact that that DC is insanely more expensive to live in, I'd take WUSTL if both offered equal tuition. I don't even know that GW offers measurably better DC placement. Both schools are kind of a hot mess below top third. GULC isn't much better, and it's very stingy with scholarships.

[JCougar]

There has been two murders in the last week, one in a hotel in a decent area, and one outside a movie theater in a nice area. Shit is random in this city, and I wouldn't be worried about the Park.

The Drury Inn murderer wasn't even from St. Louis. He came from downstate, was passing through, and the hotel was just off the freeway.

St. Louis isn't crime-free, but they've been making a lot of progress in certain neighborhoods like the Central West End and the Loop. In fact, the Central West End (on the eastern edge of Forrest Park, WUSTL is on the west edge), was voted one of the 10 best neighborhoods in all of America by the American Planning Association:

http://www.stltoday.com/business/column ... 8d886.html

Tower Grove South can be hit or miss, but a lot of grad students seem to like living there. If you want to live on the edge, there's a lot of art students that live near Cherokee Street. That's not the place for people who are unaccustomed to urban living, but I think it's where a lot of the best music/bars/food are.

[sublime]

..

[chuckbass]

In my experience the StL has a ton of crime thing is overblown. I haven't ever felt unsafe and I have never had a problem and don't know anybody personally who has ever had a problem.

I haven't had a problem, but I do feel less safe here than in DC or Philly even because the population density is so low that the streets can get really dead, which just freaks me out.