Where to go with my undergrad summer legal experience. Forum

[Kafkaesquire]

It's obvious to me that the FLSA was intended to prevent employeed from being scammed. It does not, in my opinion, say it is illegal for someone to offer their services to a place of business (a for-profit, I guess, is the correct term) free of charge.

No, it does. See this: http://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs71.htm

(Internships with for-profits usually fail on this requirement: "The employer that provides the training derives no immediate advantage from the activities of the intern; and on occasion its operations may actually be impeded." Also that the training would be similar to that found in an educational institution.)

In a completely unbiased way, I can say that arguably my time at this firm could meet all six requirements. I wrote that settlement brochure in like two weeks, dude. The main partner asked me to hand it to him for like six consecutive days. I was slowing that process down a lot. He expected me to hand it over in like two days (a joke, IMO).

And another attorney taught me how to write the brochure, taught me valuable writing skills, gave me her personal writing guide, etc. I am also, on a daily basis, asking questions and receiving answers about the definition of legal words and proceedings. I am visiting real trials, and learning what goes on there, even if to a minuscule extent. This isn't a case of Stockholm's syndrome. I'm not being scammed. This isn't a bad scenario.

And to the clueless poster below (Desert Fox), what you said is true, but I'm not an employee. That has already been established.

OP you seem like a dick and I get that you want your summer job to sound cool and your connections to pay off but this forum generally deals with an entirely different league of firms and attorneys and an unpaid UG job doesn't make you a special snowflake.

Okay, I get that, and I need to get over myself. Really. I thought it would make me a little special, and maybe I have a big ego, but I can get over that. For now, I'm just going to work toward leveraging this to get a paid position (I am not going to accept another unpaid position. One is fine, it gets my foot in the door. Two is too far.)

By the way, do you resort to name calling when you bring up points so confidently and then fail to prove them, or what it something I said?

[Kafkaesquire]

I know lots of people who were paralegals for years at prestigious firms, but their connections meant absolutely nothing for finding a job for their 2L summer. All that mattered was what law school you attended and your 1L grades.

Basically, what you're doing is fine, but probably not a good strategy for getting a job out of law school. But at least you're gaining experience and discovering if you could do this for the rest of your career. So it's pretty legit.

Yeah this. I was a legal assistant for a year at a big firm and they didn't even call me back (they didnt come to our OCI but I reached out to someone I knew personally). However, its been a good experience to sell in a lot of other interviews.

I can believe that. Admittedly, the firm I was at was small, and the opportunity to build real relationships, because it was so laid back, was actually quite abundant. I don't think I could pull that off at a big firm, especially without any real legal education.

[A. Nony Mouse]

In a completely unbiased way, I can say that arguably my time at this firm could meet all six requirements. I wrote that settlement brochure in like two weeks, dude. The main partner asked me to hand it to him for like six consecutive days. I was slowing that process down a lot. He expected me to hand it over in like two days (a joke, IMO).

And another attorney taught me how to write the brochure, taught me valuable writing skills, gave me her personal writing guide, etc. I am also, on a daily basis, asking questions and receiving answers about the definition of legal words and proceedings. I am visiting real trials, and learning what goes on there, even if to a minuscule extent. This isn't a case of Stockholm's syndrome. I'm not being scammed. This isn't a bad scenario.

And to the clueless poster below (Desert Fox), what you said is true, but I'm not an employee. That has already been established.

Did you read this part?

In general, the more an internship program is structured around a classroom or academic experience as opposed to the employer’s actual operations, the more likely the internship will be viewed as an extension of the individual’s educational experience (this often occurs where a college or university exercises oversight over the internship program and provides educational credit). The more the internship provides the individual with skills that can be used in multiple employment settings, as opposed to skills particular to one employer’s operation, the more likely the intern would be viewed as receiving training. Under these circumstances the intern does not perform the routine work of the business on a regular and recurring basis, and the business is not dependent upon the work of the intern. On the other hand, if the interns are engaged in the operations of the employer or are performing productive work (for example, filing, performing other clerical work, or assisting customers), then the fact that they may be receiving some benefits in the form of a new skill or improved work habits will not exclude them from the FLSA’s minimum wage and overtime requirements because the employer benefits from the interns’ work.

[Kafkaesquire]

In a completely unbiased way, I can say that arguably my time at this firm could meet all six requirements. I wrote that settlement brochure in like two weeks, dude. The main partner asked me to hand it to him for like six consecutive days. I was slowing that process down a lot. He expected me to hand it over in like two days (a joke, IMO).

And another attorney taught me how to write the brochure, taught me valuable writing skills, gave me her personal writing guide, etc. I am also, on a daily basis, asking questions and receiving answers about the definition of legal words and proceedings. I am visiting real trials, and learning what goes on there, even if to a minuscule extent. This isn't a case of Stockholm's syndrome. I'm not being scammed. This isn't a bad scenario.

And to the clueless poster below (Desert Fox), what you said is true, but I'm not an employee. That has already been established.

Did you read this part?

In general, the more an internship program is structured around a classroom or academic experience as opposed to the employer’s actual operations, the more likely the internship will be viewed as an extension of the individual’s educational experience (this often occurs where a college or university exercises oversight over the internship program and provides educational credit). The more the internship provides the individual with skills that can be used in multiple employment settings, as opposed to skills particular to one employer’s operation, the more likely the intern would be viewed as receiving training. Under these circumstances the intern does not perform the routine work of the business on a regular and recurring basis, and the business is not dependent upon the work of the intern. On the other hand, if the interns are engaged in the operations of the employer or are performing productive work (for example, filing, performing other clerical work, or assisting customers), then the fact that they may be receiving some benefits in the form of a new skill or improved work habits will not exclude them from the FLSA’s minimum wage and overtime requirements because the employer benefits from the interns’ work.

Yes, but I wasn't going to bring that up on my own. You want me to dig my own grave? No, I'll make you dig it for me.

Point proven. The situation was illegal. I guess I could sue the firm. Then I would feel guilty for all the illegal things I've been caught doing and not punished for, like that time that cop pulled me over while I was smo....

I'll just stop there.

[A. Nony Mouse]

No one is saying you should sue the firm.

[Kafkaesquire]

No one is saying you should sue the firm.

Geez, talk about uptight. Can you not afford a little comic relief after that heated argument?

EDIT: I never even said I thought I should sue the firm, much less imply that that was suggested. Lol.... Geez. I can see how law school could give me grey hairs at such a young age. Have more fun with your arguments. Everything is not so serious. You're going to die soon, anyway. Might as well enjoy it, right?

[A. Nony Mouse]

If you say so, dude.

[Kafkaesquire]

If you say so, dude.

Sorry. Sometimes I let my immaturity show.

[RodneyRuxin]

Sometimes I let my immaturity show.

This.

/thread