The Minnesota Legal Market - UMN, WM, UST, HM, Iowa/Wisc Forum

[PomasThynchon]

Is getting students from coastal schools with no connections to Minnesota difficult because of the way firms hire, or would you say it's mostly self-selection?

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

To be honest, a little of both, but I meant self selection by the students.

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Taking questions this week again.

[Prairie]

Thanks so much for taking q's again. I found your earlier info extremely helpful. I hope you will suffer a general question: are students with humanities UG degrees (and not economics) at a decided disadvantage when it comes to hiring? It is my suspicion that this is the case. So, a follow up question. What can one do to improve his/her marketability while in law school, assuming one has one of these humanities degrees?

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Students with humanities degrees are not at a great disadvantage. By and large, we don't typically focus on someone's undergraduate degree. It can be helpful in some areas (Corporate - Business), and necessary in others (IP - hard science). However, an undergraduate major isn't something we focus on. The university name is something we focus on, but as long as it is a school we have heard of, it is usually fine.

[Prairie]

Students with humanities degrees are not at a great disadvantage. By and large, we don't typically focus on someone's undergraduate degree. It can be helpful in some areas (Corporate - Business), and necessary in others (IP - hard science). However, an undergraduate major isn't something we focus on. The university name is something we focus on, but as long as it is a school we have heard of, it is usually fine.

Thank you very much!

[ScrabbleChamp]

When hiring, how much impact do connections to the area matter? If a prospective associate attends a local school, but has no other connections to the area, is it a problem? Also, in your opinion, how do older (i.e. 32) applicants, applicants with established family lives (married, children, etc...) fare against others?

[deadpoetnsp]

Taking questions this week again.

Thank you for answering questions.

I'm an international applicant, with an MS in engineering from a Midwestern university. I have a couple of years of IP experience, in a role similar to a patent agent.

I don't have ties to any particular geographical region. However, my wife has accepted a very good job in the Twin-Cities area, and that's one of the reasons why I plan to go to the U of Minnesota Law School (they have offered a substantial scholarship too). Will my employability in the Twin Cities market be affected for any of the following reasons: 1) I'm not a US citizen/resident, 2) I don't have a US undergrad degree, or 3) I don't have ties to the area

[freskie]

If I have significant ties to the Twin Cities (I've lived here all my life...), and want to work in Minneapolis upon graduation, would attending a T-10 school be more beneficial than attending the U? or vice versa? Let's say I'm going for Big Law in Minneapolis.

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Would attending a T-10 school be more beneficial than attending the U? or vice versa? Let's say I'm going for Big Law in Minneapolis.

You should likely attend the top ten school. Most large law firms in Minneapolis will go very deep into the law school class at a top school. We do not go nearly as deep at Minnesota, as we have significant leverage over the top students at UMN.

When hiring, how much impact do connections to the area matter? If a prospective associate attends a local school, but has no other connections to the area, is it a problem? Also, in your opinion, how do older (i.e. 32) applicants, applicants with established family lives (married, children, etc...) fare against others?

If you attend one of the Minnesota law schools, no one is going to question your desire to live in Minnesota. However, this is a very provincial part of the country and there is a general desire to promote from within the community. That being said, qualifications always trump regionalism.

Will the following negtively affect recruiting out of law school:
1) I'm not a US citizen/resident;
This could be a problem. Many employers will skip the hassel by hiring an American citizen over a foreign resident. You will likely have better chances with employers on the coast. I should say that your prospects will be better if you have language skills that are in demand (read Chinese; Japanese; Spanish; Korean; German).

2) I don't have a US undergrad degree; and/or
The same problem I mentioned previously. The problem is that no employer will know where exactly you went to university, and this becomes difficult to judge. You may have to jump through hurdles that other people do not.

3) I don't have ties to the area.
This is can be, but is rarely, a problem. Credentials are what will matter in the end.

[PomasThynchon]

Sorry for the late bump, but I noticed BC on here. What about BU?

[freskie]

[quote="MinnesotaBigLaw11"]Would attending a T-10 school be more beneficial than attending the U? or vice versa? Let's say I'm going for Big Law in Minneapolis.

You should likely attend the top ten school. Most large law firms in Minneapolis will go very deep into the law school class at a top school. We do not go nearly as deep at Minnesota, as we have significant leverage over the top students at UMN.

Thanks for the info! Do you think this hold true for schools such as Vanderbilt and UCLA? I'm really trying to get a sense of what schools would position me best for the Minneapolis market, while balancing this with debt.

[FuturMinn]

MinnesotaBigLaw11:

Do you have any insight into jobs at hedge funds coming out of UST (i.e. legal counsel) or if any firms in MN have a corp bankruptcy practice. I haven't been able to find anything on this? Any info you can provide will be helpful.

[typ3]

MinnesotaBigLaw11:

Do you have any insight into jobs at hedge funds coming out of UST (i.e. legal counsel) or if any firms in MN have a corp bankruptcy practice. I haven't been able to find anything on this? Any info you can provide will be helpful.

If you want to do chapt 11 you should go to Chicago area. There are some firms that do chapt 11 in minneapolis, but they aren't big corporation clients. They are usually your mom and pops / less than 50 employee ventures.

[FuturMinn]

Thanks Typ3. Any ideas on how UST places in Chicago? Or, how I can obtain employment stats? (hard numbers of graduates employer in Chicago top 250 law firms) Will schools disclose this information?

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Sorry for the late bump, but I noticed BC on here. What about BU?

BU is a good school as well. BC and Harvard are the two Boston schools to which we send attorneys for OCI. We would interview BU students though, as it is a good school.

Thanks for the info! Do you think this hold true for schools such as Vanderbilt and UCLA? I'm really trying to get a sense of what schools would position me best for the Minneapolis market, while balancing this with debt.

I think you would be better served attending Minnesota over Vanderb or UCLA. They are both good schools, but they likely won't help you get your foot in the door anymore than UMN.

Do you have any insight into jobs at hedge funds coming out of UST (i.e. legal counsel) or if any firms in MN have a corp bankruptcy practice. I haven't been able to find anything on this? Any info you can provide will be helpful.

There are a good number of hedge funds in the cities, as well as mutual funds and investment advisers. Faegre is sort of the go-to firm for investment management in the twin cities. Dorsey and Frederikson also have good practices.

For bankruptcy, Dorsey Faegre and Robins handle the large instiutional bankruptcies. These are your tier one bankruptcy firms that represent the large Minnesota companies.

In sum, if you are looking to do high-end investment management or bankruptcy work, you'll want to do well at UST and try to get a position at one of these firms.

[FuturMinn]

Thanks, MinnesotaBigLaw11! I am going to Minneapolis for the first time in a few weeks, so hopefully that will help with my decision re: UST. Thanks--this thread has definitely been very helpful.

[Kaves]

I have a question, how is the University of Wisconsin Madison viewed in hiring? I am in state at WI so tuition is super cheap but I also have a full ride UST & good deal at WM. I really want to end up back in the twin cities but I still have a feeling Madison is a better choice.

What is your take on this?

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Wisconsin places well in the cities. There is a lot of supply of law students generally, and Madison is no exception. Especially for the larger firms in Minneapolis, who often pick at least one or two of the UW law review students. As with any (and all) law schools, you'll have to do well, but Wisconsin is a good school from which firms hire. I don't know of a firm (at least one with over 50 attorneys) that doesn't send recruiters to Wisconsin.

[Prairie]

Wisconsin places well in the cities. There is a lot of supply of law students generally, and Madison is no exception. Especially for the larger firms in Minneapolis, who often pick at least one or two of the UW law review students. As with any (and all) law schools, you'll have to do well, but Wisconsin is a good school from which firms hire. I don't know of a firm (at least one with over 50 attorneys) that doesn't send recruiters to Wisconsin.

Which places better in MSP, all things being equal, Wisconsin or Iowa?

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Wisconsin and Iowa place pretty equally. I don't think there is too big of a distinction between them and I think most people consider them interchangeable.

[Prairie]

Wisconsin and Iowa place pretty equally. I don't think there is too big of a distinction between them and I think most people consider them interchangeable.

thank you!

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Wisconsin and Iowa place pretty equally. I don't think there is too big of a distinction between them and I think most people consider them interchangeable.

thank you!

Unless you mean in football, because that is a different story.

[MinnesotaBigLaw11]

Taking questions again this week.

[ScrabbleChamp]

Taking questions again this week.

I've been told UST, though a newer law school, has a very strong alumni base that helps in hiring. Have you heard this, or is this just crap?