Michigan 1Ls/2Ls/3Ls taking questions Forum

[BuckinghamB]

I have a fairly specific question regarding OCP that I would rather not post publicly. Would any 2/3Ls be willing to PM me? TYIA.

[Kurst]

This doesn't at all factor in the cost of living over 1L (and potentially 2L) summer.

Amazingly enough, that's why I prefaced my statement by saying "$12,000 for 8 months is more than enough." OP asked about the 8 month cost-of-living, so rather than be a negative fool, like you always are, I answered the question that was asked and did so in a helpful way.

How is it that you are nearing graduation and still can't read critically?

Is this a display of Michigan's celebrated collegiality?

[BuckinghamB]

This doesn't at all factor in the cost of living over 1L (and potentially 2L) summer.

Amazingly enough, that's why I prefaced my statement by saying "$12,000 for 8 months is more than enough." OP asked about the 8 month cost-of-living, so rather than be a negative fool, like you always are, I answered the question that was asked and did so in a helpful way.

How is it that you are nearing graduation and still can't read critically?

Is this a display of Michigan's celebrated collegiality?

My experience has been that it's living up to the collegial reputation so far FWIW (I'm a 1L).

[keg411]

I have a fairly specific question regarding OCP that I would rather not post publicly. Would any 2/3Ls be willing to PM me? TYIA.

You can PM me if you want.

[UnamSanctam]

This doesn't at all factor in the cost of living over 1L (and potentially 2L) summer.

Amazingly enough, that's why I prefaced my statement by saying "$12,000 for 8 months is more than enough." OP asked about the 8 month cost-of-living, so rather than be a negative fool, like you always are, I answered the question that was asked and did so in a helpful way.

How is it that you are nearing graduation and still can't read critically?

Is this a display of Michigan's celebrated collegiality?

My experience has been that it's living up to the collegial reputation so far FWIW (I'm a 1L).

Yeah, everybody in 1L has been incredibly collegial, but we also haven't hit exam gunner time yet, either.

[BuckinghamB]

I have a fairly specific question regarding OCP that I would rather not post publicly. Would any 2/3Ls be willing to PM me? TYIA.

You can PM me if you want.

PM'd. Thanks!

[BuckinghamB]

My experience has been that it's living up to the collegial reputation so far FWIW (I'm a 1L).

Yeah, everybody in 1L has been incredibly collegial, but we also haven't hit exam gunner time yet, either.

This is a good point.

[ArtVandelayy]

For anyone considering Michigan, I'll give you my take as a young 1L: the people are terrible. Pompous, conceited, know-it-all, etc.

I came here searching for collegiality and friendly people but have yet to encounter either, unfortunately.

[UnamSanctam]

For anyone considering Michigan, I'll give you my take as a young 1L: the people are terrible. Pompous, conceited, know-it-all, etc.

I came here searching for collegiality and friendly people but have yet to encounter either, unfortunately.

I don't know. I can see this argument but I think it's all in perception. Tell me more.

[ArtVandelayy]

For anyone considering Michigan, I'll give you my take as a young 1L: the people are terrible. Pompous, conceited, know-it-all, etc.

I came here searching for collegiality and friendly people but have yet to encounter either, unfortunately.

I don't know. I can see this argument but I think it's all in perception. Tell me more.

Much of my opinion has been formed on the people in my section/4-section classes. Sections are so restrictive that there could very well be people I'd get along with that I've just never met.

Regardless, it's been a pretty average semester. I have no desire to spend any time at the school once I'm finished with class. It kinda sucks.

[UnamSanctam]

For anyone considering Michigan, I'll give you my take as a young 1L: the people are terrible. Pompous, conceited, know-it-all, etc.

I came here searching for collegiality and friendly people but have yet to encounter either, unfortunately.

I don't know. I can see this argument but I think it's all in perception. Tell me more.

Much of my opinion has been formed on the people in my section/4-section classes. Sections are so restrictive that there could very well be people I'd get along with that I've just never met.

Regardless, it's been a pretty average semester. I have no desire to spend any time at the school once I'm finished with class. It kinda sucks.

Yeah I'm like a bat out of hell at the end of the day too, although more because I need to get away from law rather than the people themselves. I don't want you to out yourself obviously so I won't ask which section you're in, but I will say it would be interesting if we were in the same one.

[BuckinghamB]

Sorry to hear about that bro. There are definitely some people like that in my 90 person section, but it just makes me laugh more than anything (though it is annoying). But in my 40ish person class, I can't think of one person who is truly pretentious--maybe I got lucky? Anyway, the point is there are normals in our class I promise. Seinfeld is the shit btw (artvandelay).

[Pazman]

Could you elaborate a bit more about these terrible 'pompous, conceited, know-it-all' types? As someone who is strongly considering Michigan, I find this feedback a bit disheartening, and slightly unbelievable tbh. How long have you been a 1L? Do you come from a vastly different background than your classmates? I find it strange that out of such a large pool of intelligent people, you wouldn't be able to connect with anyone. Has anyone else had similar issues, or is OP an outlier? Thanks for your responses

[AreJay711]

Its law school and we're all adults -- there are going to be pretentious tools and there are going to be people you don't get along with. At least in my section, people made an effort to be inclusive, even to people who were very different / we didn't hang out with much. It sucks that maybe not all of them this year are like that.

For ArtVandelayy, you might just be with the wrong group of people. I feel like it is easy to start hanging out with a group of people through circumstance and inertial that isn't really your type. I know some people who I wouldn't want to hang around after class in my section and I thinkam positive they'd say the same about the people I gravitate towards. That's normal.

[ArtVandelayy]

Its law school and we're all adults -- there are going to be pretentious tools and there are going to be people you don't get along with. At least in my section, people made an effort to be inclusive, even to people who were very different / we didn't hang out with much. It sucks that maybe not all of them this year are like that.

For ArtVandelayy, you might just be with the wrong group of people. I feel like it is easy to start hanging out with a group of people through circumstance and inertial that isn't really your type. I know some people who I wouldn't want to hang around after class in my section and I thinkam positive they'd say the same about the people I gravitate towards. That's normal.

It can't be that I'm with the wrong group of people because I'm not really with any group. I haven't met any people that have been especially friendly or inviting.

To the 0L a few posts up, I'm just giving my honest opinion. Not trying to discourage you from coming here. It's obviously a fantastic school and can open up many doors. But socially, I'm not enjoying it in the least bit, and I think my grades will suffer because I've spent most of the semester beating myself up for coming here over another school that I really loved. I've thought long and hard about whether I even want to stay in law school, despite aspiring for this my entire life.

By pompous and conceited, I mean exactly that. I came straight through from a top 5 public university, while it seems like mostly everyone is either older or from a more prestigious school...and boy don't they know it. I feel incredibly out of place as a 22-year-old with no real life experience.

So, as a brief summary, I've had a pretty shitty two months here. But it sounds like everyone else has loved their time. So take my opinon FWIW.

[keg411]

Being older doesn't mean you're preftigious. It just means you're old. (And I say this as someone who is old ). But on a serious note, don't worry about people trying to out-credential each other. It doesn't matter in the long run. I am the least preftigious person ever, and I'm here.

There are more than plenty of straight-through 22/23 people at the law school/in A2. Unless you're telling me that the 1L class really is all olds and then maybe I need to hang out with them more .

Also, is there a reason you haven't joined any group or made any friends? Have you gone to any parties or club meetings or just tried talking to people in general? I mean, I don't always love UMich or the people or A2, but sometimes you just have to push yourself to go out and meet people and have a good time. I know we're coming up on finals right now, and it's basically "study 24/7" time, but try reaching out to people next semester and see if it helps. People aren't really bad as long as you are social and friendly. If you stick to yourself, people will ignore you and will think that you just want to be left alone.

[Eva_Bates]

ArtVandelayy: This actually really worries me: I'm considering Michigan for next year, and frankly being socially isolated for three years, let alone two months, is definitely not a position I would want to be in (for both personal sanity and the effect it has on grades). I think 'community' - to say it broadly - is definitely a make-or-break topic before I commit to a law school. (And considering Michigan's emphasis on this, even more so).

Not to be too prying, but would you have considered yourself a very (or somewhat) social person during undergraduate? Did anything like this happen during undergraduate, or not at all?

Was your undergraduate also at a non-city, heavily university-centric school like Ann Arbor?

Do you live in the Lawyer's Club? (Effect on socialization / connections to other law students?)

Thanks for responding - and I am definitely open to hearing what others have to say about this topic too. I understand it's law school - social life is not a priority - but the idea that people are so unwelcoming and closed-off is... scary.

[Eva_Bates]

One more question:

Summer start?!?

-More competitive people? (Than in fall-start sections)?
-Any real advantage? (Assuming high, so-so, and low grades)?
-Anything and everything else - Wisdom - you'd like to impact would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[46nyc]

Its law school and we're all adults -- there are going to be pretentious tools and there are going to be people you don't get along with. At least in my section, people made an effort to be inclusive, even to people who were very different / we didn't hang out with much. It sucks that maybe not all of them this year are like that.

For ArtVandelayy, you might just be with the wrong group of people. I feel like it is easy to start hanging out with a group of people through circumstance and inertial that isn't really your type. I know some people who I wouldn't want to hang around after class in my section and I thinkam positive they'd say the same about the people I gravitate towards. That's normal.

It can't be that I'm with the wrong group of people because I'm not really with any group. I haven't met any people that have been especially friendly or inviting.

To the 0L a few posts up, I'm just giving my honest opinion. Not trying to discourage you from coming here. It's obviously a fantastic school and can open up many doors. But socially, I'm not enjoying it in the least bit, and I think my grades will suffer because I've spent most of the semester beating myself up for coming here over another school that I really loved. I've thought long and hard about whether I even want to stay in law school, despite aspiring for this my entire life.

By pompous and conceited, I mean exactly that. I came straight through from a top 5 public university, while it seems like mostly everyone is either older or from a more prestigious school...and boy don't they know it. I feel incredibly out of place as a 22-year-old with no real life experience.

So, as a brief summary, I've had a pretty shitty two months here. But it sounds like everyone else has loved their time. So take my opinon FWIW.

Really sorry to hear this ArtVandelayy I'm 22, didn't go to a prestigious university, and I feel like I've had the opposite experience as you. And my friends here are old, young, prestigious, not-prestigious. I definitely can think of people who have the characteristics you're talking about, but they're a small minority (at least in my section). I don't want 0Ls to feel discouraged from coming to Michigan because of ArtVandelayy's opinion but I also think his/her opinion shouldn't be disregarded either. I don't have time to follow TLS right now, but if anyone wants to PM me for details about going to Michigan or whatever, feel free.

[06102016]

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[keg411]

Michigan is a big law school with a lot of students. Do you guys think this has any impact on the average student's interactions with career services?

also, are there any quirks you guys know of RE: OCI compared with other schools? any Michigan-specific tips for people who might end up there?

OCS has gotten some heat in the past, but they seem to be making an effort to improve. They've been having a ton of open sessions this year (though I can't speak to them, since I'm fortunately an employed 3L).

OCI: the thing I'd say that's the biggest "quirk" is that we only have one week of OCI (it goes from Tuesday-Friday), whereas it seems like a lot of other top schools have two weeks worth or at least there's a weekend in between. Other than that, it's just a straightforward lottery (i.e. no pre-select element like UVA, and no rank-by-day like Cornell's NY fair). If you end up here, what you do from there is really going to depend on which markets you are targeting and what your 1L grades are.

[06102016]

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[keg411]

Thanks for the response. More about OCI: How well-represented are Los Angeles offices these days? You know anyone who's made the jump/returned there?

I honestly don't know anyone that even applied to LA firms, so I can't really help you (I do know people that went to SF with no problem, but that's a totally different market).

[mindarmed]

Thanks for the response. More about OCI: How well-represented are Los Angeles offices these days? You know anyone who's made the jump/returned there?

I honestly don't know anyone that even applied to LA firms, so I can't really help you (I do know people that went to SF with no problem, but that's a totally different market).

keg, can you speak on the transition from NY/NJ to A2? I don't really have the money to get out there and I'd like a perspective from someone that is comparable to mine.

ETA: Do law students attend football games/how's the placement in NY been with your experience in OCI?

[keg411]

Thanks for the response. More about OCI: How well-represented are Los Angeles offices these days? You know anyone who's made the jump/returned there?

I honestly don't know anyone that even applied to LA firms, so I can't really help you (I do know people that went to SF with no problem, but that's a totally different market).

keg, can you speak on the transition from NY/NJ to A2? I don't really have the money to get out there and I'd like a perspective from someone that is comparable to mine.

ETA: Do law students attend football games/how's the placement in NY been with your experience in OCI?

I really suggest that if you get in, you come to ASW. I came to Mich "sight unseen" and while I've adjusted eventually, I kind of wish I visited first. PM me for more details on transitioning, the "culture shock", etc.

To answer your other questions:
1) YES - law students go the football games. I got season tickets every year I've been here, and it's super-fun. I have to admit, the football games definitely factored into my decision to come here .

2) NYC placement is perfectly fine. I'm working there are so are a whole bunch of my friends. However, so much of OCI depends on your 1L grades, your interview skills, etc., that it's 100% hard to say how each person individually is going to end up doing. If you're looking at similar schools with similar $$, it's really best to just figure out where you feel like you'll be in an atmosphere where you can get the best possible grades and the rest will follow . All of the T14's place well in NYC; especially when you have ties (which you do).