Penn Students Taking Questions Forum

[Georgiana]

So what's better to have - consistent grades or mixture of good and not so good? Does it help a lot to have an A, or does it hurt a lot to have an B-? I know it's too general of a question, but I just want some opinions/viewpoints.

Depends on who your audience is.

Firms: You can probably explain one B or B- in 1L and they'll share an anecdote about their crappy grade in x class as a law student and they'll remember you for being a real person (note: does not apply at all law firms). After 1L, law firms don't really care as long as you graduate without looking like a fool.

Judges: Current clerks have good grades and compare you to themselves, not just to the other applicants. If their grades were better than yours they'll laugh that you applied. If you're aiming for a competitive court you should be seeing A-, A, A+ a majority of the time. If you're more relaxed about where you want to clerk, you'll be fine with a good mix of grades.

Registrar: You should be consistently above the curve. One B- won't kill you, but getting a bunch of A-'s and B+'s isnt going to get you latins and if you aren't certain the A+ exists (bc you haven't gotten one) you probably wont be getting magna and you definitely aren't getting summa.

[r6_philly]

Does latin even matter?

I guess I won't be clerking.

[Georgiana]

Does latin even matter?

I guess I won't be clerking.

They matter to some people...

Me: No latins, making 160k at a V10
Fiance: Summa, making 160k at a V10

I say meh to latins and don't regret my lack of efforts

[run26.2]

So what's better to have - consistent grades or mixture of good and not so good? Does it help a lot to have an A, or does it hurt a lot to have an B-? I know it's too general of a question, but I just want some opinions/viewpoints.

Depends on who your audience is.

Firms: You can probably explain one B or B- in 1L and they'll share an anecdote about their crappy grade in x class as a law student and they'll remember you for being a real person (note: does not apply at all law firms). After 1L, law firms don't really care as long as you graduate without looking like a fool.

Judges: Current clerks have good grades and compare you to themselves, not just to the other applicants. If their grades were better than yours they'll laugh that you applied. If you're aiming for a competitive court you should be seeing A-, A, A+ a majority of the time. If you're more relaxed about where you want to clerk, you'll be fine with a good mix of grades.

Registrar: You should be consistently above the curve. One B- won't kill you, but getting a bunch of A-'s and B+'s isnt going to get you latins and if you aren't certain the A+ exists (bc you haven't gotten one) you probably wont be getting magna and you definitely aren't getting summa.

I would say having A- and B+s in equal proportion with As would probably get you cum laude.

[Veyron]

So what's better to have - consistent grades or mixture of good and not so good? Does it help a lot to have an A, or does it hurt a lot to have an B-? I know it's too general of a question, but I just want some opinions/viewpoints.

For OCI and clerkships, my understanding is they are taking out a calculator and figuring out what your GPA is, as if they were calculated like other law schools do. So it probably doesn't matter what the distribution is for those purposes, outside of the extent some employers or judges might like higher grades in certain classes. As I recall, one employer at OCI even posted in their bid area that they want a certain GPA, notwithstanding the fact that the school does not have GPAs.

Lots of employers do this but they don't always follow their own cutoffs. In fact, I would say that the often don't.

Also, you people obsessing over latin honors are fucked in the head. If you don't already have a job/clerkship lined up before you find out you should have spent less time studying and more time finding a job.

[Georgiana]

So what's better to have - consistent grades or mixture of good and not so good? Does it help a lot to have an A, or does it hurt a lot to have an B-? I know it's too general of a question, but I just want some opinions/viewpoints.

For OCI and clerkships, my understanding is they are taking out a calculator and figuring out what your GPA is, as if they were calculated like other law schools do. So it probably doesn't matter what the distribution is for those purposes, outside of the extent some employers or judges might like higher grades in certain classes. As I recall, one employer at OCI even posted in their bid area that they want a certain GPA, notwithstanding the fact that the school does not have GPAs.

Lots of employers do this but they don't always follow their own cutoffs. In fact, I would say that the often don't.

Also, you people obsessing over latin honors are fucked in the head. If you don't already have a job/clerkship lined up before you find out you should have spent less time studying and more time finding a job.

Bolded is true. Though if you're hoping to work for a few years then go clerk, latins can be helpful, but at that point connections are even more helpful.

Don't stress over your grades at this point. If you have a good mix of A-/B+/B you'll be fine for a firm job. If you have all B/B-, step up your game. If you have all A/A-, pat yourself on the back and do it again this semester. You're all smart people, that's why you're at Penn, don't let your grades dictate your self worth.

[run26.2]

You're all smart people, that's why you're at Penn, don't let your grades dictate your self worth.

This.

The legal profession is obsessed with rankings. No need to get caught up in it.

[No13baby]

Does anyone have any experience looking for West Coast jobs from Penn? I saw references earlier in the thread to CA regional interviews in LA, but I'm more interested in the Bay Area and (especially) the Pacific Northwest. I am definitely considering Penn, but I'm not sure if their east coast-y placement is due to self-selection or if it's difficult to get a west coast job due to lack of recruiting or other factors. I have zero interest in working in New York.

[Georgiana]

Does anyone have any experience looking for West Coast jobs from Penn? I saw references earlier in the thread to CA regional interviews in LA, but I'm more interested in the Bay Area and (especially) the Pacific Northwest. I am definitely considering Penn, but I'm not sure if their east coast-y placement is due to self-selection or if it's difficult to get a west coast job due to lack of recruiting or other factors. I have zero interest in working in New York.

They have regional interviews throughout CA, not just in LA. If you have ties to CA it shouldn't be too hard to find a job, but the bay area legal market isn't the most robust right now and I know a lot of people my year (aka OCI summer 2009) who struggled immensely to get into CA. I'm guessing it has improved, but someone who has done OCI more recently can weigh in.

[Smumps]

This thread is awesome.

I've read through most of it regarding housing information, but am a bit overwhelmed. I will explore during ASW in March, but would like a bit of direction before I randomly walk around the city.

Want
1. Studio
2. Be within 20 minutes of Penn via PubTran (I have a car, not sure if I'll bring it--how is parking?)
3. Pay $1000 or less a month
4. Not get killed on the way home
5. A building/area that's not falling apart.

I do not care too much if it's noisy, if it's near bars, etc.

Also -- how early can do places come available for a July/August move in? Would obviously LOVE to have something locked down in March, if that's possible.

Thanks in advance. I'll buy anyone that helps coffee! Or a beer! Woo. Go Penn.

[Georgiana]

This thread is awesome.

I've read through most of it regarding housing information, but am a bit overwhelmed. I will explore during ASW in March, but would like a bit of direction before I randomly walk around the city.

Want
1. Studio
2. Be within 20 minutes of Penn via PubTran (I have a car, not sure if I'll bring it--how is parking?)
3. Pay $1000 or less a month
4. Not get killed on the way home
5. A building/area that's not falling apart.

I do not care too much if it's noisy, if it's near bars, etc.

Also -- how early can do places come available for a July/August move in? Would obviously LOVE to have something locked down in March, if that's possible.

Thanks in advance. I'll buy anyone that helps coffee! Or a beer! Woo. Go Penn.

My studio at the Wellington (19th and Walnut) cost me $1000/month inclusive of utilities. They don't have a good website but you can call and set up an appointment, the prices may have gone up a little bit but she's usually willing to knock off a bit if you sign a 2 year lease and/or are a student.

[violaboy]

This thread is awesome.

I've read through most of it regarding housing information, but am a bit overwhelmed. I will explore during ASW in March, but would like a bit of direction before I randomly walk around the city.

Want
1. Studio
2. Be within 20 minutes of Penn via PubTran (I have a car, not sure if I'll bring it--how is parking?)
3. Pay $1000 or less a month
4. Not get killed on the way home
5. A building/area that's not falling apart.

I do not care too much if it's noisy, if it's near bars, etc.

Also -- how early can do places come available for a July/August move in? Would obviously LOVE to have something locked down in March, if that's possible.

Thanks in advance. I'll buy anyone that helps coffee! Or a beer! Woo. Go Penn.

I live in West Philly and love it. If you're in certain parts, you'll be completely safe. Studios this way tend to be about $600-700 or less, some including utilities. And you can park on the streets with a permit sticker for $35/yr (or something like that). If you want more specific areas/advice, feel free to PM.

[schween]

I'm told things got pretty wild today in one of the 1L constitutional law classes? From what I gather, a student got up while the prof was talking and started drawing female genitalia on the board...??? Was anyone present for this?

[r6_philly]

Seriously? No way.

I was on an interview, missed it if it actually happened.

[dabomb75]

I'm told things got pretty wild today in one of the 1L constitutional law classes? From what I gather, a student got up while the prof was talking and started drawing female genitalia on the board...??? Was anyone present for this?

lol awesome. Sadly not my section since we didn't have con law yesterday

[HeavenWood]

I'm told things got pretty wild today in one of the 1L constitutional law classes? From what I gather, a student got up while the prof was talking and started drawing female genitalia on the board...??? Was anyone present for this?

lol awesome. Sadly not my section since we didn't have con law yesterday

People do stupid shit. It happens.

[XxMVPxX]

Does latin even matter?

I guess I won't be clerking.

They matter to some people...

Me: No latins, making 160k at a V10
Fiance: Summa, making 160k at a V10

I say meh to latins and don't regret my lack of efforts

Sounds like you have a pretty nice setup lol, did you guys meet at Penn?

[Sherwood2014]

Pretty cool. . .I would think!

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1

[JDizzle2015]

Pretty cool. . .I would think!

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... slreturn=1

Tight. Thanks!

[XxMVPxX]

How do the new renovations look. The only thing I've been able to see is this rendering.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifZt5MW ... r_embedded

[r6_philly]

How do the new renovations look. The only thing I've been able to see is this rendering.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifZt5MW ... r_embedded

http://www.law.upenn.edu/blogs/news/arc ... a_law.html

[XxMVPxX]

http://www.law.upenn.edu/blogs/news/arc ... a_law.html

[absolutazn87]

How do the new renovations look. The only thing I've been able to see is this rendering.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifZt5MW ... r_embedded

http://www.law.upenn.edu/blogs/news/arc ... a_law.html

wow...so much wide-angle lens!!

[ACROOS170]

This question has probably been answered but I cannot find it. I was recently admitted to Penn and I assume that I won't receive any scholly offers. I'm deciding between Penn, Texas w/ In-State + 10k/yr, & Wash U @ Full. Right now, I am leaning toward Penn but the loans scare the hell outta me. I've run the numbers over 10 years and, as long as I landed a $150k+ job, it doesn't seem impossible.

I don't plan on placing in the bottom third but I don't think anybody does. How do people who score in the bottom third place in jobs? Is BigLaw out of the question? How do Penn grads do in Texas (assuming any actually want to come down here )?

Thanks in advance!!!!

[r6_philly]

This question has probably been answered but I cannot find it. I was recently admitted to Penn and I assume that I won't receive any scholly offers. I'm deciding between Penn, Texas w/ In-State + 10k/yr, & Wash U @ Full. Right now, I am leaning toward Penn but the loans scare the hell outta me. I've run the numbers over 10 years and, as long as I landed a $150k+ job, it doesn't seem impossible.

I don't plan on placing in the bottom third but I don't think anybody does. How do people who score in the bottom third place in jobs? Is BigLaw out of the question? How do Penn grads do in Texas (assuming any actually want to come down here )?

Thanks in advance!!!!

1/3 of the class do miss out on biglaw, but it's not strictly class rank based. There are a lot of factors that go into getting a biglaw job, having the grades only get you a good starting point, and having bad grades won't automatically sink you. So that said, I think going somewhere where you have the most chance of landing a biglaw job regardless of grades is the most prudent.